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No Bernie, Denmark is Not a Socialist Utopia

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February 24, 2020
No Bernie, Denmark is Not a Socialist Utopia
By Brian C. Joondeph

Socialist/communist presidential candidate Bernie Sanders loves to sing the praises of a small Scandinavian country, Denmark. It seems he has fallen out of love with his previous favorite countries, the Soviet Union and Cuba, which he “warmly praised” in the late 1980s.

After spurning the USSR, the country he spent his honeymoon in, shirtless, singing along drunkenly with his fellow communist comrades, he has moved on to northern Europe as representing his idea of utopia.

As CNN reported about Bernie’s newfound love,

Open a newspaper on any given day here in this small Europe nation known for high taxes, generous government services and its stubbornly happy citizens, and you'll almost certainly find a story about the U.S. presidential election.

"I think we should look to countries like Denmark, like Sweden and Norway," Sanders said, "and learn what they have accomplished for their working people."

Danes may indeed be happy, but they bristle at being called socialists.

"I would like to make one thing clear," Danish Prime Minister Lars Lokke Rasmussen said recently in a speech at Harvard's Kennedy School of Government. "Denmark is far from a socialist planned economy. Denmark is a market economy."

That hasn’t deterred Bernie, however. At a recent Democrat debate he proclaimed, "We should look to countries like Denmark, like Sweden and Norway, and learn from what they have accomplished for their working people."

So, what’s the magic in Denmark? Denmark is the second happiest country in the world, just behind Finland, according to CNN Travel. The US sits in 19th place. If you watch a Trump rally, you would find nothing but happiness. Compare that to a Bernie rally or a Democrat debate where the only messages are misery and victimhood.

Denmark is fortunate that they don’t have our 24-7 cable news networks preaching gloom and doom and a major political party telling everyone how rotten Denmark is, a nation of victims. Who could be happy listening to nonstop pessimism?

Denmark is far from a socialist economy; instead they are the type of market economy that Bernie and his fellow Democrat candidates rail against. The CIA World Factbook describes Denmark this way.

This thoroughly modern market economy features advanced industry with world-leading firms in pharmaceuticals, maritime shipping, and renewable energy, and a high-tech agricultural sector. Danes enjoy a high standard of living, and the Danish economy is characterized by extensive government welfare measures and an equitable distribution of income. An aging population will be a long-term issue.

Wow, a market economy, not big government controlling healthcare, energy, communications, and tech, as the Democrats desire for America. But these extensive welfare measures have a cost.

How does GDP per capita compare between the US and Denmark? In Denmark it’s $50,000, but in the US it’s 20 percent higher at $60,000.

Denmark, as a member of NATO, enjoys military protection paid mostly by America. The US spends 3.1 percent of GDP on defense, compared to 1.3 percent by Denmark, leaving them more to spend on their “extensive government welfare measures.”

This applies to most European countries, happy for America to pay for their national defense, leaving them more money for extended family leave and other benefits.

How do taxes compare? After all, how does Denmark pay for their welfare benefits? From CNN,

"Free" is actually the wrong word to describe these services. Danes pay some of the highest taxes in the world, including a 25% tax on all goods and services, a top marginal tax rate hovering near 60%. The top tax rate in the U.S., by comparison, is less than 40%.

Bernie’s tax plan calls for a top tax rate north of 50 percent. He also wants a wealth tax of up to 8 percent on the Michael Bloombergs and Warren Buffets of the world.

Nothing is truly free. Taxes simply take money from citizens, purchasing “benefits” that some use or want and others don’t. Minus a hefty administrative fee to redistribute everyone’s income. Hardly free.

What about some of Denmark’s programs that are more in line with Trump than with Bernie? Democrats are famous for situational praise and outrage.

For example, John Bolton was evil when he was nominated by George W Bush for UN Ambassador, but a saint when he was willing to testify in the Ukraine impeachment trial. Mitt Romney was a racist, sexist, reprobate when running for president against The One, but became Mother Theresa when he was the sole Republican casting a vote to convict President Trump in the Senate.

So too with Denmark. There are other parts of the Denmark model that Bernie and his fellow socialist candidates would want no part of. Again, from CNN.

As a small country heavily reliant on trade, Denmark imposes minimal tariffs on foreign goods. Businesses here are only lightly regulated. The corporate tax rate is much lower than in the United States, which has one of the highest in the world. There's not even a minimum wage in Denmark, although most workers are paid high salaries in large part due to the strength of labor unions. And in the past few years, Danish voters elected a right-of-center government, which has been instituting reforms that have put tighter restrictions on access to the long-held safety net.

Every Democrat candidate is pushing for a higher minimum wage, yet Denmark has none. Danish immigration policy would also be anathema to Democrats.

Denmark has some of the most aggressive anti-immigrant policies in Europe. That has included taking out foreign-newspaper adverts warning potential migrants that they are not welcome, and authorizing police to seize cash and valuables from arriving asylum seekers to offset the cost of their maintenance.

Denmark has an island, 3 kilometers off shore, to house “rejected asylum seekers.” Our Democrats whine about “kids in cages”, a policy started under a Democrat president. What if President Trump turned Catalina Island off the coast of Southern California into a giant detention center, following the Denmark model?

Let’s ask Bernie if he endorses Denmark’s other immigration policies including a burqa ban, mandatory schooling in “Danish values” for ghetto children, and required handshakes with immigration officials regardless of an immigrant’s beliefs about physical contact with members of the opposite sex.

A Danish People’s Party spokesman believes Trump’s policies on immigration are “too weak.”

We’re a small country, and what binds us is a common language, and a common set of traditions and values. If we let in a large number of foreigners with their own cultures, ours will be overwhelmed.

Imagine hearing that from any Democrat candidate.

Bernie is simply cherry picking the policies of Denmark, such as generous welfare benefits, that he finds attractive, ignoring the numerous programs that are far more aligned with Donald Trump than the modern Democrat Party.

The reality is that, as CNN notes, “Few Danish politicians today would characterize themselves as ‘socialist’ -- even a ‘democratic socialist’ -- as Sanders does.” Ironically Trump has already instituted many Danish policies that Bernie now criticizes Trump over.

Yet Bernie continues to sing the praises of Denmark as his utopia, with no scrutiny from the lapdog media over a more complete analysis of Danish policies. But make no mistake, Denmark is not the socialist utopia Bernie Sanders claims it to be.
 
February 24, 2020
No Bernie, Denmark is Not a Socialist Utopia
By Brian C. Joondeph

Socialist/communist presidential candidate Bernie Sanders loves to sing the praises of a small Scandinavian country, Denmark. It seems he has fallen out of love with his previous favorite countries, the Soviet Union and Cuba, which he “warmly praised” in the late 1980s.

After spurning the USSR, the country he spent his honeymoon in, shirtless, singing along drunkenly with his fellow communist comrades, he has moved on to northern Europe as representing his idea of utopia.

As CNN reported about Bernie’s newfound love,

Open a newspaper on any given day here in this small Europe nation known for high taxes, generous government services and its stubbornly happy citizens, and you'll almost certainly find a story about the U.S. presidential election.

"I think we should look to countries like Denmark, like Sweden and Norway," Sanders said, "and learn what they have accomplished for their working people."

Danes may indeed be happy, but they bristle at being called socialists.

"I would like to make one thing clear," Danish Prime Minister Lars Lokke Rasmussen said recently in a speech at Harvard's Kennedy School of Government. "Denmark is far from a socialist planned economy. Denmark is a market economy."

That hasn’t deterred Bernie, however. At a recent Democrat debate he proclaimed, "We should look to countries like Denmark, like Sweden and Norway, and learn from what they have accomplished for their working people."

So, what’s the magic in Denmark? Denmark is the second happiest country in the world, just behind Finland, according to CNN Travel. The US sits in 19th place. If you watch a Trump rally, you would find nothing but happiness. Compare that to a Bernie rally or a Democrat debate where the only messages are misery and victimhood.

Denmark is fortunate that they don’t have our 24-7 cable news networks preaching gloom and doom and a major political party telling everyone how rotten Denmark is, a nation of victims. Who could be happy listening to nonstop pessimism?

Denmark is far from a socialist economy; instead they are the type of market economy that Bernie and his fellow Democrat candidates rail against. The CIA World Factbook describes Denmark this way.

This thoroughly modern market economy features advanced industry with world-leading firms in pharmaceuticals, maritime shipping, and renewable energy, and a high-tech agricultural sector. Danes enjoy a high standard of living, and the Danish economy is characterized by extensive government welfare measures and an equitable distribution of income. An aging population will be a long-term issue.

Wow, a market economy, not big government controlling healthcare, energy, communications, and tech, as the Democrats desire for America. But these extensive welfare measures have a cost.

How does GDP per capita compare between the US and Denmark? In Denmark it’s $50,000, but in the US it’s 20 percent higher at $60,000.

Denmark, as a member of NATO, enjoys military protection paid mostly by America. The US spends 3.1 percent of GDP on defense, compared to 1.3 percent by Denmark, leaving them more to spend on their “extensive government welfare measures.”

This applies to most European countries, happy for America to pay for their national defense, leaving them more money for extended family leave and other benefits.

How do taxes compare? After all, how does Denmark pay for their welfare benefits? From CNN,

"Free" is actually the wrong word to describe these services. Danes pay some of the highest taxes in the world, including a 25% tax on all goods and services, a top marginal tax rate hovering near 60%. The top tax rate in the U.S., by comparison, is less than 40%.

Bernie’s tax plan calls for a top tax rate north of 50 percent. He also wants a wealth tax of up to 8 percent on the Michael Bloombergs and Warren Buffets of the world.

Nothing is truly free. Taxes simply take money from citizens, purchasing “benefits” that some use or want and others don’t. Minus a hefty administrative fee to redistribute everyone’s income. Hardly free.

What about some of Denmark’s programs that are more in line with Trump than with Bernie? Democrats are famous for situational praise and outrage.

For example, John Bolton was evil when he was nominated by George W Bush for UN Ambassador, but a saint when he was willing to testify in the Ukraine impeachment trial. Mitt Romney was a racist, sexist, reprobate when running for president against The One, but became Mother Theresa when he was the sole Republican casting a vote to convict President Trump in the Senate.

So too with Denmark. There are other parts of the Denmark model that Bernie and his fellow socialist candidates would want no part of. Again, from CNN.

As a small country heavily reliant on trade, Denmark imposes minimal tariffs on foreign goods. Businesses here are only lightly regulated. The corporate tax rate is much lower than in the United States, which has one of the highest in the world. There's not even a minimum wage in Denmark, although most workers are paid high salaries in large part due to the strength of labor unions. And in the past few years, Danish voters elected a right-of-center government, which has been instituting reforms that have put tighter restrictions on access to the long-held safety net.

Every Democrat candidate is pushing for a higher minimum wage, yet Denmark has none. Danish immigration policy would also be anathema to Democrats.

Denmark has some of the most aggressive anti-immigrant policies in Europe. That has included taking out foreign-newspaper adverts warning potential migrants that they are not welcome, and authorizing police to seize cash and valuables from arriving asylum seekers to offset the cost of their maintenance.

Denmark has an island, 3 kilometers off shore, to house “rejected asylum seekers.” Our Democrats whine about “kids in cages”, a policy started under a Democrat president. What if President Trump turned Catalina Island off the coast of Southern California into a giant detention center, following the Denmark model?

Let’s ask Bernie if he endorses Denmark’s other immigration policies including a burqa ban, mandatory schooling in “Danish values” for ghetto children, and required handshakes with immigration officials regardless of an immigrant’s beliefs about physical contact with members of the opposite sex.

A Danish People’s Party spokesman believes Trump’s policies on immigration are “too weak.”

We’re a small country, and what binds us is a common language, and a common set of traditions and values. If we let in a large number of foreigners with their own cultures, ours will be overwhelmed.

Imagine hearing that from any Democrat candidate.

Bernie is simply cherry picking the policies of Denmark, such as generous welfare benefits, that he finds attractive, ignoring the numerous programs that are far more aligned with Donald Trump than the modern Democrat Party.

The reality is that, as CNN notes, “Few Danish politicians today would characterize themselves as ‘socialist’ -- even a ‘democratic socialist’ -- as Sanders does.” Ironically Trump has already instituted many Danish policies that Bernie now criticizes Trump over.

Yet Bernie continues to sing the praises of Denmark as his utopia, with no scrutiny from the lapdog media over a more complete analysis of Danish policies. But make no mistake, Denmark is not the socialist utopia Bernie Sanders claims it to be.
Curious that Old Crusty keeps crowing about Scandinavian countries when it's so easy to debunk said crowings.
 
The free-healthers routinely default to Scandinavian countries and San Marino to gush over the benefits of their health care systems. Yet, they refuse to acknowledge the costs of their systems, their low populations compared to the US, their small amount of GDP spent on security which allows shifting of funds to pay for their healthcare and other differences unique to their countries compared to the US. It's never an apples to apples comparison.
 
I'm reminded of the smartest woman in the world.

With Sinbad the comedian, Sheryl Crow and a troop of reporters in tow, Hillary in a 2008 speech declared, "I remember landing in Bosnia under heavy sniper fire."

Did the free-healthers believe some of us might not do a bit of research?
I know right.
It's insulting that they think we're all too dumb to do the most basic due diligence.
 
If Bernie's ideal is Denmark, and Denmark isn't socialist, then is Bernie mistaken in calling himself socialist?
 
If Bernie's ideal is Denmark, and Denmark isn't socialist, then is Bernie mistaken in calling himself socialist?

Bernie’s ideal isn’t Denmark if you read that. His ideal is a fake Denmark that only exists in the minds of his zombie followers.

No minimum wage and reject island? Good luck reconciling that with the teenagers and women.
 
Bernie’s ideal isn’t Denmark if you read that. His ideal is a fake Denmark that only exists in the minds of his zombie followers.

No minimum wage and reject island? Good luck reconciling that with the teenagers and women.
46% of GDP is taxed. Poverty and food insecurity at half the OECD average. Universal Healthcare. Low income inequality. Strong labor unions. Generous unemployment benefits. Sounds pretty good.
 
Sign me up for this market capitalism:

The Danish state co-owns many enterprises such as Cheminova
and Scandinavian Airlines, and it also plays a potentially even more impor-
tant role as owner of one of the country’s largest investment pension founda-
tions, ATP. ATP’s investment policies about which companies to invest in
reveal the criteria and values that ATP and, therefore, the Danish state uses
ATP and, therefore, the Danish state uses to decide how to invest the Danish
citizens’ savings. Cheminova, Scandinavian Airlines and ATP have all expe-
rienced severe criticism of their social and environmental business conduct
about, for example, chemical products causing severe injuries among
Latin-American end-users, unrealistic high prices in illegal cartel-type alli-
ances, and economic investments in companies pursuing deforestation of vir-
gin rain forests to achieve attractive timber. The Danish state has defended
the state-owned enterprises’ actions when critiqued, and state-owned enter-
prises themselves have basically provided two types of crisis communication
strategies in response to the accusations of neglect of social and environmen-
tal responsibilities: either to answer that “we are in compliance with the law”
or “we are in dialogue with the relevant people and organizations and we try
to influence and change their behavior” as if the very process of “being in
dialogue” is sufficient to retain legitimacy (Christensen, Morsing, & Cheney,
2008). Such responses have left an impression of a government that denies
further responsibility.
Interestingly, while these Danish cases of state-owned enterprises’ lack of
responsibility stirred much media mention and debate about the role of the
state, they did not fundamentally question the role and legitimacy of the
Danish government or the politicians. Perhaps because no Danish citizens
died as in the New Zealand case. Perhaps because the Danes are a trusting
people. Perhaps too trusting? Or perhaps the Danish people have become
too welfare-complacent to insist on scrutiny of governance of state-owned
enterprises?
In the wake of these critical incidents for Danish state-owned enterprises,
it has been interesting to observe the Danish government launch of a “CSR
Action Plan” in 2008 with specific mention of the responsibility of state-
owned enterprises. A law was passed the same year making it compulsory for
the largest 1,000 companies to report annually on their CSR activities. A
central part of the CSR Action Plan focuses on activities for the Danish gov-
ernment to ensure that public authorities, including state-owned enterprises,
live up to the same CSR requirements as their privately owned corporate
counterparts. The Danish government’s CSR Action Plan very concretely
points at 10 initiatives to ensure social responsibility in corporate, state, and
other public activities, and for the purpose of this essay, it is particularly
interesting to note that two of these initiatives specifically target state-owned
enterprises: The government will (a) include state-owned enterprises in the
legislation about compulsory annual CSR reporting and (b) the government
will have all state-owned enterprises sign the UN Global Compact (http://
www.samfundsansvar.dk/sw60606.asp).
While a legislation concerning state-owned enterprises has so far not been
passed, normative pressure and encouragement from the Danish Government
and the National Council for Social Responsibility have made the state-
owned enterprise SKI (the central authority for all state purchases) start a
comprehensive reorganizing process to ensure that sourcing and investing
include social and environmental considerations. SKI has, as I write, made a
special announcement that they are now going through all their suppliers and
will prioritize as most preferred suppliers those that have demonstrated
adherence to the United Nation’s Global Compact principles. In that process,
SKI will naturally deselect those that do not.
 
Danish employees are entitled to 1/3 of all corporate board seats. But it is socialism for Bernie to call for 1/5.
 
That's a pretty tough needle to thread, Dan. Bernie is a socialist, but the country he want's to emulate isn't?
By your own admission a few days ago Bernie is far more radical than the supposed socialism in Denmark. He just uses Denmark because he thinks it is an easier sell. So, no, by your own admission he does not want to emulate Denmark. We can only hope he doesn’t secretly want to emulate Cuba.
 
By your own admission a few days ago Bernie is far more radical than the supposed socialism in Denmark. He just uses Denmark because he thinks it is an easier sell. So, no, by your own admission he does not want to emulate Denmark. We can only hope he doesn’t secretly want to emulate Cuba.
My bad Dan, he wants to emulate also not Socialist Norway.
 
My bad Dan, he wants to emulate also not Socialist Norway.
I’m not going to bother looking up the thread to quote you directly, but if memory serves you said he’d take as much socialism as he could get, or something along that line. So, no, by your own admission he doesn’t want to emulate Norway either. He wants as much socialism as he can get As much socialism as he can get would fall in line with Stalin, Mao, Castro, Chavez. You might as well fess up to what Bernie really wants.
 
I’m not going to bother looking up the thread to quote you directly, but if memory serves you said he’d take as much socialism as he could get, or something along that line. So, no, by your own admission he doesn’t want to emulate Norway either. He wants as much socialism as he can get As much socialism as he can get would fall in line with Stalin, Mao, Castro, Chavez. You might as well fess up to what Bernie really wants.
Dan in 8 years starting in 2021 in the United States of America do you think president Bernie Sanders can exceed Norwegian levels of socialism? Is Norway on the slow road to Stalinism or is it a different path?
 
Dan in 8 years starting in 2021 in the United States of America do you think president Bernie Sanders can exceed Norwegian levels of socialism? Is Norway on the slow road to Stalinism or is it a different path?
Pointless argument, Pilt. Bernie wants more socialism than Norway.
 
Yes it is. Just the 2 main Socialist policies of Medicare and Social Security are bankrupting the country. And you idiots want to add tens if not hundreds of trillions more in Socialist spending.
Bankrupting the country? Is that even possible?

(it is not possible)
 
Bankrupting the country? Is that even possible?

(it is not possible)

If you want to continue to print money our of thin air we could spend what ever you wanted. How many trillions in unfunded liabilities do we have currently? It's estimated widely to be between 45 trillion to well over 200 trillion, and you want to add hundreds of trillions more.
 
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If you want to continue to print money our of thin air we could spend what ever you wanted. How many trillions in unfunded liabilities do we have currently? It's estimated widely to be between 45 trillion to well over 200 trillion, and you want to add hundreds of trillions more.
meaningless drivel.
Please start shorting US Treasuries in light of our pending bankruptcy. I'd like to see you get rich off of your predictions.
 
If you want to continue to print money our of thin air we could spend what ever you wanted. How many trillions in unfunded liabilities do we have currently? It's estimated widely to be between 45 trillion to well over 200 trillion, and you want to add hundreds of trillions more.
Please send this to the Trump campaign.

Bernie is a Socialist!
Social Security and Medicare are Socialism!
Social Security and Medicare are bankrupting us and must be cut!
Trump 2020!
 
MV5BMTMyOTQ2MzUxNF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwMjYyMjYwNw@@._V1_.jpg

100% Dane
Not sure what percent for or against Socialism
 
Please send this to the Trump campaign.

Bernie is a Socialist!
Social Security and Medicare are Socialism!
Social Security and Medicare are bankrupting us and must be cut!
Trump 2020!

Never said anything about cutting either program but I did say both are bankrupting the country. Whether you want to admit it or not both programs will need to either face major reforms or receive more funding to keep them viable in the future. As it is they are both unsustainable according to the governments own reports.
I suspect the reason Democrats are pushing for Medicare for All is to cover up the fact Medicare is going broke and they do not want to admit it or deal with it.
 
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