i will take vacation days and walk the streets in protest
- Thread starter HighStickHarry
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
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More white people listen to rap than minorities. Fact.
If it has such a strong influence, why isn't it causing more violence in white communities?
If it has such a strong influence, why isn't it causing more violence in white communities?
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
http://atlantablackstar.com/2014/11/06/really-listening/
I like this one because it tries to dispute an 80% (white) number given by NEWSWEEK but still leaves it as a majority for white listeners.
What it actually says is that nobody has any idea. The only demographic data that is collected in the music industry seems to be via advertising.
But if that kind of article is "fact" to you, have at it.
If you watch the video I posted you'll actually see what I'm referring to. I'm not referring to mainstream "rap" music. What I'm referring to is the likes of what I posted. There's a reason that stuff isn't mainstream, but not being mainstream has no effect on availability any longer.
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
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http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB111521814339424546
Another. And ad stats make up a HUGE amount of information.
And FFS, you can't move the target now.
Another. And ad stats make up a HUGE amount of information.
And FFS, you can't move the target now.
Once again, nothing useful but anecdote and some strange marketing thing. And I'm not the one who said "rap," so you're quite a bit off on the "moving the target" statement. I'll include my actual statement to prove where you might have gone wrong.
"there certainly isn't a genre of music that seems to celebrate and glamorize this non-existent "gang culture.""
I then furthered that by including a video example of what I'm referring to which clearly isn't mainstream rap..
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
So Breitbart and Neocon websites are never in question.
Yet, Newsweek and WSJ don't cut it.
You clearly have no idea how much marketing research is done and how accurate it is. You also clearly don't understand the monetary impact of that information being accurate.
Yet, Newsweek and WSJ don't cut it.
You clearly have no idea how much marketing research is done and how accurate it is. You also clearly don't understand the monetary impact of that information being accurate.
Says the guy who continues to provide links with ZERO factual information.
Really? Lefties are this easy?
I think we have to admit any job creation program that works is going to also be a brain drain as those people with jobs will flee to safer areas. This is unfortunate because I think one of the key things to improving the situation is having examples people can see of success outside of drugs, sports or rapping. Still, even if the jobs were in those areas, people who make it to middle class aren't going to stay there, but would rather commute.
There is no reason for businesses to move in to those areas, and in general, manufacturing jobs aren't coming back period so these jobs are going to be service jobs. No one is going to make a living being the local plumber or electrician in West Baltimore.
I think the start to any plans is ending the drug war. If we go toward treating addiction as a health issue, we can do more to dry up demand. If you do that, the prices should go down, which would make drug dealing a less lucrative career as opposed to other opportunities. By hopefully stopping locking up so much of the black male population, we can see a resurgence of the family unit.
I think @windriverrange in another thread has it right, we need to strengthen trade schools in the US, and to take it further, we need to actively funnel people to them. I would aim at, in particular, the street level dealers, who aren't making a ton, but obviously more than they would at McDonalds, and try to put them on the straight and narrow after they get out. To go along with this, I think we should work with employers in the trades to get these newly educated but with criminal records people jobs. I would imagine you would need a number of carrots and sticks to make this happen, probably tax breaks and an insurance program for employers and an onerous sentence for anyone who violates the terms of employment.
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
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The only place I'm a lefty is this board. And, I'm starting to feel really good about being an outsider here.
The info is there. You just refuse to finish the articles or use any amount of common sense when it comes to population distribution.
Your narrative that an ENTIRE race is being swayed by a non-mainstream category is delightfully hilarious. Where are your numbers to prove this insanity?
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
Also, what impact did slave codes have on black culture?
How can you blame their "culture" when most were banned from practicing it? When many were banned from reading and writing? When nearly all were banned from owning property?
How can you blame their "culture" when most were banned from practicing it? When many were banned from reading and writing? When nearly all were banned from owning property?
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
What's that supposed to mean? I've not seen institutional racism in my entire life.
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
Institutional racism? really? As in government sanctioned?
I'm not talking about a racist asshole or boss. But racism from an institution.
If so, please explain.
I'm not talking about a racist asshole or boss. But racism from an institution.
If so, please explain.
I haven't either. But I'm told it's basically everywhere. Privilege or overblown exaggeration? I think maybe optimistic ignorance vs paranoid guilt is the real question. I don't doubt Adverpoke has excellent anecdotal stories to tell about racism but I don't see it at an institutional level.
That said, the axiom, walk a mile in his shoes is applicable here. Hard to know what it's like to be an inner city black man when I'm a lifelong white suburban dude. I do have the self awareness to know that. But I also know that in the company of other white people, I don't hear or see racism. Like... Never, really. I doubt I've heard any use of the N word by a white who is not making some specific reference to rap music in 20 years.
I don't think humanity can ever be rid of a shallow membrane of instinctive tribalism that is now defined as racism, but it's not institutional. Not on any wide scale for sure. I reject that.
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
Institution: a society or organization founded for a religious, educational, social, or similar purpose.
We are LOADED with racist institutions.
Clearly, you've defined your focus now illustrating two definitions of institutionalized. But, I'd argue that a prominent business owner in a community has more impact than any national laws.
We are LOADED with racist institutions.
Clearly, you've defined your focus now illustrating two definitions of institutionalized. But, I'd argue that a prominent business owner in a community has more impact than any national laws.
You've created quite the hilarious narrative for yourself. I'll refresh you with my ACTUAL quote.
Being as how I was referencing gang culture and not an "ENTIRE race" or even an entire genre of music, you can talk yourself down from that tiny soap box.
As to your request for some numbers, I've never even thought to look any up until you asked. Now, these aren't scientific like the "facts" you posted, but they'll have to do.
http://www.inquiriesjournal.com/art...n-audience-perceptions-of-misogynistic-lyrics
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447759/
http://library.wcsu.edu/dspace/handle/0/35
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/B:JOYO.0000013423.34021.45
These were a couple from a Google search that I didn't spend any time on. I didn't even read these, only glanced to see if they were actually relevant to the topic.
So in conclusion, you're arguing with yourself. I never posted anything remotely similar to "an ENTIRE race is being swayed by a non-mainstream category." I was only commenting on gang culture and its effects on youth. But apparently, rap music does influence youth, positively and negatively, so much so that Obama said this in 2007:
"There's no doubt that hip-hop culture moves our young people powerfully. And some of it is not just a reflection of reality," he told the magazine. "It also creates reality. I think that if all our kids see is a glorification of materialism and bling and casual sex and kids are never seeing themselves reflected as hitting the books and being responsible and delaying gratification, then they are getting an unrealistic picture of what the world is like."
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
Guest
Another way to illustrate this: many of the "thug" type photos shown as examples on these boards and other places are similar to ones I'd see on my Facebook or Twitter feed posted by friends. Friends that grew up rough, obey the law, pay taxes and raise families.
They are great people that just don't "look" the way that makes people comfortable.
They are simply getting tired of this shit and asking folks like me to empathize and share their experience. I'm not turning my back on people I've known since kindergarten.
They are great people that just don't "look" the way that makes people comfortable.
They are simply getting tired of this shit and asking folks like me to empathize and share their experience. I'm not turning my back on people I've known since kindergarten.
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
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I refuse to have any white guilt because I've never done anything racist. And I'll refute anyone who attempts to ascribe any to me simply because I'm white. If you can't see the hypocrisy in that then I don't know how this conversation can continue.
Do I recognize that there are pockets of racism? Of course. But I see it as a two way street. I've been in situations where I was grossly the minority and have been don't I don't belong. Why? Because I was white. That's racism.
Do I recognize that there are pockets of racism? Of course. But I see it as a two way street. I've been in situations where I was grossly the minority and have been don't I don't belong. Why? Because I was white. That's racism.
I'll go further and say that the only institutionalized racism I've seen in my lifetime was AGAINST me as a white male. With government sanctioned racial quotas regarding hiring, school admission, etc, I could be at a disadvantage when attempting to better myself.
Don't blame me for your lot in life. I grew up dirt ass poor. But got educated, made good decisions, went to work every day, paid my bills, and have made something for myself and family. Anyone willing to do the same can do that as well. Regardless of color or background in America. period.
Your status isn't my fault. I'm not to blame. And I won't have any guilt about it.
Don't blame me for your lot in life. I grew up dirt ass poor. But got educated, made good decisions, went to work every day, paid my bills, and have made something for myself and family. Anyone willing to do the same can do that as well. Regardless of color or background in America. period.
Your status isn't my fault. I'm not to blame. And I won't have any guilt about it.
I haven't a clue. It's not anything I've ever bothered to look at, much like the content of the other links I posted earlier.
I'm not sure how you got the impression that I'm blaming rap for gangs, violence, and what not. I merely stated that there is a genre of music that reflects the gang culture and that what is reflected in gang culture is unfortunately appealing to youth. I'm sure I could have worded it differently and that would have helped our interaction.
This indirectly illustrates a big part of the racial divide, and that is cultural assimilation vs multiculturalism. It's hard to relate to (or trust) guys that show up saggin, with a hoodie on in the summer and knock on my door. Meanwhile, the business next to mine is very successful and black owned (by a former OSU football player). Lots of black dudes come and go from there, but never put me in an uncomfortable situation by pushing ghetto culture. It would be ridiculous if they did because they are grown ass businessmen and their associates are too. I realize, yes - this is what happens when you get a college education. But the point remains. A little effort to assimilate into the larger American culture prevents a lot of so-called racism.
This too is a big part of the racial divide. It's forbidden to criticize a dead-end culture for it's obvious flaws, and so it perpetuates generation after generation and supports otherwise unfair stereotypes.
And I'll take it a step further. My famous Justin Bieber concert story was a valuable anthropological case study for me. It not only showed me that cops are sometimes brutal thugs who cannot be trusted and will close ranks to protect each other without question. It showed me that by me intentionally showing up to a "concert" headlined by a no-talent pop tart little BITCH with my hair down and leather biker vest and boots and Zeppelin shirt, I was intentionally thrusting my rock and roll cultural preference into a situation where it was clearly out of place. And right or wrong, I believe that played a part in some of the police brutality that I experienced there by creating an initial impression that did not assimilate into the "culture" (puke) of the event. I chose to do that on purpose and it carried an unintentional prejudicial cost.
It's pretty easy not to look like a thug. These kids do it to try to be hard and tough because that's the culture.
It has to be the baking powder that's used to make crack. Or because Congress hates crack users. I really have no clue.
What is the general attire for a Bieber concert supposed to be? I'm actually afraid to hear the answer.
To be a 14 year old girl wearing as provocative clothes as your mom will allow.
Well I think if you're there in a dad capacity you need to look like a standard issue casual Friday dork. Evidently.
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anon_ph7vrsh7abnty
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Empathy isn't (white) guilt.
It's simply asking yourself to take a moment to understand someone else's journey.
Several people here (pilt, wind, mega, etc.) seem to (finally) be doing this and coming up with solutions that I don't have to agree with to appreciate.
Everyone else seems content to ignore or further widen the divide.
It's simply asking yourself to take a moment to understand someone else's journey.
Several people here (pilt, wind, mega, etc.) seem to (finally) be doing this and coming up with solutions that I don't have to agree with to appreciate.
Everyone else seems content to ignore or further widen the divide.
I'm quite empathetic. A softy even to others plights. That's why I'm the president of my local Rotary club. Our motto is 'Service Above Self'. I do a LOT to help others and am actually an empath - in that I feel actual physical pain when I see others in pain. Don't tell me about empathy. I'm generally humble in my service and don't talk about it. I am not part of the problem.
The problem with the BLM or SJW groups is that their solutions require me to admit some guilt or give up something that I've worked my life for. For that I have no empathy. Their solutions don't include them valuing hard work, being frugal, delayed gratification, saving, and generally being a solid contributor to society.
The real answer is to rid ourselves of the government teat. Welfare simply aggravates generational poverty, the breakdown of the family structure (and I'm for gay marriage), and a dependency attitude.
I'm willing to walk a mile in anyone's shoes. But where is there common ground when they are inditing me for something I've not done and not willing to discuss any of the real root problems and their solutions? The solution is simple. Doing it is boring, hard work, and takes time. That's not something I've seen they are willing to do.
The problem with the BLM or SJW groups is that their solutions require me to admit some guilt or give up something that I've worked my life for. For that I have no empathy. Their solutions don't include them valuing hard work, being frugal, delayed gratification, saving, and generally being a solid contributor to society.
The real answer is to rid ourselves of the government teat. Welfare simply aggravates generational poverty, the breakdown of the family structure (and I'm for gay marriage), and a dependency attitude.
I'm willing to walk a mile in anyone's shoes. But where is there common ground when they are inditing me for something I've not done and not willing to discuss any of the real root problems and their solutions? The solution is simple. Doing it is boring, hard work, and takes time. That's not something I've seen they are willing to do.
Can't imagine it makes much difference if you don't use them transport them or sell them. I'm just a simple man, I don't have a law degree or a phd in minority studies so my whole existence isn't based on the nuance of such things, but I've never met anybody who didn't do drugs (or make money off of those who do like ambulance chasers or politicians) ever have a problem with the racial disparity in the punishments. If I was a minority I might try and shift my kids in that direction instead of getting them lathered up over the differences.
I didn't think my comments would kill this thread. But if people don't really want to solve the problems then there isn't much else to say.
