Eric garner and mike brown

[HighStickHarry]

From Peter King and megyn Kelly interview. Garner had been arrested 31 times. Was a convicted felon. Was disturbing the peace and intimidating customers outside of minority owned businesses who called the police to protect them from a 350 pound man. He resisted arrest.

Michael brown was still hot from an assault and battery and robbery. He tried to get the policeman's gun. He was begging for police attention toward himself by walking down the middle of the street. He dared the cop to shoot him.

Is this really the kind of people that become martyrs? It says a whole lot about the people who are hitching their wagons to these baseless racist claims.

Deblasio needs to be put in a mental institution.

The real coyote that feasts on the scraps of outrage is the media. Fox and the lefty media are so pathetic in how they create the situations that they know will get ratings if they whip up the flames.

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by HighStickHarry:
From Peter King and megyn Kelly interview. Garner had been arrested 31 times. Was a convicted felon. Was disturbing the peace and intimidating customers outside of minority owned businesses who called the police to protect them from a 350 pound man. He resisted arrest.

Michael brown was still hot from an assault and battery and robbery. He tried to get the policeman's gun. He was begging for police attention toward himself by walking down the middle of the street. He dared the cop to shoot him.

All crimes punishable in the United States by the death penalty.

 

[aix_xpert]

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by HighStickHarry:
From Peter King and megyn Kelly interview. Garner had been arrested 31 times. Was a convicted felon. Was disturbing the peace and intimidating customers outside of minority owned businesses who called the police to protect them from a 350 pound man. He resisted arrest.

Michael brown was still hot from an assault and battery and robbery. He tried to get the policeman's gun. He was begging for police attention toward himself by walking down the middle of the street. He dared the cop to shoot him.

All crimes punishable in the United States by the death penalty.

Agression begets agression. If you change the color of their skin (but not their actions) what changes in these scenarios? By answering that question, I believe you can question the outcome of the Garner case but the Brown case would have occured exactly as it did (assuming the general basis of the police and witness testimony is accurate).

Justin

 

[NeekReevers]

I finally sat down and read over some of the grand jury testimony along with the physical evidence in the Michael Brown case. It sounds like the physical evidence backs up the officer's account almost exactly and that it is corroborated by multiple witnesses.

The "hands up, don't shoot" scenario was first offered up by Brown's best friend who at the time was claiming Brown had been shot in the back while fleeing which is disproved by the physical evidence. 16 of 29 accounts offered to the grand jury describe "hands up don't shoot" but again the physical evidence doesn't support this scenario. Witness 10 for the grand jury, an African-American, whose testimony is almost identical to Wilson's and the physical evidence, mentioned that after the incident he was down on the street talking with other witnesses. When he related what he saw they started to berate him and hurled racial insults at him. That at least gives me some indication as to how 16 of 29 witnesses might offer a similar narrative that doesn't match the evidence. Brown's friend also claimed the officer reached out the window of his police car and grabbed 6'5" 300 lb. Michael Brown by the throat. It'd be interesting to reenact that to see if that was even possible.

I guess most people will believe the narrative they want to believe and suits their agenda. From reading what I read this morning I understand why the grand jury didn't indict.

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by aix_xpert:

If you change the color of their skin (but not their actions) what changes in these scenarios?

Is it possible for there to be any agreement on this question or to even have an informed discussion? I doubt it.

Some how there wasn't a body count from the Cliven Bundy situation or from the rash of open carry unstable people (saying here that there were unstable people openly carrying, not that open carriers are all unstable).

Racism or not, two unarmed people are dead and that is not a desirable outcome, and we can't just pretend that since they were "thugs" and "felons" that is not a problem.



This post was edited on 12/5 2:28 PM by 07pilt

 

[OSUGD]

How do you know if somebody is armed or not?

 

[racernhra]

If the two black males had killed the police officers it would not even make the news and Pilt would still be blathering about something other than two white police officers being killed by black thugs.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[TPOKE]

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by aix_xpert:

If you change the color of their skin (but not their actions) what changes in these scenarios?

Is it possible for there to be any agreement on this question or to even have an informed discussion? I doubt it.

Some how there wasn't a body count from the Cliven Bundy situation or from the rash of open carry unstable people (saying here that there were unstable people openly carrying, not that open carriers are all unstable).

Racism or not, two unarmed people are dead and that is not a desirable outcome, and we can't just pretend that since they were "thugs" and "felons" that is not a problem.



This post was edited on 12/5 2:28 PM by 07pilt

I guess first hand testimony by African American witnesses in the Michael Brown case don't count? Thing about liberals is they don't think laws apply to them if they don't agree with them.

 

[ThorOdinson13]

Regardless of the outcome in these two instances, militarization of the police force and an ever growing police state are an issue we should all agree on.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by OSUGD:
How do you know if somebody is armed or not?

I guess we should just shoot everyone then?

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by racernhra:
If the two black males had killed the police officers it would not even make the news and Pilt would still be blathering about something other than two white police officers being killed by black thugs.
Posted from Well the only cop who died this year from assault did make the news.

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by TPOKE:
I guess first hand testimony by African American witnesses in the Michael Brown case don't count? Thing about liberals is they don't think laws apply to them if they don't agree with them.

The thing about conservatives is that their reading comprehension is piss poor, apparently.

 

[TPOKE]

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by TPOKE:
I guess first hand testimony by African American witnesses in the Michael Brown case don't count? Thing about liberals is they don't think laws apply to them if they don't agree with them.

The thing about conservatives is that their reading comprehension is piss poor, apparently.

I guess you know exactly what you'd do in that situation, right? A 300lb angry man, who just assaulted a clerk is coming at you, and may grab your gun and beat you to a pulp, or just grab your gun and unload a few in you. Especially as a law enforcement officer. Also, I do believe you think it was racism because you keep alluding to it. That being said, the Garner deal was tragic. They knew what he was doing for a long time, even referring to him as the "cigarette man" and what he was doing wasn't a problem until they were told to get him.
This post was edited on 12/8 9:17 PM by TPOKE

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by TPOKE:

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by TPOKE:
I guess first hand testimony by African American witnesses in the Michael Brown case don't count? Thing about liberals is they don't think laws apply to them if they don't agree with them.

The thing about conservatives is that their reading comprehension is piss poor, apparently.

I guess you know exactly what you'd do in that situation, right? A 300lb angry man, who just assaulted a clerk is coming at you, and may grab your gun and beat you to a pulp, or just grab your gun and unload a few in you. Especially as a law enforcement officer. Also, I do believe you think it was racism because you keep alluding to it. That being said, the Garner deal was tragic. They knew what he was doing for a long time, even referring to him as the "cigarette man" and what he was doing wasn't a problem until they were told to get him.
This post was edited on 12/8 9:17 PM by TPOKE

Wow. Still can't read. Sad.

 

[AC_Exotic]

The Garner case merits questioning imo.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[anon_xl72qcu5isp39]

Originally posted by OSUGD:
How do you know if somebody is armed or not?

Oh, you don't. A cop should just assume everyone is armed and kill anyone that resists.

Guess who in this thread works for gub'mint?

 

[wyomingosualum]

Originally posted by syskatine:

gub'mint?

Trite. Patronizing.

 

[MegaPoke]

Originally posted by syskatine:

Originally posted by OSUGD:
How do you know if somebody is armed or not?

Oh, you don't. A cop should just assume everyone is armed and kill anyone that resists.

Guess who in this thread works for gub'mint?

Says the unapologetic statist, with no sense of irony.

Police forces in America will do nothing but become more militarized, more aggressive, and further removed culturally from the citizens they are sworn to protect as you geniuses continue to grow the gub'mint.

Who suffers the most? As usual, minorities.

The cops in the Garner case were wrong. And the guy was not dangerous - he was a pest who couldn't walk a city block without gasping for air. The cops that choked him out were abusing power over a misdemeanor, and we are inviting more and more of that - which will continue to be misidentified as racism by the media and the gub'mint cheerleaders like you - perpetuating the myth of modern racism. After all, that boogyman still serves a purpose.

 

[wyomingosualum]

Originally posted by MegaPoke:

Originally posted by syskatine:

Originally posted by OSUGD:
How do you know if somebody is armed or not?

Oh, you don't. A cop should just assume everyone is armed and kill anyone that resists.

Guess who in this thread works for gub'mint?

Says the unapologetic statist, with no sense of irony.

Police forces in America will do nothing but become more militarized, more aggressive, and further removed culturally from the citizens they are sworn to protect as you geniuses continue to grow the gub'mint.

Who suffers the most? As usual, minorities.

The cops in the Garner case were wrong. And the guy was not dangerous - he was a pest who couldn't walk a city block without gasping for air. The cops that choked him out were abusing power over a misdemeanor, and we are inviting more and more of that - which will continue to be misidentified as racism by the media and the gub'mint cheerleaders like you - perpetuating the myth of modern racism. After all, that boogyman still serves a purpose.

They gone putchall back in chains.

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by MegaPoke:

Says the unapologetic statist, with no sense of irony.

Police forces in America will do nothing but become more militarized, more aggressive, and further removed culturally from the citizens they are sworn to protect as you geniuses continue to grow the gub'mint.

You know which geniuses are growing the government by militarizing police. Its the drug warriors, the law and order types. The Nixon and Reagan conservatives (Giuliani too).

The whole libertarian shtick would be more believable if you could stop punch hippies long enough to say something to the actual authoritarians.

Originally posted by MegaPoke:

which will continue to be misidentified as racism by the media and the gub'mint cheerleaders like you - perpetuating the myth of modern racism. After all, that boogyman still serves a purpose.

We know we know. Racism isn't real since your daughter dated a black person. Strange how the only ones bringing race up in this thread are you and the authoritarians.

 

[Poketologist]

Or, we could just try this.

 

[ThorOdinson13]

Has anyone kept up with what has occurred in Albuquerque over the last year or so?
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[MegaPoke]

What's weird is that it's so important to you to fit me into a category that you selectively ignore the fact that a big percentage of my posts specifically attack big government Republicans.

Also I never said racism doesn't exist. I said you guys perpetuate it by claiming to see it in everything like it's a portrait of Jesus on your French toast.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by MegaPoke:
What's weird is that it's so important to you to fit me into a category that you selectively ignore the fact that a big percentage of my posts specifically attack big government Republicans.

Also I never said racism doesn't exist. I said you guys perpetuate it by claiming to see it in everything like it's a portrait of Jesus on your French toast.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

Yet you skip over a thread full of pro police authoritarians and go directly to the poster against police abuses and accuse him of being statist. I guess we can all be against big government republicans in the abstract.

Do you often refer to things that do exist as myths?
This post was edited on 12/9 11:47 PM by 07pilt

 

[Inky29]

I don't really have much to say about the Mike Brown case, never saw any video but if the GJ didn't at least send it on down the line when generally the burden of proof is so small I'm willing to bet that it's pretty clear that he wasn't some innocent victim with his hands up and his back to the officer.

Now I have watched this Eric Garner video and unless the officer secretly gave him asthma and then for the past thirty years was force feeding him food and cigarettes I see nothing wrong that the officers did. They didn't choke him out of consciousness, he worked himself up, resisted arrested and I think the cops used reasonable force to bring down someone that probably weighed more than two of those cops put together. They didn't bash his head in with a baton, didn't punch him, didn't kick him. They tried to arrest him and he started fighting back so they took him down and ended it. When he's yelling he can't breath, there's no choke hold on him, it had already been released. Nothing about that event screams racism or even police brutality. Sorry the guy died but 30+ years worth of bad decision led him to that point and he made another bad decision that day.

I have a great amount of respect for what law enforcement has to go through on a daily basis and what you and I might see as an over reaction when put in the context of what they face each day I give them a tremendous amount of freedom to choose the best way to get a suspect subdued. Now if they would have taken out their sticks and started beating the crap out of the guy and he died, I'd be all about pressing charges, however tackling a dude and bringing him to the ground is about as PC a way to bring down a suspect that's resisting arrest.

If someone is wanting to start a movement and make changes I'd really look for some martyrs that didn't die in the immediate wake of criminal activity. Just my .02

 

[imprimis]

 

[07pilt]

shameful

 

[TPOKE]

Originally posted by 07pilt:
shameful

Yep, shameful a criminal has to resist arrest, abuse an officer, rush him and end up shot. You're 100% correct.

 

[TPOKE]

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by TPOKE:

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by TPOKE:
I guess first hand testimony by African American witnesses in the Michael Brown case don't count? Thing about liberals is they don't think laws apply to them if they don't agree with them.

The thing about conservatives is that their reading comprehension is piss poor, apparently.

I guess you know exactly what you'd do in that situation, right? A 300lb angry man, who just assaulted a clerk is coming at you, and may grab your gun and beat you to a pulp, or just grab your gun and unload a few in you. Especially as a law enforcement officer. Also, I do believe you think it was racism because you keep alluding to it. That being said, the Garner deal was tragic. They knew what he was doing for a long time, even referring to him as the "cigarette man" and what he was doing wasn't a problem until they were told to get him.
This post was edited on 12/8 9:17 PM by TPOKE

Wow. Still can't read. Sad.

You're lack of an intelligent response is telling. This guy was a proven thug.

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by TPOKE:
You're lack of an intelligent response is telling. This guy was a proven thug.

It is telling. It should be telling you that you aren't even arguing the points I am making. Are you a college graduate?

 

[Ostatedchi]

Why does the mobile site not recognize that I have 07pilt and Sys on ignore? I don't want to waste any more time having to filter through their crap.

 

[TPOKE]

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by TPOKE:
You're lack of an intelligent response is telling. This guy was a proven thug.

It is telling. It should be telling you that you aren't even arguing the points I am making. Are you a college graduate?

No, actually I went back and reread. You're the one missing the point.

 

[MegaPoke]

Did you seriously miss my multiple posts which have been decidedly NOT pro-police?

Seriously wondering why I bother replying to you anymore.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by MegaPoke:
Did you seriously miss my multiple posts which have been decidedly NOT pro-police?

Seriously wondering why I bother replying to you anymore.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

Yeah I wonder why you are replying to people you ostensibly agree with about a thread topic instead of replying to the people you disagree with.

Not really. I know why. It is because hippy punching takes precedence over your principles.

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by TPOKE:
No, actually I went back and reread. You're the one missing the point.

Like I said, you can't read.

An easy way to prove me wrong is to say to which of my points your diatribes are responsive. I won't hold my breath.

 

[MegaPoke]

Originally posted by 07pilt:

Originally posted by MegaPoke:
Did you seriously miss my multiple posts which have been decidedly NOT pro-police?

Seriously wondering why I bother replying to you anymore.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

Yeah I wonder why you are replying to people you ostensibly agree with about a thread topic instead of replying to the people you disagree with.

Not really. I know why. It is because hippy punching takes precedence over your principles.

hippie punching?

If you picked any random 10 of my friends, "hippie" would probably apply to 8 or 9 of them.

I realize I'm wasting my time, but I'll go ahead and play along. You seem to think I'm a thinly veiled republican....

Does this fit that profile?

I'm a professional artist (well known republican demographic for sure). I admit to the fact that I occasionally smoke and enjoy pot and think it should be legal (clear republican platform right?). I support gay marriage (as do all republicans). I am a musician with long hair (always well received by republicans), multiple tattoos and pierced ears (so I can blend in with republicans). And I have told personal stories on this site about being hassled by dirty cops specifically because of the way I looked (something every republican can relate to).

I don't know you from Adam, but I would bet you right now, sight unseen that you and I wear what we both would normally wear to work and go stand on a sidewalk tomorrow with a "guess the hippie" sign over us, and I would get every vote.

I don't expect you to remember everything I post, but you honestly have no idea how stupid your posts directed at me in this thread are. Most people that have been here for longer than five minutes know I am not in any way what you are attempting to describe.

Having said all that, most "hippies" I know actually aren't total pussies who think racism lurks in every shadow. Most of them have a pretty solid take on reality and are not terribly trusting of government one way or another.

 

[07pilt]

Its a turn of phrase. Google it. I wasn't calling you a square.

Call it liberal punching. Call it whatever you want.

Originally posted by MegaPoke:
Having said all that, most "hippies" I know actually aren't total pussies who think racism lurks in every shadow. Most of them have a pretty solid take on reality and are not terribly trusting of government one way or another.

Maybe agreeing with Sys would make you seem too effeminate. Don't want anyone to think you are a pussy.

 

[Poketologist]

Originally posted by 07pilt:
Its a turn of phrase. Google it. I wasn't calling you a square.

Call it liberal punching. Call it whatever you want.

Originally posted by MegaPoke:
Having said all that, most "hippies" I know actually aren't total pussies who think racism lurks in every shadow. Most of them have a pretty solid take on reality and are not terribly trusting of government one way or another.

Maybe agreeing with Sys would make you seem too effeminate. Don't want anyone to think you are a pussy.

Interesting.
From where I sit, you seem like a guy who loves to draw a lot of penises.

 

[Poketologist]

Another passive-aggressive comment coming to the board in 5...4...3....

 

[07pilt]

Originally posted by Poketologist:
Interesting.
From where I sit, you seem like a guy who loves to draw a lot of penises.

you seem like a guy who contemplates other people drawing penises.