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Fargo Juniors Day III

O

oberebo

Heisman Candidate
Oct 30, 2005
9,674
2,349
113
Shawnee,OK
The final day of competition and the team race has really heated up and it is close. Here are the team scores going into the championship round.

1. New Jersey 51 pts
2. Minnesota 49 pts
3. Oklahoma 48 pts
3. Pennsylvania 48 pts
5 Iowa 32 pts
6. Illinois 30 pts.

Herre is my amateurish breakdown of possible points and all-Americans

1. New Jersey with 51 points has 11 All-Americans and if every wrestler they have wins today they will have 5 1st places,2 third place,1 5th place,3 7th places for total of 37. The lower the total the better for each team which means they place higher. New Jersey attained their lead by virtue of having more going for 1st place.

2. Minnesota with 49 points has 11 All Americans and if every wrestler they have wins today they will have 4 1sts,2 3rds,3 5ths, and 2 7ths for total of 39, again the lower the number the better.

3.Oklahoma with 48 points has 10 All-Americans and if every wrestler they have wins today they will have 2 1sts,3 thirds, five 5ths for total of 36.

4. Pennsylvania has 11 All-Americans and if everyone they have wins today they will have one 1st,three thirds,four 5ths and two 7ths for total of 47.

Since all of the points have been awarded 2nd,4th,6th and 8th then the points scored today will be the difference between first and second, third and fourth, fifth and sixth and seventh and eighth. Oklahoma has one less All-American than the other three teams. However, they are going for higher places based on the totals above.

If anyone is following this they are a better statistician than me, which is saying very little. I guess in the long run the only thing that can be said is we have to win more matches today than the other three teams.
 
As Cowguy pointed out in the Day II thread correctly, Joel Dixon is going for 3rd and not 5th at 195 which gives Oklahoma a total of 34.
 
Matchups today for our ten All-Americans:

100 Mason Naifeh vs. C. Rohan. Naifeh won 6-4 when they met previously 2nd round.5th place match
113 3rd place match Montorie Bridges vs. J. Cisneros California
113 Andrew Nieman vs. B. Gomez Michigan 5th place match
126 Kaid Brock vs. J. Gabriel Pa. 5th place match
132 Keagan Moore vs. Headlee Pennsylvania 3rd place match
152 Joe Smith vs. J. Shields Pennsylvania 3rd place match
170 Chandler Rogers vs. J. Johnson New Jersey 1st place match
195 Joel Dixon vs. S. Colbray Oregon 3rd place match
220 Andrew Dixon vs. M. Harrington Iowa 1st place match

GOOD LUCK OKLAHOMA- LETS WIN THIS THING!!!
 
Bad news already as Flo is showing that Keagan Moore defaulted (inj) to Headlee of Pennsylvania. That hurts the team chances.
 
Andrew Neiman loses 1-2 to Gomez who should have been stalled out of the match. He ran the whole match and the only points he scored was a counter move to Neiman's takedown attempt. Neiman deserved better but takes 6th.
 
Flo is now showing that Bridges was not pinned but lost 6-4. The referee stopped the match with time left and called it a fall. It was 6-4 at the time. I do not understand as there was time left on the clock.
 
Kaid Brock looked superb today as he hit a fireman for a takedown, a double leg for a takedown and back points, counter for takedown, and added another takedown with leg lace to end the match 15-2 or 13-2 if they took away the last move. Actually it was shown as 12-2 but just to weird it up a little Dom Forys had a tf over Deshazer of Ks. Forys lost to Brock 14-2 and DeShazer had a tf against Brock.

This post was edited on 7/26 11:01 AM by oberebo
Mitch McKee wins the weight with a 10-8 victory over Charles Tucker.
This post was edited on 7/26 11:02 AM by oberebo
 
Gary Wayne Harding had a 10-0 tf over Cook for 5th place. Mike Magaldo of NJ scored an 11-0 tech fall for 7th.
 
Joe Smith loses by 14-4 tech fall by J. Shields of Pa. and he was totally dominated physically in the match by a stronger and taller opponent. Joe takes 4th.
 
Another in a long list of mistakes by your incompetent reporter as it looks like Jacobe Smith and Hayden Hanson are wrestling for 7th.
 
Tyler Mann from Arkansas wins 7th place. With the addition of the two 160 pound wrestlers in Hansen and Smith we have 12 All-Americans and this is one more than any other team in the running if I haven't miscounted again.
This post was edited on 7/26 11:44 AM by oberebo
 
Latest team scores are not that bleak. New Jersey has 55, Pa. has 53, Oklahoma 52 and Mn. 51. I believe it might favor Minnesota as they 5 wrestlers in the upper weights and three are going for 1st.
 
Team race (has to be before Rogers OK tf Jackson NJ) shows the following:
1. NJ 58
2. OK 53
2. Pa. 53
4. Minnesota 51

Still think it favors Minnesota with Bennick and heavyweight left but we might have shot at 2nd.
Good news as Steveson just defeated Benick 3-1 so no points for Minnesota.
This post was edited on 7/26 12:44 PM by oberebo
 
Latest team scores on trackwrestling show NJ with 58 and the other three (PA, OK, Minn.) all with 53. Webb of Mass. vs. Adarious Jones of Il. in the finals at heavyweight so not much chance of the top 4 scores changing. None of the teams have wrestlers at 285 so these should be the final scores for the top 4 teams.
 
I saw Ryan Blees beat Massa in the finals which is a great win. Is Joe Smith not cutting much weight in that he is getting muscled? With Kaid Brock you have to finish a match which he didn't and then last night must not have wrestled his next match. I am glad today he wrestled. Rogers wrestled well so 57 through 74 really seemed to be covered.
 
Kaid Brock will be just fine. He wrestled with a shoulder wrap from day one. He should have one the semi-final match as I discussed so he is a winner and an elite recruit for us. Ryan Blees avenged a loss to Massa and it was a close but hard fought match. He is an elite recruit for us. Chandler Rogers wrestled as expected and is an elite recruit for us. Gary Wayne Harding finished 5th and he is a top recruit for us. Keegan Moore will be a priority for us next year and wrestled well losing only 10-10 in his semi-final match to Thorn and he is a top recruit for us. Mike Magaldo finished 7th and wrestled well at 132 and is a top recruit for us. Tyler Mann at 152 is a very good looking 152 pounder and with a year in the room should improve and be a good recruit for us. Harley, I am not seeing a downside to the wrestlers who are coming to Oklahoma State. Even Dusty Hone at 138 was 5-2 and just out of the medal round. Boo Lewallen at 132 had six wins and 2 losses with 5 of his wins by tech fall and is a top recruit for us. Not to mention the #1 recruit in the country in Chance Marsteller who is not wrestling this summer and is the prime top recruit for us. The future looks bright. Harley, can you not see the glass being 90% full?
 
A final word on a great tournament for the Oklahomans. They have not changed the score on Track so I am assuming we finished in a tie for 2nd with Pennsylvania and Minnesota and 5 points behind #1 New Jersey. We had a total of 12 All-Americans which is one more than the other teams and we wrestled great. We had a few setbacks already talked about but we were very close to winning it all. We finished 15 points ahead of powerhouse Illinois who finished 6th behind Iowa and Illinois had 16 more wrestlers in the tournament than we did.

CONGRATULATIONS TO ALL OF THE OKLAHOMA WRESTLERS FOR A JOB WELL DONE!!!
 
Congrats to all of them. Oklahoma looked very good. Not trying to take anything away from the fine job that NJ did, but I don't think Manville or tucker are actually from there. I think they are both from other states and go to Blair.
 
April you can say the same thing about Chandler Rogers for us. A great tournament with top notch competition which show cases each wrestlers pros and cons where they are at in freestyle. Loved seeing the rematch between Blees and Massa, Chandler Rogers was the OW in my mind at the tournament. Now our wrestlers can start working on folkstyle this upcoming season. Looking for great things from this years recruiting class. The Moore twins impressed me, some how we need to find away to land them. We can't get them all but!
This post was edited on 7/26 9:31 PM by mike tognetti
 
Originally posted by mike tognetti:
April you can say the same thing about Chandler Rogers for us. A great tournament with top notch competition which show cases each wrestlers pros and cons where they are at in freestyle. Loved seeing the rematch between Blees and Massa, Chandler Rogers was the OW in my mind at the tournament. Now our wrestlers can start working on folkstyle and this upcoming season. Looking for great things from this years recruiting class. The Moore twins impressed me, some how we need to find away to land them. We can't get them all but!
Click to expand...


Well, your mind is another story Tognetti but to put a little balm on the wound it was Ryan Blees who was named the outstanding wrestler of the tournament so our two recruits both did great.
 
I see your point meluv but with their uncle Hardell coaching them I kinda doubt it will be Iowa. It will be just more competition in the OSU room and that is good for all of the wrestlers but then that is my homer Point.
 
We lost this tournament due to Cowguy. I'm sorry and he is a good guy but he is the one that pointed out to me that Kaid Brock lost and did not win his match against McKee. I was entirely happy in my belief that Brock with 28 seconds to go and leading 10-4 COULD NOT lose. I switched to the 132 pound match between Keagan Moore and Tommy Thorne as it was 9-6 Moore at that time. I am thinking a double whammy. Brock beating McKee and Moore beating Thorn. Cowguy with his dose of reality really put a damper on things and we lost both matches. All joking aside, that was the turning point of this tournament and we would definitely have been in first place if those matches were won. I do not blame the wrestlers as they wrestled their guts out so IT HAS TO BE COWGUY.
 
Originally posted by oberebo:

I see your point meluv but with their uncle Hardell coaching them I kinda doubt it will be Iowa. It will be just more competition in the OSU room and that is good for all of the wrestlers but then that is my homer Point.
Click to expand...
I hear what your saying. I'm sure their uncle, dad & grandpa would rather see them attend another school that has less depth and a better opportunity to start.
 
I'll take the blame, obe!

Still very proud of the oklahoma performance. Kaid had a lapse and that lapse probably cost him first. Lance dixon's injury hurt too.

Interesting hearing Blees say he was small at 160. Maybe he's the answer this year at 57. It's the best scenario for him, Marsteller and Rogers to spread weights. I also really don't see that much of a logjam for the Moores. I think they both could shift weights some. I also know the best wrestlers will wrestle. It will be interesting to see what weight Jo wrestles in college. He's built so different than his dad. Unless he hits a growth spurt, he may have to cut some weight. One thing for sure, college strength training will impact all the young guy's bodies.

What could be really interesting to see, even though it's not OSU, is how the weights shake out for the Dixons. Andrew was giving up big weight to wrestle 220. I think he's a 197 tops in college. Can one of them hold 74 for 4 years? I don't know. If they bunch at a weight, will one need to move programs to clear space?

Regardless - it's very exciting to see the young talent in oklahoma. Hardell and coach crutchmer deserve a ton of credit for the development of this program.
 
Originally posted by Cowguy:
I'll take the blame, obe!

Still very proud of the oklahoma performance. Kaid had a lapse and that lapse probably cost him first. Lance dixon's injury hurt too.

Interesting hearing Blees say he was small at 160. Maybe he's the answer this year at 57. It's the best scenario for him, Marsteller and Rogers to spread weights. I also really don't see that much of a logjam for the Moores. I think they both could shift weights some. I also know the best wrestlers will wrestle. It will be interesting to see what weight Jo wrestles in college. He's built so different than his dad. Unless he hits a growth spurt, he may have to cut some weight. One thing for sure, college strength training will impact all the young guy's bodies.

What could be really interesting to see, even though it's not OSU, is how the weights shake out for the Dixons. Andrew was giving up big weight to wrestle 220. I think he's a 197 tops in college. Can one of them hold 74 for 4 years? I don't know. If they bunch at a weight, will one need to move programs to clear space?

Regardless - it's very exciting to see the young talent in oklahoma. Hardell and coach crutchmer deserve a ton of credit for the development of this program.
Click to expand...
Cowguy, After looking at OSUs current roster and the 2014 & 2015 recruiting class, seems jammed up to me. IMO, the Moore's are most likely to wrestle 141# & 149# in college. Looking at 133# - 149# for OSU, currently OSU has 8 wrestlers at those weight who will be on the roster for the next 4-5 years. Then you add the 2014 recruiting class and that's another 4 wrestlers. The 2015 class so far has 2 (Smith & Lewallen) at those weights as well. With Joe attending OSU, that makes things interesting as well and anyone who says that doesn't matter, well, I disagree.

Teams need depth, I get that but at the end of the day, wrestlers who want to start early, generally look at who's going to be graduating when they step on campus. The Moore's are talented enough to challenge for a starting spot. It'll be interesting to see where they end up.
 
The 133 position seems open for 1 of the Moore's because I think Keagan beat Harding in this tournament. He beat Smith last year and lost to Brock this year. Kaid will hopefully be at 25 and Keagan has been at 32 for several years. Heil I hope wrestles 33 this year but maybe the next year goes to 41. At this time it may be Harding to is left out if the Moore's come to Stillwater.. I doubt as you are indicating that both Moore's start for the Cowboys. To respond to Oberebo I think our future is bright but I thought Nationals Championship were coming our way with the Perry recruiting class and the transfers which of course did not happen. Also I was not excited about Kaid taking 5th and Joe taking 4th. But this is just 1 week. Kaid beating Moore was a big deal his matches against McKee were not high lite matches. We have a very good class this year and next years class is looking promising but we haven't won any National championship in a lot of years. I am not excited but I am hopeful.
 
Harley, thanks for your response. I do not know what happened to Brock in the DeShazer match but actually the match he lost to McKee was a "high light" match. He dominated the match and was leading 10-4 with 28 seconds left. I would take Brock in a hearbeat over McKee in folkstyle and I am glad we got him. Keagan Moore's twin is kind of a mystery to me and I don't know whether he is just not as interested in wrestling as his brother. I have been told he has been injured but that seems like the last two years. If he is anything like his brother then I am certain we will recruit both. I think that there is a possibility that Brock will be at 133 in college. I put no stock in free style matches for the most part as they do not give the whole picture of the wrestler's ability in collegiate style and College wrestling is what I am mainly interested in. The 4-5 trapped arm rolls by McKee are not impressive to me and not indicative of who was the better wrestler. Meluv indicated that this was not an upset as McKee beat him in OKC but to me it was an upset as clearly Kaid was the better wrestler for 5 minutes and 30 seconds.
 
Harleycowboy,

You maybe right about Moore wrestling 133# in college but I know for a fact that the Moore's plan on wrestling no lighter than 141# college. You always want to keep the local talent in state and OSU has done a good job keeping them local. For those that are in the know, how does Brock compete against the current OSU 125# roster (Gentzler, Cline, Hale & etc)?
 
I am definitely not in the know so have no information on how Kaid does in the room. Not sure I would share that on the board if I did know as at first blush It would not be information helpful to the OSU program as a whole at this point. As far as Moore goes you sound like you know he Moores and your information sounds legit. I thought Keagan looked like a very big 132 pounder and he has another year to grow. I was very impressed with his ability and looks like he is making great progress under Hardell.
 
What happens in the room is important but I remember someone pointing out Boo was really taking it to Harding but Harding won the freestyle match this week. I am hopeful for the future but next year does not look good.
 
oberebo & HarleyCowboy,

I was told the same thing about Boo and Harding. As far as the Moore twins go, just looking and talking to them and adding 2 years (senior and redshirt freshman) worth of growth, they just don't appear to me that 133# is in their future.

If you wish not to share OSU room battles, that's fine, all is good. Room battles is another way of gauging possible lineup, progress of recruits and etc. My intention was not to discredit anyone wrestling skill set or question their ability to be competitive at the college level.
 
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