PSU will continue to get the recruits they want and everyone else will have to take the remaining kids and hope to develop them.
They are unbelievable
They are unbelievable
NCAAs 2022
- Thread starter TheJimReaper
- Start date
I think it’s great for the sport it’s going to force coaches to get better and change to catch them. Get off that old ass and do something new
Those refs in the Brooks- Amine match were terrible. They allowed Brooks to hang on, shove Amine out of bounds for 3 or 4 minutes and would not call stalling. Absolutely no attempts to turn. Also they called Amine for stalling and he reached off the mat because Brooks had 1 foot in bounds and was holding Amine. Those refs got played for fools which Cormier said.
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Sanderson isn’t going anywhere and he is not old at all.
Pretty sure same ref that called the quick stalemate in the Fix-Suriano finals.
Penn State likely gonna have 5 Champs. Please tell me some of them are not coming back?!?
Our 5 NCAA Champs finally got some love
Lee is a Sr I think but I bet 4 come back. Rby seems like he will now. Their heavy will be top 2 next year also so they won’t miss a beat
Correct.Barring injury which is rare for them the NCAA can go ahead and send them the trophy.
I’m sick of them as well but you’ve got to consider that Sanderson is only 8 of 11 from the start of his Penn St. career while Dan Gable was 9 of 11 to start his at Iowa. Gable then went on to be 15 of 20 and then Zalesky and Brands continued for a total of 21 of 33 through 2011. I’ve been an OSU fan for all but the first two years so let me know how you feel after 10 or 20 more years of nearly the same crap. (pardon the edits) (damn found another mistake left out Ohio State 2015 Caels numbers just went down)
I’ve also been a Red Sox fan since 1976; do I know how to pick ‘em.
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Yep, Cormier said our 5 was the greatest of all time. He is right but God that was a long time ago.
Rex Holt really trying hard to put a positive spin on things...but reality is we're a long way from winning another natty IMO.
Ya and so is everyone other than penn state .
Us old guys went thru that horrible time also with Iowa dominating. There were special times since the 70's when Seay won in 1989 and 1990 before he blew it when we were being investigated and Seay convinced our wrestlers to lie because he was told by our Administration your gone if you get us on probation. We went on probation and won in 1994 with Pat Smith, Alan Fried and Mark Branch winning individual titles with John Smith being the Coach. Alan Fried gave up a year of competing at Nationals and stuck with us and our probation. Then came the best with us winning 4 titles in 2003, 2004, 2005 and 2006 with John Smith the Coach. Then we did something wrong( don't know what we did) and went on some probation and we dropped like a rock. This time reminds me of the 70's and 80's because Old Number Nine unless we jump a level as a Program we are well on the way of experiencing Penn. St. matching that Iowa run.
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Now for the real dynasty: Ed Gallagher, 9/11 and 10/12 (same as Gable); Art Griffith, 6/11, 7/12 & 9/14; Myron Roderick, 7/11, 7/12 & 7/13. 27 of 40 from 1928 thru 1971. (for reference Gable was 9/11, 10/12, 10/14 & 16/22; same as Gallagher (11yrs) 1 better than Griffith (14yrs))
Those old OSU guys had it made.
We are finally doing it also right now, with packed recruiting classes. We changed the amount of scholarship money we are giving to different wrestlers or who we are giving it to and maybe giving more academic scholarships. I think with the 2020 class where we were better than Penn. St and the 2021 class where they were a little better than us, 2022 class I think we were a little better. With the 2023 class that isn't done we are rated 4th and Penn. St 8th. I think we will have their level of talent maybe in 2023 so we will see what we can do with that talent. The reason being they beat us in recruiting prior to 2020 by a great deal.
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We have hit a high point with recruiting since 2020 through next years 2023 class. This will dry up if we flounder like we did this year. We need to win a title or 2 in the next 3 years.
This year is Sanderson’s 9th championship team at PSU. I feel extremely spoiled as a PSU fan and hope he stays a long, long time. I think your recruiting has picked up in recent years and Ok St will be back in the hunt very soon.
RTC has helped PSU greatly. Sanderson is absolutely whipping everyone’s ass in match coaching , scouting , recruiting and development. It’s not even close either. He is the modern Goat of coaching
Daton seemed to want to have a tug of war with RBY pushing him or trying to muscle him. I have heard Datan say many times I wrestle my best when my feet are moving and I'm shooting takedowns. He did this senior trials and in the World Championships. But in the NCAA finals he seems to freeze. As painful as it was for us to watch the nightmare continues for Datan. Those that think well he is a 3 time finalist, I remember Datan saying i think about these final losses every day.
Harley, just one point. I think there are a couple of big flaws with recruiting class rankings. The first is they don't include transfers. Beard was ranked #11 on the final 2018 Big Board & Nevills was ranked #22. They didn't develop at PSU so they were replaced by transfers - Beard by a prior NCAA finalist (Dean) and Nevills by the #1 recruit in 2019 (Kerkvliet). The class rankings don't reflect it.
The other flaw is they don't weight top 10 PFP recruits enough IMO. Everyone misses on recruits, but top 10s have the best chance to succeed. And PSU gets more top 10s than anyone. After them it's OhioSt. We get about the same number of top 10s as Iowa.
Wrassler, you are right neither Flo nor I considered transfers which Penn. St. does well and us not so much. You are also right about superstars being way more valuable then real good wrestlers. Getting to the finals is where the big points come or wrestling for 3rd or 4th. Not a lot of points for finishing 5th thru 8th. Maybe it is just hopeful thinking on my part but since 2020 have they recruited that top 10 pound for pound that isn't showing some human qualities. Levi Haines lost to the kid you mentioned from California, Van Ness has some injury problems or he might have wrestled 149 this year, Facundo took several surprising losses this year redshirting, Bartlett I think will be a star at 141 and Howard has shoulder problems and surgery I think. However before 2020 you have RBY, Starocci, Kerkvliet and Brooks who are those superstars that you are talking about. I suspect you are right that our talent isn't quite up to theirs, and everything seems to be rolling Sanderson's including ref decisions and recruiting kids who have unbelievable confidence and are at their best under pressure ( very rare).
Harley, I agree about the unknowns regarding PSU's 2020-22 recruits. On paper they should be elite, but we'll have to see how they develop.
Here are the top 10 PFP guys on each roster based on the final Big Boards...
OSU
- Daton #1 in 2017
- Wittlake #6 in 2018
- AJ #10 in 2020 (but should have been #1)
- Plott #11 in 2020 (but should have been top 5)
It's probably no coincidence those 4 will be our returning AAs next year.
PSU
- Manville #5 in 2016 (seems like a bust)
- Berge #6 in 2017 (hasn't AAd yet)
- Nick Lee #9 in 2017
- Brooks #2 in 2018
- Kerkvliet #1 in 2019
- Starocci #9 in 2019
- Bartlett #4 in 2020
- Howard #7 in 2020
- Facundo #2 in 2021
- Van Ness #4 in 2021
- Haines currently #7 in 2022
Here are the top 10 PFP guys on each roster based on the final Big Boards...
OSU
- Daton #1 in 2017
- Wittlake #6 in 2018
- AJ #10 in 2020 (but should have been #1)
- Plott #11 in 2020 (but should have been top 5)
It's probably no coincidence those 4 will be our returning AAs next year.
PSU
- Manville #5 in 2016 (seems like a bust)
- Berge #6 in 2017 (hasn't AAd yet)
- Nick Lee #9 in 2017
- Brooks #2 in 2018
- Kerkvliet #1 in 2019
- Starocci #9 in 2019
- Bartlett #4 in 2020
- Howard #7 in 2020
- Facundo #2 in 2021
- Van Ness #4 in 2021
- Haines currently #7 in 2022
Harley, I must say I have enjoyed reading your post tourney posts. I believe that some, if not most of the regulars here see you as a bit of a Negative Nancy during the season. I disagree with that even if I disagree with your opinion. Your opinions seem to be intelligently considered, clearly explained and without personal vitriol. While I will agree that your regular season posts may seem more of the glass-half-empty type, I believe most (not nearly all) who have spoken, post-NCAA, have been of the half empty-type if not nearly empty. Yours, however, have been more of the half-full variety which I find very refreshing. Kudos to you and go Pokes next season.
If RBY returns next year I don’t know why we wouldn’t consider bumping Daton to 141 and have Carter Young wrestle at a weight he would likely have better size for at 133. Seems like that would be the best move for points and I don’t think there is anyone at 141 who Daton can’t beat. I would really like to see Daton win one and there is no shame in bumping up to do it. Especially if it gives the team the best chance at a NC.
That’s not a bad idea…if you were going to move Daton, wouldn’t 125 make more sense? Flip him with Mastro?
It's a possibility, but I can see a couple of reasons why Daton going 141 might be unlikely. The first is Daton has chased the competition his whole career, so bumping up to avoid RBY doesn't seem to fit his DNA. In HS he registered for Super32 to go after Suriano and he registered for FloNats to go after Yianni. To me, Daton going 125 might make more sense because he could challenge Spencer Lee. Then you can redshirt Mastro.
The other thing is Daton's weight has to fit into his Olympic plans. He has a bye into the Final X finals @ 61 KG this year. If he makes the World Team and medals again, he'll get another bye in 2023, either to the finals at 61 KG or the semifinals at 57 KG (think that's correct). So he'll need to decide what college weight puts him in the best position to set up his goal of making the 2024 Olympic team.
The other thing is Daton's weight has to fit into his Olympic plans. He has a bye into the Final X finals @ 61 KG this year. If he makes the World Team and medals again, he'll get another bye in 2023, either to the finals at 61 KG or the semifinals at 57 KG (think that's correct). So he'll need to decide what college weight puts him in the best position to set up his goal of making the 2024 Olympic team.
I think if he wants to win a NC he needs to go 141. It’s time to win, not chase others to prove that your better. That doesn’t put the team in the best position to win. I like Carter at 133 and a healthy Mastro at 125. Putting Carter on a equal playing field physically will help him a lot.
I think Daton’s priorities are more for FS so come Olympics I’m sure he will do what’s best for himself. But in the meantime let’s be thinking what’s best for myself and my team.
I think Daton’s priorities are more for FS so come Olympics I’m sure he will do what’s best for himself. But in the meantime let’s be thinking what’s best for myself and my team.
