Yes, I know that. Not often, but sometimes a sentiment on this board drives me crazy.
Jonah Goldberg Chats With George Will
- Thread starter Ponca Dan
- Start date
Considering my hatred for Obama makes me look like a Trump loyalist, no my lips aren’t anything but normal color.
I’ve written so much I don’t recall accusing you of writing an entire post of talking points. Actually I don’t recall responding to you at all on this thread. But I agree you are one of the few on here that doesn’t just regurgitate talking points. That’s one of the things that makes you one of my favorite posters. If I said that to you please allow me to retract!
@Ponca Dan - I wasn't around here for the 2015/2016 Primary campaigns. If things had gone your way, who would be the President of the United States today?
I suppose that Trump supporters feel it incumbent upon themselves to defend him with the same, over the top, outspokenness as the vile, disgusting liars that disparage him 24/7.
Is he a perfect guy?
No, and until you haters present someone at least equal or better..
He's all we've got.
Is he a perfect guy?
No, and until you haters present someone at least equal or better..
He's all we've got.
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What I would ask of you is to understand I am not one of the over the top, outspoken, vile, disgusting liars that disparage him 24/7. I am a hard core libertarian that presents a philosophical approach to all analysis of any politician. My disdain for Trump centers on my antipathy for economic mercantilism and the fact that he has John Bolton anywhere near a lever of power. My “defense” of George Will comes from fury that pro-Trump acolytes smear the reputation of a man whose reputation is impeccable.
No, it was “None of the Above.” Failing that it became “Anybody But Hillary.”
And there it is. You got emotional because someone dared dismiss your "prince." You're trying to lump Trump supporters into a monolith that fits George Will's narrative on Trump supporters and you're refusing to consider that there are plenty of Trump supporters that don't fit his stereotype. That's using talking points 101.
Not everyone worships George Will, Dan. There are plenty of Trump supporters that aren't conservatives and are damn happy that Trump isn't one either.
Fair enough I won't lump you in with the sys's or PAB's those of that ilk are off rails with TDS.
I do believe you are also creating a caricature of most of the Trump supporters on here and you are way off base.
Neither do I worship George Will. I did not get emotional because someone dared to dismiss him. They publicly vilified him as a deep state supporting traitor. That far exceeds him being “dismissed.” He is an incredibly intelligent man that has spent over half a century arguing on behalf of what he considers to be conservative virtues, small government interference in the daily lives of ordinary people. He has been wary of the Republican Party since the Nixon years, and has never failed to criticize the “establishment” when he felt it was needed.
You also misstate Will’s narrative about Trump supporters. He actually speaks about them very little. He understands perfectly what has driven them into Trump’s camp, agrees they are correct to reject the politics of the last few decades. But he thinks they are making a Faustian Bargain that will ultimately explode in their faces.
The monolith I have described does not come from anything George Will has said, but rather observations from posters on this board, as I have said a couple of times now. I don’t know If the always-Trumpsters are representative of Trump supporters as a whole. I suspect they are. I get my tv news from Fox, and that network has become for Trump what CNN was for Bill Clinton. I hear the opinion setters on Fox and the next day I see it repeated on this board.
I would edit you comment in one regard. I would say there are NO supporters of Trump that are true conservatives. Will is a true conservative. It’s only natural he would argue against the pull toward a Big-Government nationalism as espoused and practiced by our president. His disagreement is reasonable, objective and not emotion driven. The slurs used against him by some people on this board are out of line.
You may be right. Can you explain in detail where I’m in error? Do you not agree that one of them - at least once! - would find something the man has proposed or acted upon with which they are in serious disagreement? At least one of them one time in 2+ years? I do believe there is a stereotype Trump supporter that resembles my caricature. Of course they do not all fit the stereotype, but there are enough of them to make the stereotype/caricature plausible. I am open to you showing me my mistake.
You've done this exact same thing while trying to hide under George Will's skirt while doing it.
For most of us Trump supporters on this board, it has nothing to do with loyalty to Trump and everything to do with his ability to expose the left's desire for an authoritarian dictatorship style of socialism for America. It's unfortunate that Trump had to be the one because he's appalling in so many ways, but no Republicans or Democrats had the balls to engage the Marxist left at its own game. His I don't give a shit what they say approach is exactly what the US needed and his timing was impeccable.
This thread's only value is that it illustrates completely why Donald Trump was elected president of the United States and will be re-elected again next year. People like Will and Goldberg have said around for years writing their lofty columns all while conservatism completely capitulates to the left at almost every turn. Some really great columns were wrote by these guys and many others all while taxes were raised, healthcare socialized and our men and women were sent overseas to die in senseless wars costing us trillions.
Lots of highbrow talk with zero action.
I posted here some days back how the conservative Heritage Foundation credits Trump with implementing more of its agenda in a short amount of time than Reagan was able to push through in his full eight years as president.
That's the only value this thread has. Other than that it should have died off many responses ago.
Lots of highbrow talk with zero action.
I posted here some days back how the conservative Heritage Foundation credits Trump with implementing more of its agenda in a short amount of time than Reagan was able to push through in his full eight years as president.
That's the only value this thread has. Other than that it should have died off many responses ago.
George Will - Deep State
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/oct/14/deep-state-conservatives/
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/oct/14/deep-state-conservatives/
That’s an outstanding point, which proves neither Goldberg nor Will are spokesmen for the deep state. It explains why they have both disparaged the so-called conservative Republican leadership throughout the years. They have watched appalled as Republican leaders talked the “small government” talk while walking the big government walk. What you are failing to see is nothing much has changed under the current administration. Spending is out the roof. Military involvement continues unabated, and with the NeoCons in charge there is a very real danger of it going ballistic. You are so joyous that the establishment is getting poked in the eye you fail to recognize the only thing that has changed has been the names of the people in charge. The Big-Government Nationalism of Donald Trump will lead us to the same unhappy conclusion as the Big-Government Socialism of the Democrats. Do you notice the similar adjective that defines both political philosophies? It is important for all of us to understand that neither team has our best interest in mind. They are both after authority to tell us all what to do. What do you care which team is using the lash? It’s your back that will feel the pain.
Goldberg and Will. Weird hill to die on Dan.
Also weird for a libertarian to defend them so valiantly.
Just a couple of new world order dinosaurs.
Also weird for a libertarian to defend them so valiantly.
Just a couple of new world order dinosaurs.
That’s the best you can come up with after a frantic google search? A reporter briefly calls Will a proponent of the deep state? Come on! Surely you can dig up something better than that! Why don’t you watch the video and then critique it for it’s deep state advocacy? Use your own skills to prove Will is what you say. It’s about a 45 minute conversation between two Never-Trumpers. Surely you can find a deep state promotion out of 45 minutes of two never-Trumpers talking. Let’s hear what YOU think. Can you do that?
That, and they at least tacitly believe the US being in open ended, 6 guys killed a week wars is a GOOD thing for America.
Of course they are. Their benefactors demand it.
No, not dying. Still standing! (Although I’m about out of energy when it’s five or six against one. Plus my phone is down to 18%, so I’m about to shut it down for the night anyway. Plus the Cardinal game is about to start.)
I agree with Goldberg and Will much more than disagree. They’re neither one pure libertarians, but they both espouse enough libertarian principles that I am comfortable in defending them, especially against such spurious and indefensible slanders.
I’ll say it again, Mega, you surprise me the most. I thought you would take the time to watch the interview, at least a little of it. I would bet you might have a change of mind if you did, at least as it regards your take on Goldberg and Will,
And with that my phone is losing strength. I’m shutting it down for the night. Thanks, everybody! I apologize for getting testy. That’s not usually my style. I thought this was fun! I hope you did, too.
Is that the best you can come up with... charging me with the crime of using Google (just as you do?). Dude, your feelings are hurt like a school girl over this thread. You sure have thin skin when people say bad things about your irrelevant, old-timer, 1980's hero. Get over it. Those days are long gone forever.
Eh, let him have the geezers.
Hell, I'd listen to Michael Savage over them.
I don't necessarily like Michael Savage, BTW.
You typed this entire novel of a thread on a phone? That deserves some sort of trophy.
I like listening to the Savage Nation when I can. I like the guy's humor and he hits the nail on the head often.
FIFY (fixed it for you)
I am entirely familiar with their bodies of work. I’m extremely disappointed in their neocon establishment agendas at this point. It’s revealed their loyalties and I find it sad.
He's OK if he's not whining...
"They won't invite me to the White House".
Gets tedious and cringy.
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There are quite a few things Trump has done I disagree with or outright dislike. I am very perturbed at the budgets he's signed I am a fiscal hawk and want the government bureaucracy reduced to the bare minimum. I believe there are entire agencies that need to be eliminated and the resonsibilities returned to the states. Particularly education.
I'm not a fan of Saudi Arabia and think we should demand more of them to reform and take more responsibility in policing the Middle East while we reduce our presence to the bare minimum. I don't want another American to die in Afghanistan or Iraq. Get out, now.
The reason you think we are all lemmings that just blindly defend everything is because what is done by the opposition is to try and tear the man apart 24/7. They call him every vile thing they can, deny his accomplishments and denagrate his supporters.
So we have no time to dwell on his negatives we are to busy defending the positives which are much greater than the negatives.
Outside of you there are no anti-Trumpers, at least on here, that will even debate an issue or offer an alternative. It's a hate Trump marathon that never ends and his supporters are sick of it and if we come across as blind followers then so be it, we know our real motivations and the haters can go to hell.
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You don't know jack shit about who I am, what i believe, what motivates me, etc. You haven't exposed anything about me to me or in any other way.
Your hubris is off the charts. You couch it in your soft words, but in reality you are a sad bitter man.
But that doesn't stop you from making a bunch of bullshit assumptions and then basing some stupid argument on it.
Here are some new flashes dipshit. I've read Will and Goldberg for 20+ years. I don't need your condescending ass to tell me who they are.
I don't need to go picking at the President to find some stupid faults. He's doing about 90% of what I hoped he would do, which is about 1000x more than any other president in my lifetime.
Please continue to post your drivel. Plenty of us will answer.
@Ponca Dan I went back and listened to the entire podcast.
Really more of intellectual discussion on their beliefs on conservatism, obviously anti populism. I really didn't hear anything about current events or what they would be doing differently than Trump.
Found it kinda dry and dull but listenable.
Really more of intellectual discussion on their beliefs on conservatism, obviously anti populism. I really didn't hear anything about current events or what they would be doing differently than Trump.
Found it kinda dry and dull but listenable.
Spot on. Anyone with a lick of intellectual honesty already knows this. This is a brilliant insight into the truth of Trump support on this board.
If the OP would occasionally post about something other than tariffs or links to neocon losers, he would know this.
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