Pat Mieno
- Thread starter slickr3
- Start date
Am assuming you mean Mark Perry Jr. He was hired by Illiois as Assoc Coach to hopefully take over as head coach at some point. He had been head coach at believe Cal Poly for a year before went to Illinois. Some thought maybe he'd go from IL to Iowa head coach when Brands steps down. Well after ~2years it was apparent he was not head coach material, so NO.
Fair enough. Still, I hope the team doesn't aspire to wrestle like him. He has the hardware, but I can't get with the aesthetics.
Here's a really good Chris Perry interview. Discusses his HS & college careers, including injuries and his mental preparation. Towards the end of the interview, he talks about that Howe final at NCAAs. Says Howe's style was super physical, but Perry went into the match very confident because he was pepared for a fight rather a wrestling match.
I think he is currently in a good spot for his talents, he is doing well there.
Right?
I mean, Smith did wrestle for OSU. So have pretty much all the OSU wrestling coaches. But still. What is the benefit besides nostalgia/the feels/tradition to insisting on having a former OSU wrestler as HC? Is there no room for creating new traditions? Wouldn't a tradition of winning and excellence with an outsider HC be better than a so-so performance with an insider HC? We've done the adhere-to-the-family-at-all-costs thing with Chris Perry as assistant coach and Joe Smith strangling the mid-upper weight lineup and Wyatt occupying 157 for however many years. The OSU family is a good pool, but its hard for me to buy the idea that we should not look at non-OSUers at all if they're hungry for the challenge and Stillwater/Payne County is a place they want to relocate to and stay at.
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I can understand looking around, but loving the place you are coaching at is an irreplaceable trait. If it is close, I would pick the guy with OSU history.
God bless optimism, but our RTC isn't gonna be able to get someone like Burroughs - we're light years away from that level. HC is a great spot, but it isn't the job it would have been when we won #34.
Several things:
Is it really John’s decision or the athletic director’s? Just wondering if anyony really knows are we just giving opinions here. I love everything about Chris, I say give him a shot and kick him to the curb if it doesn’t work out.
I’m also fine with any other OSU alum, in order: Branch, Pendleton, Scott, Popolizio and others but never Mark Perry. I know he couldn’t beat Hendricks out but Iowa? That’s worse than OU; unforgivable.
Remember what happened the last time we went outside of the OSU “family”: probation/2 championships.
Also, here’s a short list of coaches with no previous head-coach experience that took over major wrestling teams and worked out ok: Roderick, Gable, Smith, Sanderson(ISU)… the list goes on.
Lastly, what about Pat Smith for the RTC Coach to start. His getting kind of old so let him get it going, get assistants, grom his replacment and step down back in the OSU fold.
Is it really John’s decision or the athletic director’s? Just wondering if anyony really knows are we just giving opinions here. I love everything about Chris, I say give him a shot and kick him to the curb if it doesn’t work out.
I’m also fine with any other OSU alum, in order: Branch, Pendleton, Scott, Popolizio and others but never Mark Perry. I know he couldn’t beat Hendricks out but Iowa? That’s worse than OU; unforgivable.
Remember what happened the last time we went outside of the OSU “family”: probation/2 championships.
Also, here’s a short list of coaches with no previous head-coach experience that took over major wrestling teams and worked out ok: Roderick, Gable, Smith, Sanderson(ISU)… the list goes on.
Lastly, what about Pat Smith for the RTC Coach to start. His getting kind of old so let him get it going, get assistants, grom his replacment and step down back in the OSU fold.
Like Pat Smith for the RTC. And TBH, at this point, who cares about probation - I mean, how about just winning one? Hell, how about getting someone that's been program-developed to win an individual title - we're approaching a decade since someone that was really developed in the program won one.
I can confirm that these rumors are all false. John isn't stepping down.
This probably isn't his last season, though he is about to turn 60 and I doubt he coaches forever.
And all of this extra drama that Mineo has been drumming up is nothing. The Ferraris are gone, and those two are responsible for pretty much the whole gambit of issues. The administration fully supports John Smith. He isn't going anywhere unless he decides to. It will be fully on his terms.
So, if you are a top 10 recruit from California (or any state outside Oklahoma), and you are on the phone with Tom Brands recruiting you.. who would have to be calling in to make you say “coach, I gotta put you on hold for a second”?
We are losing to teams that are coached by the names on that short list. John Smith, Cael Sanderson/Kyle Snyder/Jake Varner, Tom Ryan, Zeke Jones, are a few names on that short list. And I think Jordan Burroughs is on that list too, although not exactly coaching yet.
The nostalgic fan faithful of Payne county wouldn’t be excited with Burroughs, but everyone outside of it would be. Burroughs is a close second to John as the most successful American freestyler in history, and he’s not done yet. I think the tradition of Oklahoma State having elite leadership is best served with a Burroughs type hire.
If not Burroughs, I like Esposito or Perry. Their loyalty and work ethic are second to none for Oklahoma State and that matters a lot to me.
We are losing to teams that are coached by the names on that short list. John Smith, Cael Sanderson/Kyle Snyder/Jake Varner, Tom Ryan, Zeke Jones, are a few names on that short list. And I think Jordan Burroughs is on that list too, although not exactly coaching yet.
The nostalgic fan faithful of Payne county wouldn’t be excited with Burroughs, but everyone outside of it would be. Burroughs is a close second to John as the most successful American freestyler in history, and he’s not done yet. I think the tradition of Oklahoma State having elite leadership is best served with a Burroughs type hire.
If not Burroughs, I like Esposito or Perry. Their loyalty and work ethic are second to none for Oklahoma State and that matters a lot to me.
Could be true but can you name any successful teams coached by current/recent stars? That said I do thing JB would make a great HC.
The obvious answer is Cael, but I get your point, e.g. McCoy didn't work; Kolat only sorta worked in starts n stops; jury is still out on Colman Scott; Varner and Matcalf are still assistants.
Neither are the Brands bros.
I understand Ridge Lovett's story is out there... but for the most part John Smith is very much a superstar in the sport still. Every kid coming up is watching those "How Low Can You Go" videos. The concepts he invented are now fundamentals. We've had kids that picked OSU over Nebraska while Jordan Burroughs was still there because of John Smith. Jakason Burkes being the most recent example (and I know that didn't pan out, but he still signed and spent a year in the room).
I understand Ridge Lovett's story is out there... but for the most part John Smith is very much a superstar in the sport still. Every kid coming up is watching those "How Low Can You Go" videos. The concepts he invented are now fundamentals. We've had kids that picked OSU over Nebraska while Jordan Burroughs was still there because of John Smith. Jakason Burkes being the most recent example (and I know that didn't pan out, but he still signed and spent a year in the room).
2022 Top 10
Penn State, Iowa and ASU are the ones coached by "stars" recent or no. The rest are guys who were varying degrees of good.
It doesn't seem necessary if you have a different story to tell for why a recruit should wrestle for you. But all of those programs took a lot of building.
Penn State, Iowa and ASU are the ones coached by "stars" recent or no. The rest are guys who were varying degrees of good.
It doesn't seem necessary if you have a different story to tell for why a recruit should wrestle for you. But all of those programs took a lot of building.
I say if the guy has not taken Orebero down, he is ineligible for the position. How many guys on the list have ever taken you down Orebero?
Are we including forum debate in this "take down?"
Oklahoma State isn't coached by a "star"? But ASU is? Typo?
I thought that Chris Perry wrestled smart. He and the coaches realized that he could not go toe to toe with Howe and beat him on his feet. He had to figure out a way to not get into a catch and release game with Howe and he wrestled the most intelligent match I had ever witnessed. They spotted the only weakness on Howe's takedown game and exploited it after Perry got the escape. Then the match became can Howe escape from Perry. Game over. That match was fun to watch, just like the Big 12 tourney was.
And keep Perry/Espo as assistant coaches? Or...
Another option, if John enjoys the coaching but not the administrative side (which seems to be the case sometimes) maybe keep him as HC and bring in a shark to shore up the RTC/marketing/promotional/PR/financial side of things. Maybe the business side of things has been getting in the way of John's ability to focus on the in-person aspects of his squad. Pure speculation of course.
Again, fair enough. But I wonder If RBY and co. had the same conversation about Fix, e.g. we can't pull Fix out of his stance bc he's too strong, his scrambling ability from our leg attacks is unmatched, and we can't get into over under situations, so we gotta bide our time . . . stand there and look at him ... in order to draw him out of his comfort zone. The short answer is no. RBY wasn't scared of Fix. Fix was the one just staring at RBY.
What you see as the perfect, even "exciting" game plan, strikes me as reactive and scared.
Did it work for Perry vs Howe. . . and Brown . . . and Evans? Yeah, but it was ugly . . . I mean, like, Heil-ugly. Didn't look like go-for-broke Johnny Thompson. Didn't look Mack-truck Dieringer. Didn't look like pick-you-apart Pendelton. As a fan, I just want to see guys with more confidence, less chess and more sledge hammers.
I agree Chris could have been more aggressive at times, but he's talked about the 2013 & 2014 NCAAs before.
In 2013 he dislocated his elbow at Big12s and John kept him off the mat for 2 weeks. When he drilled for the first time at Nationals with Mark, he screamed out in pain because it was his grip hand. He won that year with only 1 takedown during the NCAA tournament.
In 2014 he was locked in on Howe. Said Howe was the best competitor he's ever faced. A real warrior. During their Big12 final, he told the ref during a review that the call didn't matter because they would meet again in 2 weeks for the title anyway. Also said he looked past Evans in the semis because he was focused on Howe. And in the final, he was setting up that takedown because he'd seen Kyle Dake hit it against Howe at the trials.
You just put into words what I've been failing to for several years now. Thanks! It is more exciting to have that kind of energy. Just seems like we wrestle a reserved style now... so many tie-ups
Yes, though I’d like Espo to leave and go be a head coach somewhere to see what he’s got. Same with Perry at some point but right now we need his recruiting. I see John being like Gable was…more of an ambassador and a co-coach in the room daily….not really doing much administration work but throwing his weight around when necessary.
2022 Top 10 for reference:
2022 NCAA Wrestling Championships Standings
1. Penn State, 131.5
2. Michigan, 95.0
3. Iowa, 74.0
4. Arizona State, 66.5
5. Nebraska, 59.5
6. Northwestern, 57.5
7. Cornell, 54.5
8. Virginia Tech, 52.5
9. Missouri, 49.5
10. NC State, 49.0
More context.
2021 Top 10 for reference:
- 1-Iowa, 129.0
- 2-Penn State, 113.5
- 3-Oklahoma State, 99.5
- 4-Arizona State, 74.0
- 5-Michigan, 69.0
- 6-N.C. State, 68.0
- 7-Minnesota, 64.0
- 7-Missouri, 64.0
- 9-Ohio State, 46.5
- 10-Northwestern, 45.0
| 1 | Penn State | 137.5 |
| 2 | Ohio State | 96.5 |
| 3 | Oklahoma State | 84 |
| 4 | Iowa | 76 |
| 5 | Michigan | 62.5 |
| 6 | Missouri | 62 |
| 7 | Cornell | 59.5 |
| 8 | Minnesota | 53.5 |
| 9 | Rutgers | 51.5 |
| 10 | Nebraska | 51 |
