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CP v Willie on hodge

april racer

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Dec 20, 2011
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First I will start with if Retherford would have won I would have been disappointed for AD, but I would have understood that choice. CP and Willie have gone back and forth on this a few times including on this mornings FRL. CPs main point is that the voters ignored the criteria and voted AD based on career when it states that it is a yearly award.

Without looking I believe the first 4 criteria are record, pins, mat domination and quality of competition. The last three are heart, citizenship, and past credentials.

I am going to ignore heart and citizenship since they are ridiculous to try to judge unless someone did something outrageous. I will note that on takedown radios talk on the subject they through in commitment to religion which I think has no place in this discussion.

Past credentials clearly goes to AD, but is a bit unfair to Retherford due to him only being a sophomore.

Likewise I would say quality of competition goes to Retherford, but once again is a bit unfair to AD since he can only beat the people he faces, which he did for the past two years without fail. He never sucked anyone.

They are both equal on record, undefeated.

Pins is a slight edge to Retherford, 15 to 12, but similar.

Mat domination is the one that I'm curious about and is a bit vague. I'm assuming it is different that pins or they would be thrown together. To me it seems as if it is more a nod to folkstyle. I think that this is where AD separates himself. He is always riding and working for the pin. He rarely gives up on his ride. I would like to see that stats of how many escapes he allowed. He easily could have played the TD and release game, but was always working from the top position. I think Retherford could as well, but he seems to have a tendency to release and TD again, which is really fm to watch, but I think it gives the nod to AD in mat domination.
 
Mat domination is in clear favor of Dieringer!

Not only did he demolish everybody but Lewis in route to a 3rd Title, but he did so by avenging the close match with Lewis and only gave up one offensive score the entire year. The one TD he gave up was in an attempt at bonus for his team. He also cleared out the weight...nobody wanted to be at 65 outside of Marstellar.

Imo, you can't penalize him for guys avoiding him and not Wrestling him.

However, Retherford was justified to win it also.
 
You have to take into consideration the CP is one of the biggest Penn St homers I have ever seen.
He seems to be first and foremost a wrestling fan. He always came across to me as a disgruntled Iowa fan that uses PSU to tweak other Iowa fans/coaches. Either that or he has decided that his career path requires him to attach to Cael's caboose. Either way, he is not standard PSU fan. Just my take on reading him over the years.
 
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Mat domination is the one that I'm curious about and is a bit vague. I'm assuming it is different that pins or they would be thrown together. To me it seems as if it is more a nod to folkstyle. I think that this is where AD separates himself. He is always riding and working for the pin. He rarely gives up on his ride. I would like to see that stats of how many escapes he allowed. He easily could have played the TD and release game, but was always working from the top position. I think Retherford could as well, but he seems to have a tendency to release and TD again, which is really fm to watch, but I think it gives the nod to AD in mat domination.
An interesting point you make about catch and release. For some of the elite guys, catch and release appears to be an alternative to wearing your opponent out from top position, and is a strategy in itself. In several interviews, Zain and Nolf seem to indicate without directly stating it that if they are having difficulty in turning an opponent from top and if they are superior on their feet, they play catch and release to tire the opponent out. Then when they return to mat wrestling, it is much easier to get a pinning combo. Nolf is especially good at this. I don't see your guys wrestle enough to know who on your team may do this.

So not disagreeing with your overall point, but thought I'd mention how catch and release could be seen in broad terms as a very loose extension of mat wrestling for the upper echelon of guys.
 
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retherford will get it soon enough. Lets say they gave it to Retherford this year and AD never got one. How would that look if 10 years from now you look back at past Hodge winners and you don't see ADs name on the list? That would cause a lot of people to scratch their heads. The winners should also stand the test of time. Its why Roger Maris isn't a member of the Hall of Fame but steady Eddie Murray is. And no one complains.
 
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