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Intervention or Resignation

tlwwake

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Moderator
Oct 29, 2008
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We are on a national trajectory toward seeing what happens when the immovable object of Donald Trump collides with the unstoppable force of the Democrat resistance. The outcome will be certain disaster for our constitutional republic. We are not in normal times, and the level of partisan rancor escalates each day.

People who once defended the indefensible during the Obama years are now outraged by the indefensible of the Trump years. The reverse is true too. The people who once impeached a man for lying now regularly defend a liar. The people who defended a President who regularly lied to the press to get an Iran deal done are now outraged by a President who regularly lies to the press.

These are unusual times, and it is pretty obvious where it is headed. Republicans are suddenly worried about special elections in Montana and Georgia. They think Karen Handel will win in Georgia, but they are not sure about Montana. In both races, recent polling has caused some heartburn, though Handel is still winning.

Democrats, however, are headed toward a takeover of the House of Representatives and, with it, never ending investigations of President Trump.

I think the Senate GOP will be able to hang on to control of the Senate, but it will be by the slimmest of margins. Every day though, a new self-inflicted wound from the President ushers forth. I hope the President and his advisors keep a level head and realize it would be far better for him to resign than risk impeachment.

If the vipers in Congress currently defending him believe their own jobs are in jeopardy because of him, they will see to it that he loses first. That is the reality of our age. But we should not kid ourselves. If President Trump were to resign, the future President Pence would face just as much outrage and resistance from the left.

The difference is the core competencies of the men.

President Trump is a novice politician. As I have written previously, because the American people chose an amateur politician to be President, we should all expect him to make the mistakes of a new politician. We should show him some measure of grace to screw up, though I realize few are.

Of course, being a novice politician who has already admitted the job is harder than he expected, we should expect the President to keep his mouth shut, listen to advisers, and learn. Twice now in a week, the President has undercut his own White House’s defense of presidential actions by getting on Twitter and directly contradicting his staff. The man shoots himself in the foot on a near daily basis and, in the process, scuttles his agenda. If he is not going to listen and concurrently is going to decide he is the only voice that matters, the only expert in the room, and the only person who can defend his record in a job he admits is harder than he thought, no one should give him the benefit of the doubt any longer.

Frankly, if there is not a course correction soon, the President needs to consider resigning. He beat Hillary Clinton. He spared the republic that disaster. But the status quo of the Trump administration is going to do more long-term harm than good. He is going to enable and create a resurgent, combative Democratic Party that will undermine everything he has done and usher in impeachment hearings. He risks not just a loss of the House, but a loss of Republican seats orders of magnitude greater than the Democrats lost under Barack Obama.

President Trump needs an intervention. Without that, we need his resignation. Republicans who are reflexing defending the self-inflicted wounds of this President have no need for him with Mike Pence in the wings. They should save their credibility, instead of behaving exactly like the Democrats they’ve pilloried for eight years. President Trump beat Hillary Clinton, he appointed Neil Gorsuch to the Supreme Court, and now he risks everything else. There will be no wall. There will be no Obamacare repeal. There will probably not even be substantive tax reform.

None of that has anything to do with Democrat opposition and everything to do with his failure to lead.

 
Frankly, if there is not a course correction soon, the President needs to consider resigning

tlwwake or anyone else . . . do you think Trump would actually resign? Or do you think he would see impeachment all the way through?
 
tlwwake or anyone else . . . do you think Trump would actually resign? Or do you think he would see impeachment all the way through?
uhhhh i honestly don't. If the sources are true and that he won't take advice from his advisors, why would he step aside? If he came to impeachment hearings, he would likely fight until the end IMO.
 
jesus did that article come from the 7th grade girls table at the lunchroom?
 
In all of this, one group is consistently being ignored / dismissed. The American people who voted this way:

2623 counties red

489 counties blue




Screen-Shot-2016-11-09-at-11.25.00-AM.png
 
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In order for him to be impeached, the Republicans in Congress would have to turn against him. A couple of days ago, I would have said that would never happen. Now, I am not as sure.

I don't see him resigning. First off, he has blinders on. He is too much of a narcissist and doesn't think he is capable of doing anything wrong. Resigning would mean that he would be admitting that he made mistakes and couldn't handle the job. Secondly, he is all about the Trump brand. Resigning would do a lot of damage to his brand.
 
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In all of this, one group is consistently being ignored / dismissed. The American people who voted this way:

2623 counties red

489 counties blue




Screen-Shot-2016-11-09-at-11.25.00-AM.png

You have to differentiate between the general populace and members of Congress. I understand that they are supposed to represent the citizens on your map, but they will also look out for themselves and their job security. Regardless of what individual voters think, members of Congress might turn against him if they think his ship is sinking.
 
In order for him to be impeached, the Republicans in Congress would have to turn against him. A couple of days ago, I would have said that would never happen. Now, I am not as sure.

I don't see him resigning. First off, he has blinders on. He is too much of a narcissist and doesn't think he is capable of doing anything wrong. Resigning would mean that he would be admitting that he made mistakes and couldn't handle the job. Secondly, he is all about the Trump brand. Resigning would do a lot of damage to his brand.
You are already seeing some of the party doubting him. For whatever was good in his agenda (depending on your leanings), it is all being ignored/pushed to the side due to controversy after controversy. We aren't talking about the wall or sanctuary cities or tax reform... but just stupid drama that could've been avoided.
 
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If he came to impeachment hearings, he would likely fight until the end IMO.

I don't see him resigning.

This is what I think too, although I know individuals who thought Nixon would never resign.

In 1974, Goldwater, Scott, and Rhodes were the ones who made it clear to Nixon that he had to resign. I wonder . . . is there any Republicans in the Senate or House that would step up and do the same with Trump if it comes to that? And would he even listen to them?
 
When one starts talking about what the "American people" did . . one easily opens the door!:cool:
Next time maybe the Democrats will select a candidate that is smart enough to understand this incredibly new and difficult electoral college system and won't have to resort to feeling tingly about the participation trophy again.

Trump beat the Clinton machine. How sad is that?
 
Next time maybe the Democrats will select a candidate that is smart enough to understand this incredibly new and difficult electoral college system and won't have to resort to feeling tingly about the participation trophy again.

Trump beat the Clinton machine. How sad is that?

Not all that sad. Clinton was a terrible option. Enough people saw him as the lesser of two evils that he won the big prize.
 
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But the status quo of the Trump administration is going to do more long-term harm than good. He is going to enable and create a resurgent, combative Democratic Party that will undermine everything he has done and usher in impeachment hearings. He risks not just a loss of the House, but a loss of Republican seats orders of magnitude greater than the Democrats lost under Barack Obama.
This is my greatest fear right now. I don't like the GOP and don't have any illusions as to whether they'll actually do anything positive. However, I would much rather the GOP have the upper hand than the Democratic Party (under the assumption that one or the other will always hold the purse strings).
 
Maybe in the 10s of thousands. Certainly not in the magnitude of millions.

That's a very low number, considering:


1. The Democratic party believes in giving illegal aliens special privileges that are not available for American citizens

2. The Democrats are against requiring displaying ID to vote (unlike our neighbor Mexico)

3. We know the epic freak-outs when someone brings up investigating illegals voting


If you were an illegal whose life depended on you staying here illegally -- AND you had a political machine who wants to give you specific benefits and rights that American citizens can't get --- why wouldn't you vote?


And again, the election commissioner of our nation's largest city was extremely specific in describing how he thinks voter fraud happens. (and at 1 minute into the video -- he says "you can't ask for ID")

Do you think he was making it up?


 
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Impeachment doesn't necessarily mean the end of a Presidency. See Clinton.
I think in this case Impeachment is the highest hurdle. If you can get the House to impeach then getting the Senate to convict should be a breeze.
 
How many illegals do you think voted for Clinton?

Default response. Right on cue.

Already had this discussion yesterday with another poster. How many illegal votes do you think were cast for Trump?
 
Not all that sad. Clinton was a terrible option.

Exactly, she was a very flawed candidate. She had a lot of baggage. And yet, she still won the popular vote and almost the electoral college.

None of this of course has anything to do with what is going on with Trump right now. What the American people did or didn't do in November 2016 is irrelevant if Trump broke the law. Nixon won by a landslide in 1972 (60.7% of the vote and 49 states) but was gone two years later.
 
How many illegal votes do you think were cast for Trump?

Minimal illegal Trump voters, of course, because Trump prioritizes US citizens over illegals.


If you were illegal, who would you vote for?


-- the party that wants to give you life-long welfare and in-state college tuition (or in some cases like Emory University -- free college tuition)


-- the party that wants to deport you
 
Impeachment doesn't necessarily mean the end of a Presidency. See Clinton.

Conviction in the Senate does though.

Look, I think we are still far away from impeachment (especially with Republicans in control of Congress). But we are closer than we were a few days ago. Obstruction of justice is rather serious, if it can be proven.

We need to see what are in Comey's memcons.
 
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Minimal illegal Trump voters, of course, because Trump prioritizes US citizens over illegals.

This is an assumption on your part. I recall another assumption being made that many Hispanic voters would not vote for Trump . . . and yet, many did.

If you were illegal, who would you vote for?

Depends on what my political views were. I know people who have undocumented immigrants in their family who voted for Trump. Again, you are making assumptions to back up a theory because you have no real evidence.

Not to mention, that there are other ways to engage in illegal voting (dead people voting for example). To assume that only Clinton could have benefited from illegal voting (which in reality is not that big of a problem) is both absurd and partisan.

Go see what you can find on twitter though.
 
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He isn't getting impeached or resigning so long as the GOP has the house and senate or even a slim minority. It's not happening. It's a function of math. The House and Senate would both have to, at a minimum, flip before there's any real impeachment momentum. His base is too strong and there isn't anything like 2/3 of the senate to vote for impeachment.

Plus, this is exactly the government that conservatives have worked for and he's not doing one thing that isn't foreseeable from his pre-election conduct. He can hand our launch codes to Putin and a large % of conservatives would defend it. This is exactly what they want, you think they're gonna impeach?

If Manaforte or FLynn are indicted and roll over on Trump, I'm not even sure a POTUS can be indicted. That assumes Jefferson Beauregard Sellers, XIV couldn't kill it anyhow.
 
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Plus, this is exactly the government that conservatives have worked for
Thanks again to the Democrats for screwing shit up so bad over the last 8 years that conservatives are actually running the show. I'm pretty sure people warned them that identity politics, dishonesty, and terrible governance would result in what we have today, but they did everything stupid they could in spite of it.
 
How many illegals do you think voted for Clinton?


The NY election commissioner said "there is a lot of voter fraud" and busing people around.


i didn't see this video on cbs following up on trumps voter fraud claims

can you imagine the MSM having actual video instead of "sources"
 
Some good analysis and predictions from someone who accurately predicted the election.



Accurately predicted the election and has had things just factually AND legally wrong in the first five minutes of both the videos I have bothered to watch.

Just saying.....
 
Accurately predicted the election and has had things just factually AND legally wrong in the first five minutes of both the videos I have bothered to watch.

Just saying.....

Look the guy up sometime. He's a loon. Check out his "books" on Amazon.
 
Accurately predicted the election and has had things just factually AND legally wrong in the first five minutes of both the videos I have bothered to watch.

Just saying.....

Ok then.

You are the board's resident legal expert, from my recollection. (Not my specialty, nor Styx)
 
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