Down 1.5% from a year ago.
Dang those Trump tariffs are killing consumers.
Dang those Trump tariffs are killing consumers.
Whoops, price of imported products are FALLING.
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That’s interesting. I received an email from two of my largest vendors yesterday explaining that they had swallowed Trump’s 10% tariff from November, but on May 10th he’d added another 15%, which they can no longer absorb, so beginning next month there will be a 15% price increase on their products. Guess what I’m going to have to do when I sell to my customers.
Can we just take your word that all price increases are tariff related and also Trump's fault?
I only ask because it's my DUTY to question.
I only ask because it's my DUTY to question.
The Chinese economy can not afford to lose market share so they'll eat most of these tariffs.
What you tariffs are bad people apparently don't get is these tariffs are not punishment they are a negotiating tool and when a fair deal can be obtained they will go away.
You guys are willing to let these countries force American companies into one sided deals and steal our intellectual properties and technology.
Trumps is winning on this issue.
What you tariffs are bad people apparently don't get is these tariffs are not punishment they are a negotiating tool and when a fair deal can be obtained they will go away.
You guys are willing to let these countries force American companies into one sided deals and steal our intellectual properties and technology.
Trumps is winning on this issue.
You can take my word that my vendors are saying their price increases are tariff related. And since the tariffs are imposed by Trump alone you can believe it is Trump’s fault. Beyond that you can assume what you want about the relationship between any price increases and Trump’s tariffs. By the way, I appreciate that you feel the need to exercise your duty! I wish everyone questioned things like you do!
You’ll get no argument from me that Trump is winning on this issue, he most certainly is. He’s practicing economic voodoo (which is what any government interference is), and like most government interference in an economy it works until it quits working.
So for you the status quo is the way to go?
Trying a different approach is just foolishness?
For me the way to go is through unrelenting free trade by the USA. I don't know if that's the status quo or not, I suspect it is not. So I would say "no, the status quo is not the way to go."
So we do free trade but our trading partners don't. I'm to stupid to understand how this is fair to America.
When a government subsidizes one of its companies it is taxing its own citizens to do so. Those taxes are harmful to its own citizens, not to the consumers of another country who reap the benefits of the subsidy via lower consumer prices. Essentially the citizens of the subsidizing country are picking up part of the tab for the consumers of the other country. That is harmful to the people of the country in which the government has interfered in the machinations of the marketplace. The government is picking winners and losers rather than letting individual people make their choices freely. There is no harm to the citizens/consumers of the other country. If the government does not interfere in their options they are not harmed in the least. The citizens of the "free trade" country are not harmed, while those of the "interfering" country are.
When a government imposes a tariff on incoming goods the citizens of the country imposing the tariffs almost universally are paying for it. Maybe the companies that have imported the tariffed products will try to absorb the tariff, at least at first, in an attempt to maintain a competitive price point to the end user. But they are affecting their bottom line, and they have a duty toward their stockholders. So eventually they will pass the tariff on to their buyers, who will then pass the price increase to the end users. (That's what's happening to me and my company as we speak. And I sell a product that is already border-line too expensive for the average person. These tariffs may prove to be deadly to my industry, or at least a significant portion of it. My only belief is I survived Jimmy Carter, so hopefully I can survive Trump.) In other words a tariff is harmful to the citizens/consumers of the country whose government has interfered by imposing them. That country cannot lay claim to being a "free market" economy. Maybe it's mostly free market oriented, America remains mostly free market oriented. But with each passing day, with each successive presidential administration adding to its imperial power over the economy , we lose more and more claim to being free.
What makes you think people don't?
Do you just assume they don't because they don't happen to agree with you?
How hard is it for you to accept a compliment? Agreeing with me has nothing to do with anything. Surely you can see there are plenty of people that defend their team no matter what, really question nothing that might go against the narrative they have created in their minds. It’s blatantly obvious on both sides.
Yes when another country subsidizes products their tax payers pay but it also creates jobs for them and takes jobs away from other producing countries. Just because it creates a cheaper product doesn't mean it's a good thing. The Chinese want to dominate world markets. You don't think that is economically bad for America? How do you get them to play fair? What's your plan?
A global free market economy is nothing but a pipe dream.
I fail to grasp the virtue of being Chinas whipping boy year after year.
So, let's not be that anymore.
So, let's not be that anymore.
I refer you to the link I posted "Saying Something Most American Don't Want To Hear." It addresses many of the fears you have toward China. For one thing it points out that China is not "cheating" nearly to the extent we have been led to believe by the nationalists'/protectionists'/mercantilists' nonstop messaging. Most economists say that one country operating as a free market is in no trouble in dealing with another country that does not. That's because of the reasons I stated earlier. Any government that interferes with its own economy is harming itself, not others. As far as the concern about job losses I would ask you to look up the economic concept of "comparative advantage." Once you understand the concept (it's really more of an economic law) you will discover that your fear of job losses will dissipate. I'd love to keep talking, but it's 5 o'clock, and I'm rounding third and headed home!
Anecdotal anomalies notwithstanding, both statements can be true.
Oh no, if the grim reaper took me now, I wouldn't hate it.
Hell the post office raises their prices regularly while the service continues to go down. 5 cents more for a burrito I can handle and if you are lucky a free colon cleanse comes with it.
I thought I'd learn to tolerate, accept colonoscopies.Hell the post office raises their prices regularly while the service continues to go down. 5 cents more for a burrito I can handle and if you are lucky a free colon cleanse comes with it.
Eh, still waiting.
I thought I'd learn to tolerate, accept colonoscopies.
Eh, still waiting.
Eat some bad food every now and again you won't need a colonoscopy hence the free colon cleanse with a burrito.
Gas Station Sushi does the trick I hear.
As does Billy Sims BBQ.Eat some bad food every now and again you won't need a colonoscopy hence the free colon cleanse with a burrito.
Gas Station Sushi does the trick I hear.
Okay we really haven't lost jobs to China and Mexico we just don't understand how communities that have been decimated from basic manufacturing loss are actually better off.
Believe the experts don't believe your eyes. They've written peer reviewed papers and essays and books that prove they are smarter than us unwashed.
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Screw China. Nothing but cheap junk is made there and shipped here to cheat us out of our money. I can't tell you how many doorknobs and locks I have had to replace because the ones that were put in by the builder when our house was being built in 2010. Cheap metal parts inside the locks and deadbolts that were brittle, made from what I call potmetal or diecast metal. After figuring out it was the ones made in China that were the problem I looked for US made door locks and doorknobs, they were higher in price but since I replaced them they have given me no trouble at all. I am old enough to remember when a lot of what was imported back in the day was made in Japan and it was always quality.
Also many Companies in China are making fakes of just about every collectible or antique that has ever been made. Recently I noticed they are even making replica Purple Heart Medals among other things. You might think big deal so they are making fakes of collectible and antiques, well that directly affects people in the US that make their living dealing in original authentic stuff. Why buy an original authentic piece when you can buy a fake made in China knockoff for a lot less that was made to deceive and fool the gullible?
I do like me some dog and cat though.
And before you say thats bad to say, a Chinese Restaurant here was shut down years ago for doing just that.
Also many Companies in China are making fakes of just about every collectible or antique that has ever been made. Recently I noticed they are even making replica Purple Heart Medals among other things. You might think big deal so they are making fakes of collectible and antiques, well that directly affects people in the US that make their living dealing in original authentic stuff. Why buy an original authentic piece when you can buy a fake made in China knockoff for a lot less that was made to deceive and fool the gullible?
I do like me some dog and cat though.
And before you say thats bad to say, a Chinese Restaurant here was shut down years ago for doing just that.
Why don't you follow your beliefs that the wealthy should not make profits and eat the increase yourself?
I have no idea where you got that idea. Certainly not from anything I have ever written on this board.
I am facing a loooong day at work today, so I can't participate in the conversation after this. But I have some scattershot ideas floating around in my head, things some of you may find interesting to ponder.
1) The mercantilist philosophy practiced by Trump and his economic team insists that trade deficits are horrible, that America is getting screwed. A trade consists of one participant exchanging money for goods or services. The mercantilist philosophy argues that the participant that receives the money is the winner, and the participant that receives the goods and services is the loser.
Let's apply that to an individual circumstance. I hired a chiropractor to come to my office once a week to crush my bones. He provides a service I could not do without. Before him I was bent at the waist at about a 45 degree angle, and my body was stiff as a board. He trades his services with me in exchange for the money I pay him. Applying the mercantilist philosophy that the winner is the person that gets the money, and the loser is the one who gets the goods or services, my chiropractor wins and I lose. Right now I am suffering a huge trade deficit with him. Should I petition the government to require him to buy an equal amount (dollar wise) of my goods?
2) The mercantilist philosophy says a country only wins when it has more imports than exports. If both countries involved in an exchange practice mercantilism, how can anything ever be resolved? They both refuse to import less than they export.
3) Trump insists the trade deficit is responsible for job losses in America. Yet the trade deficit is larger now than when he took office and began implementing his trade wars, but the unemployment rate is setting record lows. How does the rhetoric reconcile with the reality?
4) I suspect most of you would say you are capitalists, not socialists, that capitalism is a vastly superior way for an economy to work. But then you say free markets can work only if both countries practice free trade. You are concerned that the authoritarian-run economy will overwhelm the capitalist one. How does an inferior economic system overwhelm a superior one? By publicizing your fear you are betraying your belief that capitalism is superior. You show remarkably little confidence in what you claim to be a superior way of doing things.
5) Some on this board are upset that China has stolen America's technologies/inventions, reproduced it cheaper than it can be done in America and have sold "stolen" goods back to our consumers. I would ask that you define your terms. What, exactly do you mean by stolen, and would you please give specific examples of the ways and means of how those technologies were stolen? For example, did the Chinese government slip in some super-sleuth ninjas to penetrate a corporation's headquarters and tap into their computers and make off with its secrets? I'm curious exactly how this theft took place, and maybe you could give me a true-life example or two of what was stolen, how it was stolen, and how it made its was back to our shores. I'm not disputing your claim, I just would like to know how this theft was accomplished without international repercussion. Surely if they did it to American companies they have done it to companies from other countries. How are these other countries responding?
6) From roughly 1790 to roughly 1890, about one century, America was an example of a country that practiced free trade, while most of the rest of the world was still involved in mercantilism. In that century America went from a fairly poor, debtor nation into the unquestioned most prosperous society in human history. The free market society surpassed all the top-down economies in blinding speed. If the mercantilist/protectionist/nationalist philosophy is a better way of doing things, as Trump and his economic team say, how did a free market America achieve such roaring prosperity in the face of the mercantilist opposition?
Hell, I've got about a thousand more things I could say or ask, but now it's time to get to work. Nobody needs to respond to this missive, unless you want. I won't be here to reply. Have a great day, and a great weekend!
1) The mercantilist philosophy practiced by Trump and his economic team insists that trade deficits are horrible, that America is getting screwed. A trade consists of one participant exchanging money for goods or services. The mercantilist philosophy argues that the participant that receives the money is the winner, and the participant that receives the goods and services is the loser.
Let's apply that to an individual circumstance. I hired a chiropractor to come to my office once a week to crush my bones. He provides a service I could not do without. Before him I was bent at the waist at about a 45 degree angle, and my body was stiff as a board. He trades his services with me in exchange for the money I pay him. Applying the mercantilist philosophy that the winner is the person that gets the money, and the loser is the one who gets the goods or services, my chiropractor wins and I lose. Right now I am suffering a huge trade deficit with him. Should I petition the government to require him to buy an equal amount (dollar wise) of my goods?
2) The mercantilist philosophy says a country only wins when it has more imports than exports. If both countries involved in an exchange practice mercantilism, how can anything ever be resolved? They both refuse to import less than they export.
3) Trump insists the trade deficit is responsible for job losses in America. Yet the trade deficit is larger now than when he took office and began implementing his trade wars, but the unemployment rate is setting record lows. How does the rhetoric reconcile with the reality?
4) I suspect most of you would say you are capitalists, not socialists, that capitalism is a vastly superior way for an economy to work. But then you say free markets can work only if both countries practice free trade. You are concerned that the authoritarian-run economy will overwhelm the capitalist one. How does an inferior economic system overwhelm a superior one? By publicizing your fear you are betraying your belief that capitalism is superior. You show remarkably little confidence in what you claim to be a superior way of doing things.
5) Some on this board are upset that China has stolen America's technologies/inventions, reproduced it cheaper than it can be done in America and have sold "stolen" goods back to our consumers. I would ask that you define your terms. What, exactly do you mean by stolen, and would you please give specific examples of the ways and means of how those technologies were stolen? For example, did the Chinese government slip in some super-sleuth ninjas to penetrate a corporation's headquarters and tap into their computers and make off with its secrets? I'm curious exactly how this theft took place, and maybe you could give me a true-life example or two of what was stolen, how it was stolen, and how it made its was back to our shores. I'm not disputing your claim, I just would like to know how this theft was accomplished without international repercussion. Surely if they did it to American companies they have done it to companies from other countries. How are these other countries responding?
6) From roughly 1790 to roughly 1890, about one century, America was an example of a country that practiced free trade, while most of the rest of the world was still involved in mercantilism. In that century America went from a fairly poor, debtor nation into the unquestioned most prosperous society in human history. The free market society surpassed all the top-down economies in blinding speed. If the mercantilist/protectionist/nationalist philosophy is a better way of doing things, as Trump and his economic team say, how did a free market America achieve such roaring prosperity in the face of the mercantilist opposition?
Hell, I've got about a thousand more things I could say or ask, but now it's time to get to work. Nobody needs to respond to this missive, unless you want. I won't be here to reply. Have a great day, and a great weekend!
That's just clumsy dumbshittery in a thread where there are actually good points on both sides. Nobody can have an above board discussion with you.
You're just a troll, aren't you? And not a particularly entertaining or creative one. No conversations allowed without you injecting the drooling redneck.
So again, you are good with stolen Intellectual Property being sold back to us. Just say it. I makes you playing dumb about it or giving it tacit disapproval look more honest if you simply say you think it's okay as long as the consumer benefits.
Chinese sponsored 1.5 Billion in battery tech stolen in Bartlesville OK this past Dec. (I might have some first hand knowledge of this one)
Chinese PLA Unit 61398 (APT10) is a cyber unit of their government caught in many industrial espionage works.
When Pokemon GO came out we were warned that Chinese spies were caught in industrial areas using that as the excuse to take pictures in secured areas.
I've hired FBI agents to give presentation about industrial espionage and they have many examples.
Chinese sponsored agents stole new flame resistant insulation tech.
Chinese agents stole plans on how to create better lubricants.
Wind turbine tech
Wireless tech
Networking code
Nuclear tech from the TVA
Solar Cell tech
Network firewall tech
computer chip making info from Micron
The entire Huawei company was built on stolen tech
Look up the Sinovel case
Apple, Tesla, all have had property taken
It isn't just IP theft. Eighty-seven percent of seized counterfeit goods imported into the U.S. were manufactured in China and Hong Kong. In general, this massive market comes as a result of manufacturers reverse-engineering foreign companies’ trademarked, patented, and copyrighted materials.
The examples are so numerous that any ignorance on your part has to be willful because you endorse this theft.
Just google 'examples of Chinese intellectual property theft hack'.
That’s not his field. Cheap labor and construction materials are. Weird how that aligns with his positions.
And I don't expect him to return to this thread and answer my post directly. He'll obfuscate or ask some strange ancillary question that isn't germane to the conversation to anyone but him. That way he can justify his intellectual superiority to us fools.
@Ponca Dan come on. I see you've come back. Why no reply? Surely you aren't going to bitch out and abandon this thread.
@Ponca Dan Ponca Dan was last seen: Viewing thread New Commit Per Twitter, 2 minutes ago
Come on Dan. I know this is a passion for you. So why the delay in responding? Actually looking up some of the theft I posted about so you'll be educated on the topic when you reply?
Come on Dan. I know this is a passion for you. So why the delay in responding? Actually looking up some of the theft I posted about so you'll be educated on the topic when you reply?
Seems like they too want to traffic in stolen goods.
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No, I’m not abandoning this thread. I’ll get to it in my own time. No, I’m not looking up anything in a desperate attempt to refute you.
You should be. Or you are actually going to change your mind and agree that the only effective way to combat this is with tariffs or outright embargoes or moratoriums on importing Chinese products?
Time constraints being what they are for the next couple of days I’m going to piecemeal my replies to you. Let me begin by replying to this statement from you.
I do not condone theft at any time, by anyone, for any reason. I have never said I condone theft and have never hinted at it. For some reason you have confused my opposition to mercantilism as Trump practices it via tariffs as my support for the theft of technology by the Chinese government. As long as you harbor such a foolish thought we can’t really have a serious conversation about the topic.
I am happy to discuss political topics with just about anyone at any time. I have not shied away from presenting my viewpoint and politely listening to an opposing one. I understand my views are considered to be somewhat oddball by some of you because you are hearing points from me that rarely fit the narrative of what you think of when you think of an “enemy.” In your own words I am posing “ancillary questions,” questions you might not have pondered in the past and therefore fumble around when seeking refutation. Oftentimes in your case your response comes in the form of emotional outbursts complete with insults. You have said before you believe I think you are intellectually inferior to me. I have never said anything that could objectively be viewed as such. What I do think, on the other hand, is not that you lack in intelligence, but rather in maturity. It is very difficult to want to have a conversation with someone who so often acts as a teenager.
Now, I’m headed back to my “real life,” the non-political one. I intend to enjoy my family this weekend. I wish the same to you. I’ll check back in as time permits to reply to your more cogent comments.
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