Well isn't someone enlightened?
They're only treating her this way because she's a woman.
GOT 4
- Thread starter Cowguy
- Start date
They're only treating her this way because she's a woman.
100%. Especially when she first showed up. She could have taken her army to the gates and won the city before nightfall w actually minimal civilian bloodshed. KL was in turmoil already w the sept blowing up and had little defenses. They wouldn’t have had any problem. I get the sentiment Tyrion was championing but was ultimately poorly thought out.
Have you missed the whole series? She's supposed to be the breaker of chains, the liberator of the people from tyrants. Or is all that just a front for another self entitled seeker of power like her father and everyone else. Certainly nothing has been without blood shed to this point but there's a difference between the blood shed of combat and massacring a million innocent people like her father.
This is one of GRRM's main themes. Those who benefit from the war for power vs those who pay the price. Not surprising its coming down to this.
Yeah, Danny isn't my favorite character but she is taking all the loses this season. She seems to be the only one who faces any sort of real consequences.
Don't you think it was equally unrealistic in previous seasons how she rose to power and everyone just loved her and no one question her true motives. I would say the Starks have faced a lot of consequences in previous season's, then the Lannisters and ever other person who has come to power. If there one consistent theme of Game of Thornes it's that no one stays on top for long without paying the price. Its just Dani turn now.
You could argue that Jon's death had no real consequences. Definitely, not negatively. They made him a legend.
I should have said this season. Obviously, consequences have been suffered by everyone. It just feels weird to me this season Dany is the only main character who loses strategically. I get it. They have to "depower" Dany to make the final fight more suspenseful. I just think it would have been better if it was a little more spread out. Maybe start her crazy descent when she lost her first dragon.
I should have said this season. Obviously, consequences have been suffered by everyone. It just feels weird to me this season Dany is the only main character who loses strategically. I get it. They have to "depower" Dany to make the final fight more suspenseful. I just think it would have been better if it was a little more spread out. Maybe start her crazy descent when she lost her first dragon.
I've watched the show since day one and I've read every book a couple of times. I get that Dany is often the "most progressive" character (for lack of a better word). That being said, I don't think the she has been portrayed as someone who didn't have a practical side (or even dark side). Especially, when it comes to taking back the throne and defeating her enemies. I mean was the plan to somehow take the seven kingdoms without shedding any innocent blood?
Jon and Tyrion where all for starving the peasants to death but they can't handle the thought of taking the city by force? Even if you think Dany's character should be against killing innocents in war. I have a hard time buying everyone else is put off by the notion.
Last edited:
I think she did start the down fall then. I think it intensifies her feelings toward Jon. I think the finale straw that makes her snap will be her finding out Jon told his sisters or cousins and they then repeated it to Tyrion who told Varys.
I listen to a podcast on ASOIF. https://notacastasoiaf.podbean.com/
In their most recent episode, they were discussing one of Dani's later chapters in GOT. This was the one where Kal Drogo sustained his wound, that ended up leading to his death. This is also the chapter where Dani meets Miri Maz Dur (the healer/practitioner of blood magic).
Something that was mentioned in the episode that was interesting to me.
Per the podcast, Kal Drogo, and his Kallisar attacked the city of the Lamb Men (Miri Maz Dur's people), in order to collect people to sell as slaves in the free cities. The plan was to raise money to buy ships to help Dani get back to Westeros and retake the Iron Throne. Granted, Dani had no control over that situation, and her motivations can not be questioned there. But, I always thought that the Dothraki were simply looking to expand their empire and enjoyed fighting/killing. I never realized that Kal Drogo had ulterior motives. But it does make sense, because in the prior Dani chapter, he said that he would help Dani get the iron throne after she was nearly poisoned.
However, that event clearly affected Dani, and influenced her to fight against slavery in the later books.
I would argue Tyrion has always been equally as progressive as Dani. Being the imp he has always identified with the underdog. That's what attracted him to Dani. He saw her as the anti Cersei. Varys to a lessor extent has always talked about bring a true and just ruler to the throne. So its not really inconsistent that they are arguing for a higher standard.
I agree the show has reduced it to a pretty simplistic storyline at this point. Cersei is clearly willing to sacrifice the entire city to hold power. She's using the peasants as a human shield forcing Dani to choose. Possibly even trying to bait Dani into attacking since she now seems to have the advantage.
I don't think Tyrion, Varys, & Jon believe they can take the throne without any innocent blood they are just look for an alternative that keeps it to a minimum. They are also focused on beyond just getting power to holding power and having a lasting reign that makes life better for the innocents.
Fortunately for all involved Arya and the Hound are on the way to save the day.
In the books, he talks about this, but is either not being genuine, or is fooling himself. He wants his choice of rulers on the IT. Whether or not he (Aegon) turns out to be true and just is secondary.
That's the question with everyone. What are their true motives? To a certain extent everyone is rationalizing between their personnel quest for power and their motivations. No GRRM character is 100% good or evil. Some such as Cersei are clearly primarily evil. Other such a Ned Stark are primarily noble and good. The true brilliance is those such as Jamie who initially appear one way and then are revealed to be much more complicated over time.
This is an area in which I think the show struggles without GRRM source material to guide them at this point.
Agree with all points. Hard to see any evil in Davos or Sam, though. JMO
Yeah this is after the assassins try to kill Dany and Drogo becomes enraged by it and swears to conquer the Seven Kingdoms for her sake and seat their son on the throne of her ancestors. Before this he really wasn't interested in going to Westeros because it holds nothing in particular that the Dothraki want and is located across the sea, which they have always feared.
Oh yah, and I hope Dany gets got, she sucks. Just hearing her open her mouth kills me. Of course, that could be because she's a woman.
Dani lost me about the 37th time she demanded someone “bend the knee”.
She’s on a power fueled Targ ego trip and she’s becoming something akin to her brother. She will either kill Jon or try to do so.
I don’t really get that twisted with some of the details. I just like to be entertained. That being said, the timeline thing has really jumped the shark. Ever since they have gone away from the books they have been pretty loose with the story. I bet you once the books they are quite a bit different than the shows.
If GRRM could figure it out, we would have all read the books by now. Clearly he's having more issues than the TV show wrapping things up.
Why can't there be more dragons. It's not like there wasn't more eggs around Westeros
Some funny stuff.
In retrospect, I'm not sure why anyone expected more. The show fell apart once they progressed past GRRM's written novels. Sad really. The first 4 seasons are some of the best TV ever created.
In retrospect, I'm not sure why anyone expected more. The show fell apart once they progressed past GRRM's written novels. Sad really. The first 4 seasons are some of the best TV ever created.
The show did not fall apart. It's got some lapses but it's still compelling TV and only in internetland where people love to trash each other and everything popular does it suck.
I know this, if I showed up with about 50 soldiers and an imp brother who she wanted to kill, in order to demand she surrender, Cersei would end me before I even got a chance to speak.
I think it can be both. I still enjoy watching it as much as anything ever on TV. At the same time, it is not great when 3 or 4 times an episode you are are thinking this makes absolutely no sense. It went from a really tightly written to show to a series of plot points. In the rush to the end the writers no longer show their work.
I don't know what the alternative is though. You can't have a 15 season show. It is what it is. I just hope Martin finishes the story so we can have both experiences.
In a perfect world that would be awesome. I just don't know how practical it is. Does Kit Harrington want to play Jon Snow for 15 years?
You are entitled to your opinion.
From what I know of you, you seem to be an intelligent individual. I suspect that if you were to sit down and binge watch the series, you would find yourself noticing a significant quality difference in Season 1-4 v. the rest of the series. It is possible that you are not appreciating just how good the initial 4 seasons were. HBO did a fantastic job of bringing the books to the screen. They used some of GRRM's best dialogue, and made some changes (for the better) to some of his scenes/narrative.
Since running out of book material to lean on, the show has been poorly handled, IMO. Granted, they didn't have an easy task, and they are clearly doing something right based on the ratings. It could have been so much more, though.
It does seem untenable. However, money talks. Some actors would stick around for a long time if the price was right. Actors who were not willing could be killed off. Even main characters.
Absolutely, I'm just saying that brings about its own set of issues. To me I would rather have a rushed ending involving all the main characters than an ending that is forced to be Hot Pie sitting on the throne because everyone else wanted off the show by season 12.
