David, in all sincerity, what does the Human Genome Project say about human DNA? And since this will be used in this discussion, how much DNA do humans and chimpanzees and bonobos share? We can even throw in gorillas for comparative purposes.
OK GOPers thoughts on proposed bill
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Help me out here - I presume you can tell me the genetic difference between chimps and humans no?
Can you do the same for the following?
- White
- Black or African American
- American Indian or Alaska Native
- Asian
- Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander
Yawn. Sorry Dodge, I'm not playing any more DodgeAllen games. Answer my questions or don't.
Just for the humor and likely yet another signature Dodge, what do you think determines the pigmentation of your skin... genetics or society?
A reminder: There are 4 family groups in the world. I'm part of all 4. By average IQ;
1. East Asian.
2. European Caucasian
3. Indigenous American
4. Sub-Saharan African
There are exceptions. Condaleezza Rice and Ben Carson are in the genius range. Hillary Clinton is far short.
My 9% East Asian comes from Cherokee who are believed to have walked across the Bering Strait to North America 13,000 years ago.
My DNA analysis was done at Genelex Labs in Seattle in 2008 for $600.
1. East Asian.
2. European Caucasian
3. Indigenous American
4. Sub-Saharan African
There are exceptions. Condaleezza Rice and Ben Carson are in the genius range. Hillary Clinton is far short.
My 9% East Asian comes from Cherokee who are believed to have walked across the Bering Strait to North America 13,000 years ago.
My DNA analysis was done at Genelex Labs in Seattle in 2008 for $600.
How very unspecific of you. Which genome? Feel free to consult the literature. Might be good for you.
Not really, if you had a basic grasp of genetics you wouldn’t be posting in this thread.
Really? You're white because you were born in Oklahoma? Interesting...
Ever heard of an allele, Dodge? You still haven't answered my two simple questions, both of which have easily identifiable numbers associated with them.
Ah now don't go simple on me. Which haplogroup defines me as "white"? Are short people their own race too? Help me out man - splain it. That or post a link to someone who can.
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Can you cite one scientific source (other than a nutty MIT electrical engineer) that supports your thesis?
Given your knowledge of the genetic code - how many races are there and what are the genetic markers that delineate who is what?
Are the Irish their own race?
Which box should a Sicilian check: White, Black or African American, American Indian or Alaska Native, Asian, Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander?
Who came up with those arbitrary categories anyway?
I think we are getting close to a breakthrough. Don't wuss out now.
Not to speak for Medic or AW, but I think what they are leading you to is gene and/or allele expression. If you want to talk about genome and encoded genes as the only indicator of race, then you should not be discussing male/female sex/gender (unless you want to talk in the rare XXY, XYY syndromes) based on that same gene make up.
I will let you all return to your regular programming
My point is we have these arbitrary buckets that we drop people into not because there is great scientific value to do so but because it serves a social purpose. Those buckets have shifted over time, not just in what is considered to be a "race" but also in the attributes that were considered relevant in placing an individual into a bucket as happened with the Irish in America who became "white" over time as indentured servitude waned.Not to speak for Medic or AW, but I think what they are leading you to is gene and/or allele expression. If you want to talk about genome and encoded genes as the only indicator of race, then you should not be discussing male/female sex/gender (unless you want to talk in the rare XXY, XYY syndromes) based on that same gene make up.
I will let you all return to your regular programming
There are attributes that matter with race, though. Whether we term it "race" or some other term does not matter, we all do fall in to some "buckets" when it comes to gene or allele expressions. I agree that there is some geographical context as well. Black people in the US are more susceptible to certain conditions such as diabetes, based on both, geographical (racial biases, perceived or real) and gene expression. In my opinion, I think you are over-simplifying this. Ignoring gene expression over geographical is very unreasonable. There are evolutionary and adaptive features, not to mention selection, that do incorporate geography in the development of those expressed genes. Still, the genes expressed vary and can, at least, phenotypically be sub-categorized.
Yes. Irish fall into the European Caucasian family group.
What I know about Medic007 from reading his posts. He doesn't give a mouse's hiney what color the gymnast is. Medic007 is concerned about the color of the uniform.
I'm 6% Asia Minor. First migration out of Africa. Genelex Labs tells me there are only 4 family groups in the world as I noted above. Portuguese and Spanish generally look somewhat different than Danish and Norwegian, but occupy the same family group. North African and Sub-Saharan African don't match up.
For this discussion, how about we eliminate the word "race" and replace it with "genetic variability."My point is we have these arbitrary buckets that we drop people into not because there is great scientific value to do so but because it serves a social purpose. Those buckets have shifted over time, not just in what is considered to be a "race" but also in the attributes that were considered relevant in placing an individual into a bucket as happened with the Irish in America who became "white" over time as indentured servitude waned.
Would you agree that some genetic variability shows up in the outward appearance of the human species, such as hair color, eye color, skin pigmentation, etc?
My point is we have these arbitrary buckets that we drop people into not because there is great scientific value to do so but because it serves a social purpose. Those buckets have shifted over time, not just in what is considered to be a "race" but also in the attributes that were considered relevant in placing an individual into a bucket as happened with the Irish in America who became "white" over time as indentured servitude waned.
Arbitrary buckets.
I must’ve missed that day.
Not much to disagree with here - except where you tell me I am "very unreasonable". ;-)
Now consider this statement "race is a social construct". What does the word race mean in this context - we don't use the word haplogroups which you have succinctly described. No, we use words like "white" and "Asian". One of which is a geographic term, the other speaks to lesser melanin. Those are not consistent let alone scientifically meaningful. If race isn't about social constructs (read that as political) then why do we sometimes call out latino and other times not? If it were biologically determined then we would have categories that are more permanent and directly backed with scientific indicators - those exist but they aren't called "race".
Which box do you check on the census form if you don't mind sharing? Why is it your choice to pick a box and not determined through a medical test as your blood type is?
Of course. I would go so far as to say there are discernible clusters of like attributes amongst people who share geographic and cultural histories as well.
If race is biologically determined, why then do we have new parents self-identify race for a certificate of live birth rather than just test a couple of drops of blood?
Did you mean 5?
- African
- West Eurasian
- East Eurasian
- Native American
- Australo-Melanesian
You are sort of mixing ethnicity and race. White latino vs other latino. Terming as asian, white, black, etc is a simple way to categorize at a simple, easy to understand at almost any education level. It is a very simplistic way at terming phenotypes. How much of the global population do you think understands the term “phenotype” versus white, black, etc?
Ethnicity, such as latino is an entirely different subject.
That's a great question for the governments that require race to be on the birth certificate. My professional guess is that the information is collected for statistical purposes for people doing research in order to compare populations/demographics.
No.Did you mean 5?
- African
- West Eurasian
- East Eurasian
- Native American
- Australo-Melanesian
For the first time, I checked White, Native American and African American. 2020 is the first time I ever remember CHECK ALL THAT APPLY. I've always checked White as I am about 5/8 European Caucasian.
Should any question ever arise about ethnicity, I have lab documents. I once presented said document to Waco's VA hospital to have a VA woman tell me, if I were an Oklahoma resident, I'm Indigenous American enough for certain government benefits but not as a Texas resident. I found it so bizarre I didn't even ask her what the benefit might be. I don't plan a move to the Nations.
It's almost like race isn't biologically indicated and instead a term to describe how one fits into the prevailing social construct.
