Iran Iraq war for the win. While Saudi Arabia and Iran are not currently at war they are not exactly kissing cousins.
Sunnis and Shias have been fighting each other for over 1400 years, any attempt to deny this is dishonest.
San Diego Synagogue
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Iran Iraq war for the win. While Saudi Arabia and Iran are not currently at war they are not exactly kissing cousins.
Sunnis and Shias have been fighting each other for over 1400 years, any attempt to deny this is dishonest.
Dude he is not giving an inflammatory opinion to argue. He said so right in the post. You are just suppose to quietly digest it.
Iraq was coerced by the america and the west to attack iran because of the hostage crisis.saddam hussain actually apologized to khomeni. during the 1st gulf war iraq sent all to iran for safe keeping which of course iran never returned.
To explain what ihave been saying is to give what muslims believe in all from quran.
Five essential tennets of islam;
1) professing one to be a muslim by reciting the kalimah
2)prayers 5 times a day in a prescribed manner.
3)zakat( alms for the poor)
4) fasting during month of ramadan only if it doesn't effect individuals heath,I am a diabetic I cannot fast
5) Hajj pilgrimage which each muslim should perform if all his responsibilities are over (daughters marred) and he can afford it.Women are not supposed to cover their heads or face during pilgrimage.
belief in other religions.
We believe in Jesus Christ and his virgin birth,We believe in John the Baptist in Moses ,Abraham and all the prophets of the old testaments(Little different than Christian and Jews.
WE believe that Jesus was not crucified but replaced during crucifixtion,and taken to heaven. We believe that he would come back in the last days of the world.
WE don't believe that Jesus was son of god.
We believe that god sent 124000 prophets from the beginning of time and Mohammad was his last prophet, We believe the message of god was completed with quran.
Women Rights
Women are allowed to choose their own husband,inheritance for women is described
and women must get their rights,incase of divorce women are supposed to be paid
an amount as agreed before marriage. Childrens responsibility is on the husband.
Some other beliefs
WE don't believe god created the world in 6 days and rested on the 7th. There
is no sabbath in Islam.
God said happen and the universe was created.
In quran it says we created all life on the earth from water.There is no concept
of eve in the quran and to me the concept of Adam is human race(which literalist do not agree with).
Jihad
Jihad means stuggle. It is mentioned in quran as to improvement by humans in themselves. Jihad when used for war has lots of conditions. That is why baghdadi
created islamic state and pronounced himself as the head,
one of the pre conditions of jihad.
Killing of innocent people is forbidden. A verse says killing of one human is like
killing the entire human race.
Apostate very controversial, jihadi say that anybody who denounces Islam or converts to another religion should be killed. Scholars (not mullahs) disagree on this point and I wouldn;t go in detail.I don't agree with the jihadi interpretation because it contradicts prophet's saying.
We as muslims have to believe in quran and prophets sunnah which means how he led his life and his sayings. The problem here is hadith(prophet;s sayings were compiled 200 yrs after his death and this where all the problem begin
One of the prophet saying which is considered authentic by all the schools of thought
is that during a war do not kill children women old people and sick people.
Suicide is absolutey prohibited,hence no concept of suicide bombing.This concept came up during sri lank's civil war when hindus used it against sri lankan troops.
Indian prime minister Rajiv Gandhi was killed by a woman suicide bomber.
I hope it helps in certain misconceptions you have.
Sorry it is so long
Five essential tennets of islam;
1) professing one to be a muslim by reciting the kalimah
2)prayers 5 times a day in a prescribed manner.
3)zakat( alms for the poor)
4) fasting during month of ramadan only if it doesn't effect individuals heath,I am a diabetic I cannot fast
5) Hajj pilgrimage which each muslim should perform if all his responsibilities are over (daughters marred) and he can afford it.Women are not supposed to cover their heads or face during pilgrimage.
belief in other religions.
We believe in Jesus Christ and his virgin birth,We believe in John the Baptist in Moses ,Abraham and all the prophets of the old testaments(Little different than Christian and Jews.
WE believe that Jesus was not crucified but replaced during crucifixtion,and taken to heaven. We believe that he would come back in the last days of the world.
WE don't believe that Jesus was son of god.
We believe that god sent 124000 prophets from the beginning of time and Mohammad was his last prophet, We believe the message of god was completed with quran.
Women Rights
Women are allowed to choose their own husband,inheritance for women is described
and women must get their rights,incase of divorce women are supposed to be paid
an amount as agreed before marriage. Childrens responsibility is on the husband.
Some other beliefs
WE don't believe god created the world in 6 days and rested on the 7th. There
is no sabbath in Islam.
God said happen and the universe was created.
In quran it says we created all life on the earth from water.There is no concept
of eve in the quran and to me the concept of Adam is human race(which literalist do not agree with).
Jihad
Jihad means stuggle. It is mentioned in quran as to improvement by humans in themselves. Jihad when used for war has lots of conditions. That is why baghdadi
created islamic state and pronounced himself as the head,
one of the pre conditions of jihad.
Killing of innocent people is forbidden. A verse says killing of one human is like
killing the entire human race.
Apostate very controversial, jihadi say that anybody who denounces Islam or converts to another religion should be killed. Scholars (not mullahs) disagree on this point and I wouldn;t go in detail.I don't agree with the jihadi interpretation because it contradicts prophet's saying.
We as muslims have to believe in quran and prophets sunnah which means how he led his life and his sayings. The problem here is hadith(prophet;s sayings were compiled 200 yrs after his death and this where all the problem begin
One of the prophet saying which is considered authentic by all the schools of thought
is that during a war do not kill children women old people and sick people.
Suicide is absolutey prohibited,hence no concept of suicide bombing.This concept came up during sri lank's civil war when hindus used it against sri lankan troops.
Indian prime minister Rajiv Gandhi was killed by a woman suicide bomber.
I hope it helps in certain misconceptions you have.
Sorry it is so long
Definitely not a copy and paste from Dale Carnegie's 'How to Win Friends and Influence People'.
No redemption. No salvation. No forgiveness. No savior. No peace. No faith. No hope. No love. It's no wonder Muslims are so pissed off all the time.
Of course our beliefs differ here but there is salvation it is all question of faith.
Faith means to believe in something that you cannot see.
And as christian would say I forgive you.
By the way did you read the entire email on muslim belief,what I have stated is believed by all schools of thought nothing controversial.
Yeah, ok. "WE don't believe that Jesus was son of god." Nothing controversial here.
I was talking about muslim schools of thought. Jews don't believe that Jesus was a son of god.
I just saw a documentary where this rabii explains why jews believe that Jesus was not the messiah.
I just saw a documentary where this rabii explains why jews believe that Jesus was not the messiah.
There is no way you could possibly understand or believe why (genuine) Christians support the Jews and believe the Jews are God's chosen people, while the Jews don't necessarily support Christians. No way you could ever understand why Trump put the embassy in Jerusalem. Not in a million years... unless God opened your eyes to the truth.
Of course I know why christians support jews I have read the bible cover to cover.
My eyes are open I believe human beings are god's chosen people after all he is the creator and how could he choose a small group and condemn rest of his childre
I disagree with muslim clergy that claim only muslims would go into heaven and they condemn people who worship idols. I don't see the god that I believe in leaving any body behind who has been a good child.
To me Jerusalem is a political issue and not a religious one.
By the way I couldn't find it in quran that muslims were the chosen people.
I know you are trying to converse peacefully and I appreciate that. You’re probably a decent guy. On issues of religion, we don’t agree. But on worldly issues, (day to day life in this world) we should all be able to somewhat get along. That is where Islam needs to do some deep self evaluation. Islam causes a lot of trouble with innocent people just trying to live life. I’m out. I gotta go help make America great again.
When I described the Islamic tenets of belief do you see any where, where jihadi
propaganda fits in Islam.
Yes, I have twice said I am not looking for an argument. I'll repeat it for a third time: I'm not looking for an argument, I'm looking for an answer. I'm asking out of curiosity: to what do you ascribe the apparent hatred some Muslims have for all Americans? I have seen some people on this board say they hate us for our freedom and our prosperity. I originally asked ostatedchi why he thought Muslims hate us so much. So far none of you have bothered to quietly digest the question and formulate an answer, beyond cynically assuming I blame the whole mess on America. I do not blame the whole mess on America. I think there is plenty of blame to go around. Reading this post leads me to think some of you think America is an innocent victim of Muslim hatred, that America was quietly minding its own business when Muslims attacked us with a sucker punch, that we were flabbergasted to discover they hated us. I just wonder if I'm reading you correctly. I was hoping someone would provide an answer.
All the “grafted into the vine” and “the Root of Jesse” stuff must have escaped you. Christianity is loaded with shady characters from one end to the other. That’s the whole point of mercy, pardon and grace.
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Just go read every one of my posts in this thread and redo you reply. This time with out all the ancillary fluff.
Doesn't my short summary of Islamic beliefs answer your questions.
Muslim don't hate America that is a myth. Why would so many muslims want
to go to europe and America.
Some people just like to hate,like ISIS they hate muslims as much as they hate any one else.
There are people in america who hate people of color
and jews why?
Some people just like to hate and that is a fact.
I asked WHY Muslims were suffering that would motivate them to become jihadists since you said that was the main reason for their hate? And would a government based on Islam be a factor in that suffering since it appears to me that most governments with Sharia Law seems to be oppressive.
I have you on ignore from your history of constant spamming and didn’t see your original question.
Regardless of any perceived motivation based on America’s past action, any violent act solely on the person committing the violent act.
I think America is a convenient villain for oppressive governments to use to distract their population from a shitty life and focus the blame for their plight away from the real cause - Islamic based governments that oppress their citizens.
Well good question. Main reason is poverty,most of the muslim countries are.
Then the 9/11 where most of the terrorist were Saudi,as I have mentioned several times Saudi strain of Islam is very radical and they were brain washed because of that.
It is not as much as govt. based on Islam because I don't see many really Islamic
countries but it has to do more of the authoritarian regimes that hide under the cloak
of Islam like Saudi or Iranian even UAE and Kuwait..
The largest muslim country in the world is Indonesia which is democratic and not as poor. Pakistan is democratic but poor so is Bangladesh but it is moving towards a single party democracy,which is really authoritarian.
There is no such thing as Sharia law it is something that has come up in last 40 or
50yrs.
Pakistan has a constitution which is sharia compliant, we don't have any laws to cut
off peoples head or stoning or any laws against adultery or gays(THey are accepted
quitely) recent head line was trans gender would be allowed in police.
American constitution is also 90% sharia compliant and muslim scholars in the US
find no conflict between Islam and American constitution.
Does that answer your question.
So being poor and brainwashed is the root of radical Islamist terrorism.
What causes the rampant poverty and who and what is brainwashing those folks so much that they are willing to die for their cause?
Well, if you've got me on ignore I don't know if you'll see this reply. I think you are spot on in your assessment, at least as far as it goes. Do you not see American meddling as a convenient excuse for those despotic governments to manipulate their people into hating us? Do you disagree that America sticks its nose into the affairs of other countries, whether it is wanted or not? Do you think it is possible that it would be more difficult for those despotic governments to manipulate their peoples' hatred toward us if we practiced a more hands-off approach? I suppose it is impossible to know which party initiated the violence against the other, so it is a fruitless exercise for each side to point fingers at the other. It is obvious some Muslims hate Americans with an irrational passion. Personally I doubt we will get them to quit hating us by putting military troops in their land and bombing them. Do you disagree?
In countries like Pakistan corruption and lack of education leads to poverty. Govts
even though democratic are only interested in filling their personal coffers.
We finally have a govt,which is taking serious steps against former corrupt politicians and the bureaucrats who helped them. This govt.is also taking steps towards educating the masses.
Pakistan is extremely rich in natural resources but since it takes a lot of time to develop them, past govts did not see immediate gain.
Remember japanese kamikaze pilots they were not muslims but were brain washed.
I have not been able to understand why some people get brain washed I guess it
takes a certain mind set that they have.
I think they are going to hate us regardless. At least for the next few generations.
The issue to me is do we fight them over here or fight them over there? I’d much rather fight them over there. That being said, if the UN wasn’t a corrupt feckless organization then it could be done under the auspices of an international coalition that might diffuse the hate away somewhat. But they just don’t like western civilization in general and will continue to impose their world view on everyone regardless.
What I see as a defensive action they’ll see as an offensive one. And vise versa. So I don’t really concern myself too much with that.
Ouch! I had not realized I had mischaracterized the U.S. The U.S. is historically the most noble country in human history. From its founding it has practiced a relative hands-off approach in its dealings with other countries. Following WW2 - and particularly after the collapse of the USSR - our government has appointed itself as the world's policeman, abandoned its semi-isolationist history, and become something of a bully, with its newfound desire to nation-build. IMO that's been the root cause of much of our conflicts with some other countries. If I am mischaracterizing the situation I stand prepared to be corrected!
I still don’t think you are getting to the root cause of the issue. Keep asking WHY for each of your sentences?
Why is your government corrupt that causes rampant poverty?
Why are the people being brainwashed?
Who is doing the brainwashing and what is that message?
I tend to agree with you to some extent yes it makes the task of despots easier since they have some one else to blame for the problems their people are facing.
Saddam used it very effectively. America probably shouldn't have gone there, but
if Bush was so bent on attacking them, the US govt should have fore seen the future
problems.
In Iran while the govt. is trying their best to create an American phobia ( your idiot president is not helping) but I get the impression while talking to iranis that people are fed up with the mullah govt.
Lot of times the intentions of the American are good but they lack empathy for different cultures. British on the other hand understand this area and its people and their culture better because they ruled the region for a long time.
Recently the US govt. is losing the confidence of the people it is negotiating with
because other countries are realizing that a treaty with America means nothing because the next leader may just cancel it on a whim.
I think your attitude is shared by most Americans, in no small part because there is a great deal of truth in what you say. I can't help but notice, however, that you continue to ignore my question as to whether you assign any blame for their hatred toward us on any actions we have taken toward them. And if you do assign any "blame" on us, what should we do to alleviate or eliminate our share of blame? I agree it will take generations for the hatred to subside, but I can't see it ever subsiding if we continue to do the same thing we have been doing.
If its a real treaty that is approved by the Senate then the next president can’t cancel it on a whim. This is how it is supposed to happen. But Obama never sent any of his agreements or treaties for ratification. If he’d done so, Trump would be powerless to cancel it. It would take the Senate.
