You can bet your a$$ war with Russia is coming.

[my_2cents]

In the ministry? Preaching?

Yep.

And you are right, there is a lot of hypocrisy in churches today. But churches are filled with imperfect people. Unfortunately, some sitting in the pews haven't figured that out.

btw, being in the ministry was one of the most political jobs I've had. It is tough being a minister today. Many only want to hear what they already think. Not a lot of desire for growth or change in some churches (not all, there are some good churches).

 

[my_2cents]

I don't understand how anyone who claims to believe in God would turn around and hurt a man simply because of his sexual orientation.

Well said!

Anyone who would do this isn't following God.

 

[my_2cents]

If a Christian can’t support a homosexual for moral reasons they can’t support Trump either. Trump’s morals are clearly pretty lacking, and he makes no apologies for it. What’s the difference?

Good point, but conservative Christians excuse away all of Trump "sins."

I have some religious friends who were outraged by the behavior of Bill Clinton back in the 1990s. Always going after him and talking about how he was setting a bad example. Yet, when Trump came along, silence. Heard of a lot of "well, he isn't a perfect person, but who among us is." As they then turn around and attack homosexuals, those who get abortions, etc.

 

[Medic007]

I have a Bachelor's degree in Political Science, a Master of Divinity degree (concentration in Missions, Evangelism, and Church Growth), a Master of Theology degree (concentration in Practical Theology), and a Juris Doctor degree.

What degrees do you have and what were your majors?

I laughed out loud. All of that "education" and not a single shred of common sense. You should get a refund, toon_cents.

 

[OUSOONER67]

Good point, but conservative Christians excuse away all of Trump "sins."

I have some religious friends who were outraged by the behavior of Bill Clinton back in the 1990s. Always going after him and talking about how he was setting a bad example. Yet, when Trump came along, silence. Heard of a lot of "well, he isn't a perfect person, but who among us is." As they then turn around and attack homosexuals, those who get abortions, etc.

Did Trump get a BJ in the Oval Office, stick a cigar up a young interns giney young enough to be his daughter and then lie about it under oath?

 

[Scottsdale.Sooner]

Yep.

And you are right, there is a lot of hypocrisy in churches today. But churches are filled with imperfect people. Unfortunately, some sitting in the pews haven't figured that out.

btw, being in the ministry was one of the most political jobs I've had. It is tough being a minister today. Many only want to hear what they already think. Not a lot of desire for growth or change in some churches (not all, there are some good churches).

I simply cannot fathom the decision making process that leads to pursing multiple degrees in a career path such as preaching.

 

[my_2cents]

Did Trump get a BJ in the Oval Office, stick a cigar up a young interns giney young enough to be his daughter and then lie about it under oath?

No, he just screwed porn stars, had affairs, and has been married three times.

btw, I don't care how many times a person has been married. But it is hilarious how holier-than-thou religious people ignore this (Clinton has only been married once).

But you just got to rush to Trump's defense, don't you? You sure need to defend your miserable scum of a politician all the time, instead of simply acknowledging how he is just like other politicians who sleep around.

 

[my_2cents]

I simply cannot fathom the decision making process that leads to pursing multiple degrees in a career path such as preaching.

What do you mean?

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

I would NEVER advocate violence against a homosexual. I support their 4th amendment rights.

I do not support them engaging in the regulated privilege of marriage or government acknowledgement as normal. Trans is a mental disorder that needs compassionate treatment to correct and bring the sufferer into alignment with their biological reality.

 

[OUSOONER67]

People have affairs all the time. Your partner is probably having one right now while you spend all day here gaslighting.
Trump wasn't Potus when he did the things you accuse him of. Clinton was and he lied about it under oath, HUGE DIFFERENCE.

 

[GunsOfFrankEaton]

 

[my_2cents]

I do not support them engaging in the regulated privilege of marriage or government acknowledgement as normal.

Why?

Trans is a mental disorder that needs compassionate treatment to correct and bring the sufferer into alignment with their biological reality.

At one time, homosexuality was also considered a mental disorder. Thank goodness we move away from that barbaric idea.

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

If a Christian can’t support a homosexual for moral reasons they can’t support Trump either. Trump’s morals are clearly pretty lacking, and he makes no apologies for it. What’s the difference?

I did not vote for Trump in 2016 for some of those very reasons. As for 2020 I saw no such failings during his term. I believe he had enough shame to understand his activities were inappropriate.

Buttwaszit is not only active but is a proponent. He has no shame in his sin.

I would have no problem with former gays after they have shown they will not relapse.

 

[Medic007]

Unfortunately, this is VERY plausible.

 

[OUSOONER67]

 

[my_2cents]

People have affairs all the time.

Yep. But if someone is going to criticize one politician over having an affair, they should also be willing to criticize another politician for doing the same thing. Instead of being a hypocrite and only getting upset when it is someone from the other political party doing it.

Trump wasn't Potus when he did the things you accuse him of. Clinton was and he lied about it under oath, HUGE DIFFERENCE.

So? Trump still did those things. And also, Clinton wasn't President when he had some of the affairs he was criticized for. Did he have an affair with Gennifer Flowers when he was President? Nope. Yet, Republicans went after him for it. Trump comes on the scene, crickets from those same Republicans.

Sorry, but your attempt at defending the "miserable scum" Trump is failing miserably here. He is just like Bill Clinton when it comes to women. Admit the truth for once.

btw, I agree Clinton lied under oath and that is why I supported his impeachment for that and obstruction of justice. Not for having an affair.

 

[Red Phoenix]

I did not vote for Trump in 2016 for some of those very reasons. As for 2020 I saw no such failings during his term. I believe he had enough shame to understand his activities were inappropriate.

Buttwaszit is not only active but is a proponent. He has no shame in his sin.

I would have no problem with former gays after they have shown they will not relapse.

What is a former gay?

Are you one of these people who believe in conversion therapy, which has been shown to be very hurtful to people?

 

[OUSOONER67]

Yep. But if someone is going to criticize one politician over having an affair, they should also be willing to criticize another politician for doing the same thing. Instead of being a hypocrite and only getting upset when it is someone from the other political party doing it.


So? Trump still did those things. And also, Clinton wasn't President when he had some of the affairs he was criticized for. Did he have an affair with Jennifer Flowers when he was President? Nope. Yet, Republicans went after him for it. Trump comes on the scene, crickets from those same Republicans.

Sorry, but your attempt at defending the "miserable scum" Trump is failing miserably here. He is just like Bill Clinton when it comes to women. Admit the truth for once.

btw, I agree Clinton lied under oath and that is why I supported his impeachment for that and obstruction of justice. Not for having an affair.

Stick to what I said you are wandering off gaslighting again, Clinton lied under oath about his with Lewinski. Try and keep up.

 

[OUSOONER67]

What is a former gay?

Are you one of these people who believe in conversion therapy, which has been shown to be very hurtful to people?

I know a guy that was a Former Gay. He turned his life around, started going to Church has a GF and put his past behind him.
Maybe he was confused, maybe he knew it was wrong, maybe he was just experimenting who knows but I do know he says he isn't anymore and I don't think he would lie about it. If you were out of the closet why go back in again to just hide it? Who knows really, only he does I guess.

 

[my_2cents]

Clinton lied under oath about his with Lewinski. Try and keep up.

No, you are just now moving the goal posts. We were talking about affairs. You now are trying to switch gears to talking about lying under oath because your attempted defense of "miserable scum" Trump's sexual history failed miserably.

Maybe go make another meme to make yourself feel better?!🤣🤣

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

What is a former gay?

Are you one of these people who believe in conversion therapy, which has been shown to be very hurtful to people?

Conversion yes therapy no.

 

[OUSOONER67]

No, you are just now moving the goal posts. We were talking about affairs. You now are trying to switch gears to talking about lying under oath because your attempted defense of "miserable scum" Trump's sexual history failed miserably.

Maybe go make another meme to make yourself feel better?!🤣🤣

I was talking about Clinton lying under oath about his and you want to go on and on about Trump like you always do. If you would stop gaslighting for one min you might be able to keep up with the adults.
Maybe go slap your Dad for not shooting you on the wall.

 

[SoonerRedYukon101]

Watch for incoming false flag cyber attack to be blamed on Russia. Just a hunch.

 

[Medic007]

I was talking about Clinton lying under oath about his and you want to go on and on about Trump like you always do. If you would stop gaslighting for one min you might be able to keep up with the adults.
Maybe go slap your Dad for not shooting you on the wall.

With his effeminate vibe, I doubt his dad could have shot him on the wall. 🤣🤣🤣

 

[Red Phoenix]

I know a guy that was a Former Gay. He turned his life around, started going to Church has a GF and put his past behind him.
Maybe he was confused, maybe he knew it was wrong, maybe he was just experimenting who knows but I do know he says he isn't anymore and I don't think he would lie about it. If you were out of the closet why go back in again to just hide it? Who knows really, only he does I guess.

Can't speak to this guy you speak of. Don't know what is going on with him or the societal pressures he may be experiencing.

All the homosexuals I know take great offense when someone implies they can change. They ask me if I can change my sexual orientation, and the answer to that is clearly no. I've also read horror stories of homosexuals who were forced to go through conversion therapy and how it really messed them up. Just not good in anyway.

When you said "maybe he knew it was wrong," were you implying it is wrong? Or just wrong from what ever sociatial pressures were being forced upon him?

 

[Red Phoenix]

Conversion yes therapy no.

Conversion how then?

 

[OUSOONER67]

With his effeminate vibe, I doubt his dad could have shot him on the wall. 🤣🤣🤣

 

[my_2cents]

I was talking about Clinton lying under oath about his and you want to go on and on about Trump like you always do. If you would stop gaslighting for one min you might be able to keep up with the adults.
Maybe go slap your Dad for not shooting you on the wall.

Whatever you need to tell yourself. We were having a conversation about sexual matters, you jumped in to defend Trump, and then shifted all the way to just trying to talk about his lying under oath.

I don't see anyone disagreeing that Clinton lied under oath. That wasn't relevant to anything.

 

[my_2cents]

I've also read horror stories of homosexuals who were forced to go through conversion therapy and how it really messed them up. Just not good in anyway.

Conversion therapy is awful. So sad that some parents put their children though that.

 

[Medic007]

Holy crap that's hilarious 67!!!! And since I've actually met you in person, this one is even funnier.

 

[OUSOONER67]

Can't speak to this guy you speak of. Don't know what is going on with him or the societal pressures he may be experiencing.

All the homosexuals I know take great offense when someone implies they can change. They ask me if I can change my sexual orientation, and the answer to that is clearly no. I've also read horror stories of homosexuals who were forced to go through conversion therapy and how it really messed them up. Just not good in anyway.

When you said "maybe he knew it was wrong," were you implying it is wrong? Or just wrong from what ever sociatial pressures were being forced upon him?

I don't know what happened to him, only he knows for sure but something changed him. I doubt it was societal pressure as he is in his 60's so I doubt he all of a sudden a few yrs ago started caring about what others thought. He made a life changing decision that only he could make.

I think a lot of things people do including mysef are wrong but thats on them like it is me. Everyone has to live their own life the way they see fit. I am no expert on anyones life let alone my own and its not any of my business who they choose to have sex with. People will always have a right to like or dislike whatever they so choose. I don't like dogs that bark all the time disrupting peoples right to peace and quiet in their own home but that doesn't mean I hate dogs.

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

Conversion how then?

I am not going back through every post but did you not claim to be a Christian?

How is it I have to explain this to a Christian?

Conversion to Christ via conviction of ones sins (homosexuality) repentance and an attempt to "go and sin no more."

Might I suggest Leviticus 22 and focus on the section regarding the temporal punishments for the offender and also for the society/country/land where such sin is accepted.

Grace can and should be be afforded the man IMHO. But society should condemn licentiousness and teach that it is wrong behavior.

NOT all sins are the same in the temporal sense. Nations have no soul and are punished in the temporal realm.

And before one makes the argument of OT laws

Romans 1

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

 

[OUSOONER67]

Whatever you need to tell yourself. We were having a conversation about sexual matters, you jumped in to defend Trump, and then shifted all the way to just trying to talk about his lying under oath.

I don't see anyone disagreeing that Clinton lied under oath. That wasn't relevant to anything.

You were having a gaslighting convo with yourself. See my convo with redphoenix thats how its done between 2 adults, not your gaslighting bs.

 

[OUSOONER67]

Its funny and ironic that the resident gaslighter here (no cents) claims Trumps behavior is toxic yet he doesn't realize gaslighting is one of the most toxic things that a person can do.
Does he also know thats what is called a hypocrite?

Thats spanish for Gaslighter puta.

 

[OUSOONER67]

Every damn time.

 

[Red Phoenix]

I am not going back through every post but did you not claim to be a Christian?

How is it I have to explain this to a Christian?

Conversion to Christ via conviction of ones sins (homosexuality) repentance and an attempt to "go and sin no more."

Might I suggest Leviticus 22 and focus on the section regarding the temporal punishments for the offender and also for the society/country/land where such sin is accepted.

Grace can and should be be afforded the man IMHO. But society should condemn licentiousness and teach that it is wrong behavior.

NOT all sins are the same in the temporal sense. Nations have no soul and are punished in the temporal realm.

And before one makes the argument of OT laws

Romans 1

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

Yes, I am a Christian.

So when someone converts, do they never sin again? Clearly they do. They may ask for forgiveness, but they keep right on sinning. Are you as concerns about all those sins as you are what you perceive to be that homosexual sin?

I know homosexual Christians. They converted to Christ but their sexual orientation remained the same. Are you going to judge them and claim they didn't really convert? I think they could do the same thing to you and I about the sins we commit after conversion.

As for the passage you quoted in Romans, I am no theologian but I know there are different interpretations to that passage. Here is one such interpretation:

Link

 

[OUSOONER67]

I bet when 2 pesos watches Wheel of Fortune he is wrong every single time because he thinks he knows what it really should say not what it actually says.

 

[Red Phoenix]

You were having a gaslighting convo with yourself. See my convo with redphoenix thats how its done between 2 adults, not your gaslighting bs.

I have no clue what you mean by gaslighting but I think @my_2cents made some good points about Trump and Clinton. Clearly, they both are similar with the affairs and stuff. If a Christian is going to condemn one for the affairs, they should do the same to the other. I agree with him on that.

You made a good point about lying under oath but from what I read, @my_2cents agreed with you on that.

As it seems to be common on this board, you both just talked right past each other. So afraid you might agree with one another!

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

Yes, I am a Christian.

So when someone converts, do they never sin again? Clearly they do. They may ask for forgiveness, but they keep right on sinning. Are you as concerns about all those sins as you are what you perceive to be that homosexual sin?

Nope! Its a biggie in the temporal realm.

See Leviticus 22s punishments on the land.

I know homosexual Christians. They converted to Christ but their sexual orientation remained the same. Are you going to judge them and claim they didn't really convert? I think they could do the same thing to you and I about the sins we commit after conversion.

Not my position.

But they should not advocate for normalization, marriage or acceptance of their sin if they are actively trying to be repentant and resist the sin.

As for the passage you quoted in Romans, I am no theologian but I know there are different interpretations to that passage. Here is one such interpretation:

Link

Seems straightforward to me.

 

[OUSOONER67]

I have no clue what you mean by gaslighting but I think @my_2cents made some good points about Trump and Clinton. Clearly, they both are similar with the affairs and stuff. If a Christian is going to condemn one for the affairs, they should do the same to the other. I agree with him on that.

You made a good point about lying under oath but from what I read, @my_2cents agreed with you on that.

As it seems to be common on this board, you both just talked right past each other. So afraid you might agree with one another!

No, he gaslights all the time and he did here in this thread. He likes to play his word game and implement his bs into your posts, twisting what you say and saying it means something else. He is an expert mind reader. 🤣