ADVERTISEMENT

Thanks Joe, but no...

“it is not my intention to stay there for a long time. But the question is: How and in what circumstances do we meet that agreement that was made by President Trump to leave under a deal that looks like it’s not being able to be worked out to begin with? How is that done?”


The chickensh!ts on this board won’t admit this calamity…

carry on
 
Can't wait...

So tweets before he was president and before he had any breifings on the situation can be held against a person. You realize that Biden has a treasure trove of info with many, many years of public service.
Yes. He had no problem ripping democrats without full knowledge at his disposal, he enver recanted to my knowledge, either. I mean, the wall, repeal and replace, infrastructure.... it's not lke Trump took his promises and public positions real serious once he got in office. He also did a deal to get us out while in office but never followed through.

I still don't know the specific criticism of Biden -- was he supposed to be in Afghanistan coordinating the planes and refugees, too? It's pretty amazing the free pass Trump gets for doing nothing, then everyone bitches at the guy who got us out.
 
  • Sad
Reactions: CoastGuardCowboy

Trump Strikes a Deal​

Biden Follows Through​

March 25 — During a press conference at the White House, Biden says “it’s going to be hard to meet the May 1 deadline. Just in terms of tactical reasons, it’s hard to get those troops out.” He assures that “if we leave, we’re going to do so in a safe and orderly way.” Without committing to a pullout date, Biden says, “it is not my intention to stay there for a long time.

April 14 — Saying it is “time to end the forever war,” Biden announces that all troops will be removed from Afghanistan by Sept. 11.

Biden says he “inherited a diplomatic agreement” between the U.S. and the Taliban that all U.S. forces would be out by May 1. “It is perhaps not what I would have negotiated myself, but it was an agreement made by the United States government, and that means something,” Biden says, adding that final troop withdrawal would begin on May 1.

“We will not conduct a hasty rush to the exit,” Biden says. “We’ll do it responsibly, deliberately, and safely.” Biden assures Americans that the U.S. has “trained and equipped a standing force of over 300,000 Afghan personnel” and that “they’ll continue to fight valiantly, on behalf of the Afghans, at great cost.”

April 15 — In response to Biden’s decision to delay full withdrawal until Sept. 11, the Taliban releases a statement that says failure to complete the withdrawal by May 1 “opens the way for [the Taliban] to take every necessary countermeasure, hence the American side will be held responsible for for all future consequences.”

April 18 — In a released statement, Trump criticizes Biden’s Sept. 11 withdrawal deadline saying, “we can and should get out earlier.” He concludes, “Getting out of Afghanistan is a wonderful and positive thing to do. I planned to withdraw on May 1st, and we should keep as close to that schedule as possible.”

July 6 — The U.S. military confirms it has pulled out of Bagram Airfield, its largest airfield in the Afghanistan, as the final withdrawal nears.

July 8 — Saying “speed is safety,” Biden moves up the timeline for full troop withdrawal to Aug. 31. Biden acknowledges the move comes as the Taliban “is at its strongest militarily since 2001.” Biden says if he went back on the agreement that Trump made, the Taliban “would have again begun to target our forces” and that “staying would have meant U.S. troops taking casualties. … Once that agreement with the Taliban had been made, staying with a bare minimum force was no longer possible.”

Biden assures Americans that a Taliban takeover of Afghanistan “is not inevitable,” and denies that U.S. intelligence assessed that the Afghan government would likely collapse.

Aug. 15 — Taliban fighters enter the Afghanistan capital Kabul; the Afghan president flees the country; U.S. evacuates diplomats from its embassy by helicopter.
 
March 25 — During a press conference at the White House, Biden says “it’s going to be hard to meet the May 1 deadline. Just in terms of tactical reasons, it’s hard to get those troops out.” He assures that “if we leave, we’re going to do so in a safe and orderly way.” Without committing to a pullout date, Biden says, “it is not my intention to stay there for a long time.

April 14 — Saying it is “time to end the forever war,” Biden announces that all troops will be removed from Afghanistan by Sept. 11.

Biden says he “inherited a diplomatic agreement” between the U.S. and the Taliban that all U.S. forces would be out by May 1. “It is perhaps not what I would have negotiated myself, but it was an agreement made by the United States government, and that means something,” Biden says, adding that final troop withdrawal would begin on May 1.

“We will not conduct a hasty rush to the exit,” Biden says. “We’ll do it responsibly, deliberately, and safely.” Biden assures Americans that the U.S. has “trained and equipped a standing force of over 300,000 Afghan personnel” and that “they’ll continue to fight valiantly, on behalf of the Afghans, at great cost.”

April 15 — In response to Biden’s decision to delay full withdrawal until Sept. 11, the Taliban releases a statement that says failure to complete the withdrawal by May 1 “opens the way for [the Taliban] to take every necessary countermeasure, hence the American side will be held responsible for for all future consequences.”

April 18 — In a released statement, Trump criticizes Biden’s Sept. 11 withdrawal deadline saying, “we can and should get out earlier.” He concludes, “Getting out of Afghanistan is a wonderful and positive thing to do. I planned to withdraw on May 1st, and we should keep as close to that schedule as possible.”

July 6 — The U.S. military confirms it has pulled out of Bagram Airfield, its largest airfield in the Afghanistan, as the final withdrawal nears.

July 8 — Saying “speed is safety,” Biden moves up the timeline for full troop withdrawal to Aug. 31. Biden acknowledges the move comes as the Taliban “is at its strongest militarily since 2001.” Biden says if he went back on the agreement that Trump made, the Taliban “would have again begun to target our forces” and that “staying would have meant U.S. troops taking casualties. … Once that agreement with the Taliban had been made, staying with a bare minimum force was no longer possible.”

Biden assures Americans that a Taliban takeover of Afghanistan “is not inevitable,” and denies that U.S. intelligence assessed that the Afghan government would likely collapse.

Aug. 15 — Taliban fighters enter the Afghanistan capital Kabul; the Afghan president flees the country; U.S. evacuates diplomats from its embassy by helicopter.
Zoom out to say 2013 and give us the blow-by-blow if you can...

I want to understand how with 6+ years to build a strong Afghan military the country fell so quickly to the Taliban. Why were those "surges" from Trump and Obama such failures? How does that translate to a Biden failure?

You can nitpick the last 5 months if you like, seems a bit short-sighted to me.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Syskatine
Who is us? I'm pretty sure there are still US citizens stuck still and lots of afghanis that helped us for years.


What do you think the number is today of US Citizens "stuck" in Afghanistan? A damn shame more Afhanis who supported the US weren't evacuated.
 
What do you think the number is today of US Citizens "stuck" in Afghanistan? A damn shame more Afhanis who supported the US weren't evacuated.
I don't know , there is more than 100 to 200 which is what the admin says there was left. I read some senate reports from the hearings but those were all over the place. From 14000 to 5400 to 4000 .
 
I don't know , there is more than 100 to 200 which is what the admin says there was left. I read some senate reports from the hearings but those were all over the place. From 14000 to 5400 to 4000 .
It is a mark of shame that so many GOP leaders have been undermining/opposing the Afghan P-2 Program. That includes Andy Biggs, Lauren Boebert, Mo Brooks, Paul Gosar, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Oklahoma's very own Kevin Hern, Thomas Massie, Chip Roy - among others. SMH. What a bunch of asshats.

 
Zoom out to say 2013 and give us the blow-by-blow if you can...

I want to understand how with 6+ years to build a strong Afghan military the country fell so quickly to the Taliban. Why were those "surges" from Trump and Obama such failures? How does that translate to a Biden failure?

You can nitpick the last 5 months if you like, seems a bit short-sighted to me.

In a briefing with then-Afghanistan President Ashraf Ghani on April 9, 2021, security officials delivered a major piece of news: The U.S. was planning to announce a full military withdrawal. But Ghani ignored the information after the then-vice president told him it was a “U.S. plot.”
I don't think the communication was the best.
 
How does that translate to a Biden failure?
Well, david, the factual timeline I posted is pretty clear, is it not? There's more in that link if you need additional clarification.

Biden's sorry ass attempt for some cheesey symbolic political win by delaying the withdrawal to Sept 11 (hopefully you don't think that date was chosen at random) got people killed, including US troops. The Taliban even warned it would happen. In my book that's a failure 100 out of 100 times.
 
Well, david, the factual timeline I posted is pretty clear, is it not? There's more in that link if you need additional clarification.

Biden's sorry ass attempt for some cheesey symbolic political win by delaying the withdrawal to Sept 11 (hopefully you don't think that date was chosen at random) got people killed, including US troops. The Taliban even warned it would happen. In my book that's a failure 100 out of 100 times.
Is it your position that the original date in May was doable? What is that presumption based on other than projection?

Why didn't the US leave a year or two earlier?
 
It is a mark of shame that so many GOP leaders have been undermining/opposing the Afghan P-2 Program. That includes Andy Biggs, Lauren Boebert, Mo Brooks, Paul Gosar, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Oklahoma's very own Kevin Hern, Thomas Massie, Chip Roy - among others. SMH. What a bunch of asshats.

Got it. Let's change up the argument. It's like you're trying to be a boxer. Bob and weave
 
Got it. Let's change up the argument. It's like you're trying to be a boxer. Bob and weave
Just an interesting aside related to your concern that we didn't do enough to help our Afghani allies. I stick with my point - Biden marginally exceeded expectations by getting us out of Afghanistan. Feel free to argue against that if you like.
 
Just an interesting aside related to your concern that we didn't do enough to help our Afghani allies. I stick with my point - Biden marginally exceeded expectations by getting us out of Afghanistan. Feel free to argue against that if you like.
Funny do you need a visa? Biden has no borders. Just come on in the doors open.
 
Is it your position that the original date in May was doable? What is that presumption based on other than projection?

Why didn't the US leave a year or two earlier?
I don't know why the US didn't leave a year or two earlier, or even earlier as was promised by Barry (complete withdrawal within 16 months of taking office). We should have never invaded the effing place to begin with. I'm not a fan of killing a bunch innocent people for the wrongdoings of a few.

Did you review the timeline? There were only 2,500 US troops left in January 2021 so yeah, I think May 1 was doable.

Why did the Biden administration postpone the withdrawal date from May 1 to Sept 11? Why that date in particular? Why not May 31st, or June 23rd, or July 12th, or August 9th, or August 28th? Was a magical "it's doable" switch going to appear on Sept 11? Did we even make it to Biden’s postponed planned date? Why not?

And why did Biden lie to the American people about the impending Afghanistan government collapse? Or was the Biden administration actually so clueless as to not see that coming?

I'm very interested in your answers to those questions.
 
Did you review the timeline? There were only 2,500 US troops left in January 2021 so yeah, I think May 1 was doable.
I reviewed the timeline. I suspect May was simply too early in a new administration to review such a complex operation. Given the prior administration, I am certain they wanted to do a complete review.
Why did the Biden administration postpone the withdrawal date from May 1 to Sept 11? Why that date in particular? Why not May 31st, or June 23rd, or July 12th, or August 9th, or August 28th? Was a magical "it's doable" switch going to appear on Sept 11? Did we even make it to Biden’s postponed planned date? Why not?
They were overly cute with the date no doubt.
And why did Biden lie to the American people about the impending Afghanistan government collapse? Or was the Biden administration actually so clueless as to not see that coming?
Wishful thinking?
 
I don't know why the US didn't leave a year or two earlier, or even earlier as was promised by Barry (complete withdrawal within 16 months of taking office). We should have never invaded the effing place to begin with. I'm not a fan of killing a bunch innocent people for the wrongdoings of a few.

Did you review the timeline? There were only 2,500 US troops left in January 2021 so yeah, I think May 1 was doable.

Why did the Biden administration postpone the withdrawal date from May 1 to Sept 11? Why that date in particular? Why not May 31st, or June 23rd, or July 12th, or August 9th, or August 28th? Was a magical "it's doable" switch going to appear on Sept 11? Did we even make it to Biden’s postponed planned date? Why not?

And why did Biden lie to the American people about the impending Afghanistan government collapse? Or was the Biden administration actually so clueless as to not see that coming?

I'm very interested in your answers to those questions.
This will take some intensive google research.
 
They were overly cute with the date no doubt.
That's actually your take? Overly cute? There are some dead people's families that probably don't think it was "overly cute" and I 100% agree with them.

Well, did we make the "overly cute" Sept 11 date Biden set?
 
That's actually your take? Overly cute? There are some dead people's families that probably don't think it was "overly cute" and I 100% agree with them.

Well, did we make the "overly cute" Sept 11 date Biden set?
Yes. We left before the symbolic date. With too high a cost. But we finally got out.

What was the alternative you would have had Biden implement?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Syskatine
I suspect May was simply too early in a new administration to review such a complex operation. Given the prior administration, I am certain they wanted to do a complete review.
And I suspect you're about as correct about this as you are about Morgan Freeman wanting more Black history months.
 
Yes. We left before the symbolic date. With too high a cost. But we finally got out.

What was the alternative you would have had Biden implement?
Not eff up the withdrawal. It's pretty simple really. He should have worked his ass off to meet the May 1 date or set a new date that was reasonable and not politically motivated. The last thing the Afghanistan withdrawal needed after 20 years was a postponement to a symbolic date that was well after the agreed upon withdrawal date. It's almost as if the results were...predictable.
 
Not eff up the withdrawal. It's pretty simple really. He should have worked his ass off to meet the May 1 date or set a new date that was reasonable and not politically motivated. The last thing the Afghanistan withdrawal needed after 20 years was a postponement to a symbolic date that was well after the agreed upon withdrawal date. It's almost as if the results were...predictable.
So I understand your point. Don't **** it up, but hustle your ass off to meet an arbitrary date that someone else set because we've been there for 20 years. That sum it up?
 
So I understand your point. Don't **** it up, but hustle your ass off to meet an arbitrary date that someone else set because we've been there for 20 years. That sum it up?
Well, you see, there was this agreement with some other people centered around the May 1 withdrawal date. I know you hate facts, but that's one that's kinda important to this story.

There were plenty of days that occurred between May 1 and the newly proposed Sept 11 date. Once again, why was it necessary to postpone that date to one with a particular symbolic importance as opposed to all the other days in between? You seem to be struggling to answer that very simple question.
 
Well, you see, there was this agreement with some other people centered around the May 1 withdrawal date. I know you hate facts, but that's one that's kinda important to this story.

There were plenty of days that occurred between May 1 and the newly proposed Sept 11 date. Once again, why was it necessary to postpone that date to one with a particular symbolic importance as opposed to all the other days in between? You seem to be struggling to answer that very simple question.
You are kinda starting to spin in circles. I've addressed the date question a couple of different ways - what don't you understand there?
 
You are kinda starting to spin in circles. I've addressed the date question a couple of different ways - what don't you understand there?
Have you? Let's see your quotes. Should we start with the one where you described the date thing as "overly cute?"
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT