SBI, as a black man why do you think the "Great Society" had such an effect on black fathers and not white fathers?
Looks like Biden endorses "Burn it down", taking down statues, revising history, rioting, all that..
- Thread starter 22LR
- Start date
Pilt, I think this quote from Paul Johnson summarizes what Ostatedchi has been saying. That you appear to think it can’t apply to black men as easily as white might tell us more about your opinion of black men than you want us to know.
https://cafehayek.com/2020/07/bonus-quotation-of-the-day-489.html
Ponca Dan, how do you explain the existence and persistence of a racial wealth gap?
I wonder what all the black people were doing between 1780 and 1865 while all those penniless men with powerful brains were making their fortunes.
And "The War on Poverty."
I'm only 1/4 black. Except for Sub Saharan African nose and ears, I look more like my Irish mother. Then there's the birth marks I can cover with make up.
"If we can get this legislation through, we'll have n****** voting Democratic for the next 200 years." LBJ.
Welfare. A well paid colleague once lived across the street from family so the mother of his children wouldn't lose her government check and Medicaid.
Shauna won't marry one of the three fathers of her children so not to lose benefits. She works part time at Genie Car Wash so not to lose tax payer benefits. Genie would like her full time.
Pikt, I really like you a lot. But you have a maddening way about you. You pretend you know something the rest of us don’t know, but you won’t give out the information. Instead you try to “lead” us to your conclusion by asking questions that to us are irrelevant. If you have a point to make then make it! I oftentimes conclude you don’t have a point, don’t really know what you’re talking about, but feel compelled to pretend you have more knowledge and understanding about the subject than the rest of us and have fun pretending you’re leading us around by the nose just for the fun of it. If I’m mistaken I apologize. But you might take this gentle criticism to heart and consider changing your style to a less irritating approach.
So now let me answer your question. Most black people from 1780 to 1865 were living under the inhumane condition of slavery. And from 1865 for another hundred year were victims of Jim Crow laws. Jim Crow “laws.”
Laws, as in government enforced actions designed to “keep them in their place.” Much worse conditions than the Irish immigrants faced, to be sure, but once the Irish were freed from prejudicial shackles they joined the rest of society as they rose in wealth. There is no reason to believe blacks cannot do the same thing if the government would get the hell out of their way. I used to think the programs designed to encourage black progress were well intentioned. I don’t believe that any longer. They’re designed to encourage bureaucrat progress, blacks be damned.
Dan, the reason black people have less wealth than white people is not because of race neutral welfare policies, it is because of a legacy of slavery and racism.
I hope that was sufficiently direct.
Dan, do you contend that there is no legacy of poverty handed down to the progeny of Irish immigrants?
It is not solely because of the legacy of slavery and racism. It is also because of welfare policies, and in 2020 probably more because of the legacy of failed welfare policies.
As a second generation descendent of Irish immigrants I contend any poverty felt by an Irishman is probably as much if not more his fault than not.
Is this true? What is the mechanism by which the civil rights encouraged absentee fatherhood?
Of course it’s true. Can you explain why in the middle of the racism storm black families stuck together, but as it has faded the families broke up?
Last edited:
Excellent post and brings up the timeline that I had been hinting at. If you look at historical hurdles, white men have had the easiest path to success for the longest time in the US, then white women, then minorities. Thinking only of african americans, their starting point really was in the 1960’s, though we can debate as to when it was widely accepted (some could argue since the late 70’s to 80’s....not that long ago). A large proportion of our population is alive and well that were alive before the 60’s.
I agree that most welfare programs do nothing to bring people out of poverty. I would like to see money that is going in to those programs to be redirected to infrastructure and developing the community to be productive and give the best chance to thrive. Welfare on its own is not bad, when it is used as a bridge. Welfare as a way of life is detrimental. I look at what was “given to” native americans as repentance for taking their lands. I would be interested in Sunburnt’s thoughts here.
Weird. It seems like the more liberals try to help the more gas they throw on the fire.
I used to think democrats were stupid but good intentioned. It’s obvious in 2020 that the mayors of these cities and their puppeteers Are just out to make sure blacks are resented and to keep killing each other. Police brutality is not an alternative problem, it’s a red herring. How much worse can the circumstances get? Are you guys shooting for 10,000 blacks murdered? 70% of violent crimes? 90% fatherless households? At what benchmark are you willing to say you failed?
Agreed though I would direct you to the welfare reform of the 90s if you are concerned about welfare being a way of life
No because it is easier to work with agreed upon facts than for me to give you a bunch of links that your will not read.
I contend they are just as responsible if not more so than your hallowed “legacy of slavery.”
Well Dan, I would implore you to explain how a race neutral policy can be more responsible for racial wealth disparities than slavery.
And you think asking leading questions will result in us having “agreed upon facts?” Why do you need links? Just state your case in your own words.
Sure sounds a LOT like the arguments I've had with you about just posting links to other's opinions. Just saying.
I think that is an excellent point. By Pilt’s own timeline slavery in America ran from 1780 to 1865, or 85 years. Slavery has been outlawed in America for 155 years. Welfare started when? Roughly 1964-65? Let’s say 1965. So we’ve had welfare programs for the last 55 years. At what point is it fair to say we can drop the “legacy of slavery” meme and admit it has now become a legacy of welfare?
Not calling in the national guard 30 years ago to over police these communities and try to keep them safe.
not funding tech schools and incentivizing enrollment.
watching rich schools put in three pools while poor schools can’t keep the heat on.
defunding the police
Letting section 8 housing turn into the equivalent of South American slums
not supporting closing the border to latinos who are exploited off the books and take away jobs from Americans.
not starting local wpa programs
Republicans don’t care about blacks. Democrats actively try to harm them.
Bill Gates and Steve Jobs should have been mandated by the government to have black friends when coming up with Microsoft and Apple.
Yeah, I can be a hypocrite when it suits me.
I’m not certain they are. I won’t spout data because I don’t know any, but I suspect the wealth disparity between whites on welfare is about the same as blacks. If my suspicions are correct then it stands to reason the problem does not stem from race, but rather the policies that put them into a lifetime of welfare, regardless of race.
There were less than a million adults recieving TANF in 2018. More than half of that had been in the program for less than 2 years.
Well how about this one. How does can a race neutral welfare program produce racial disparities, even if it is ongoing.
It may not, but it is worth a try. I try to work from a consensus where possible.
