childhood ADD

[JonnyVito]

All I know is in college I would take some of my buddies adderall for test and I would study all night and then show up to random class rooms in the morning just to learn. That stuff just made me soak up everything I heard and read. I feel like it is a PED for students.

 

[Alpha Poke]

In an ADD brain it keeps one thought on course instead of fragmenting into every eventuality of that thought.

 

[CBradSmith]

All I know is in college I would take some of my buddies adderall for test and I would study all night and then show up to random class rooms in the morning just to learn. That stuff just made me soak up everything I heard and read. I feel like it is a PED for students.

Not to be stickler, but that is abuse of the medication. And you're right that it (the medication) could be abused as performance enhancing.

Under the impression it can also be addicting.

 

[JonnyVito]

I have a terrible short term memory and when I had test that involved a bunch of memorization I usually took one. I made the best grades ever in college while taking the stuff. I just hate not sleeping and am a very high strung person in general so I hated the fact it was an upper.

 

[JonnyVito]

Not to be stickler, but that is abuse of the medication. And you're right that it (the medication) could be abused as performance enhancing.

Under the impression it can also be addicting.

Well this med was the least of my abusing problems at that time. I just thank god I never did heroin or I might have made an episode of intervention.

 

[Alpha Poke]

It helps ADD people sleep.

 

[BIGOSUFAN]

I'm a doc. ADHD is a very real thing. Do all kids with ADHD need medication? Absolutely not. Most cases of mild or moderate ADHD can be managed with behavior modification. Severe ADHD kids absolutely need medication. These are 7 year-olds who after you are around them for five minutes you want to kick them. These kids are at high-risk for substance abuse when they get older and medication significantly reduces their risk of substance abuse.

Many famous brilliant inventors throughout history (Edison, Einstein etc...) had ADHD. I always wonder how much we would've dulled their creative brains if they had been medicated.

 

[hollywood]

Doc, you mean to tell me, you don't prescribe "give your kid two beatings and call me in the morning" as the preferred treatment?

 

[HighStickHarry]

Doc, you mean to tell me, you don't prescribe "give your kid two beatings and call me in the morning" as the preferred treatment?

Can I say after reading your opinions and mental gymnastics for the last ten years I feel extremely vindicated all of the sudden.

 

[Wally12]

What are the symptoms of ADHD in adults?

 

[hollywood]

Can I say after reading your opinions and mental gymnastics for the last ten years I feel extremely vindicated all of the sudden.

You have literally advocated beating kids with ADD! Here are your words: "You can do what my uncle did. beat it out of his kid and his grandkid."

Sorry, but I believe one of us is vindicated perhaps and it's certainly not you. It's quite clear that ADD/ADHD is often a serious medical disorder, deriving from issues with brain chemistry, yet you suggest that the "cure" and treatment for this medical condition is to actually "beat" your children.

Should a person likewise "beat" their kid with kidney disease, cancer, diabetes, etc., in an effort to deal with those very real and very serious medical conditions?

Sorry, but what you are advocating is basically barbaric and sick.

If what you are advocating is a proper response to people having this condition, then why stop with kids? Perhaps those people brave enough to disclose their own issues with this disease in this thread, should simply go off their meds and call your uncle over to beat them as well?

 

[Rdcldad]

wood

you have zero details and an abundance of judgement but i digress

 

[HighStickHarry]

Typical lawyer brain. Yes I said beat kids with cancer.

ADHD is a behavior issue. Is it real? Sure just like anything in the brain involving wires is real. It also lies on a spectrum. Through your infinite wisdom you have no idea where my cousin is on that spectrum. I've watched medicine ruin the lives of several people. There is no doubt that in the macro our kids are over medicated in this country and that being rowdy has been replaced a by this diagnosis. It is obvious alpha has job security based on doling out this diagnosis as often as possible.

I gave one example of physical discipline being more effective than being pharma stoned. One example. An example I lived and observed. I then have to listen to you and alpha flap your wings saying I said beat cancer kids and my family blood line is lazy and stupid. I'm not surprised by either of these responses by you two based on your posting history.


I'll just say my piece once and for all. ADHD is used as an excuse too often because their parents are pussies that can't handle their kids. Obviously not all the time and there are legitimate cases in which the child's life will be a net gain with medicine. I'm sure that's the case with all of alphas patients. I'm telling you the ADHD epidemic is not what we are lead to believe and it is incompetent parenting, poor nutrition, too much screen time, ridiculous cartoons, and irrational losers not taking care of their kids.

Did you know that 100 years ago everything we saw was reality? Now spend a week watching kids shows and playing with things that constantly scream and light up. Now add all of the absolute crap we cram in them for their nutrition both prenatal and during childhood. Throw in some environmental chaos with x rays microwaves radio waves wifi, pollution air and water and all the sudden everyone is autistic, ADHD and allergic to their own smell. Again, sometimes this is not the case. I don't expect you to catch this nuance in your inevitable response.

 

[Alpha Poke]

What are the symptoms of ADHD in adults?

http://www.dodsonadhdcenter.com/adult-and-teen-adh/

 

[HighStickHarry]

wood

you have zero details and an abundance of judgement but i digress

He is a lawyer named Hollywood. he doesn't play by the same rules we do.

 

[hollywood]

wood

you have zero details and an abundance of judgement but i digress

What more details do I need actually to pass judgment that "beating the ADD" out of kid is not an appropriate option?

 

[hollywood]

He is a lawyer named Hollywood. he doesn't play by the same rules we do.

Named "Hollywood" because another poster from the original board, gave me the name because when I mentioned that the view out of my office at my old law firm was the Hollywood sign. Not a name I chose myself, but one given to me by a poster named "Marshal" some 17 yrs ago.

 

[HighStickHarry]

My uncle could cure a lot of adults of several bad behaviors btw. He is getting older now and has some mechanical parts but I'd still put money on him.

 

[HighStickHarry]

Named "Hollywood" because another poster from the original board, gave me the name because when I mentioned that the view out of my office at my old law firm was the Hollywood sign. Not a name I chose myself, but one given to me by a poster named "Marshal" some 17 yrs ago.

You lived among California liberals and that is unfortunate.

Can we define "beat" before your indignation forces you to need a safe place? Since you are passing judgement what did I mean by beat?

 

[hollywood]

You lived among California liberals and that is unfortunate.

Can we define "beat" before your indignation forces you to need a safe place? Since you are passing judgement what did I mean by beat?

I assign the meaning of the word "beat" the same meaning as it is generally accepted in the English speaking world: "strike (a person or an animal) repeatedly and violently so as to hurt or injure them, usually with an implement such as a club or whip."

If this is not what you are advocating, then perhaps the problem is that you are using the wrong/imprecise word to describe things? Am I wrong to apply the consensus (dictionary definition) meaning of a word? So, if you don't want someone to take your words literally, perhaps you should do a better job of choosing them?

Here's the thing, I actually agree with much of what you wrote in your last post. I also believe that there is too much reliance on pills, there's too much denial and excuse making by parents, that parents today are not putting the time and effort into their own children they should, and much more.

But, I also note that you are mentioning environmental factors like "pollution," "wifi/radio/tv waves," and nutrition as part of the equation. For the same reason that it is inappropriate to react with physical/corporal punishment to a child/adult who has an actual mental (brain chemistry) issue, much as it is to try and "treat" someone with any other medical condition, is it in any way fair to apply physical force to a kid who is being affected by one or more of those things.

Is ADD/ADHD being over diagnosed? Likely, but that in no way suggests that the opening conversation on whether a child should get a diagnosis from a trained medical profession should begin with the advice/notion that you can simply "beat" (your word) a case of ADD/ADHD out of them. Sorry, but that's ridiculous.

 

[HighStickHarry]

Ok I guess we were on the same page as far as "beat."

Glad we cleared that part up.

 

[shortbus]

I'm with stick 99% of the time but he's wrong on this one.

I'm not saying his uncle beating his kids didn't work. Maybe the kids were just micreants who needed a good butt whipping.

That said, physical abuse or just spanking in general is in no way an effective treatment. In fact I would imagine it would actually the opposite effect and make things way worse.

As far as Hollywood is concerned, I rarely agree with him politically however he has made maybe one or two posts ever that I couldn't respect.

You can't argue that he doesn't bring well thought out, relevant perspective from the left.

You certainly cannot put him in any category with the rest of the existing left leaning posters on this board.

And on the non sports board, he's one of my favorite posters. Always has some interesting historical take or past experience to share.

I don't see where in this thread he's provided opportunity for criticism.

What it boils down to is Harry shot off at the mouth, like he normally does, and others took offense to it, and it became a personal issue when in reality, everyone needs to just relax and call it for what it is, opinionated people using hyperbole and arguing over shit they normally wouldn't in a way they normally wouldn't.

Things were said, insults were perceived, or real but slight, none were intended to inflame. Just message boards being message boards.

I love you all. Kum Bah Yah. Group huh.

Theeeeeere. Alllll better now.

 

[HighStickHarry]

I'm with stick 99% of the time but he's wrong on this one.

I'm not saying his uncle beating his kids didn't work. Maybe the kids were just micreants who needed a good butt whipping.

That said, physical abuse or just spanking in general is in no way an effective treatment. In fact I would imagine it would actually the opposite effect and make things way worse.

As far as Hollywood is concerned, I rarely agree with him politically however he has made maybe one or two posts ever that I couldn't respect.

You can't argue that he doesn't bring well thought out, relevant perspective from the left.

You certainly cannot put him in any category with the rest of the existing left leaning posters on this board.

And on the non sports board, he's one of my favorite posters. Always has some interesting historical take or past experience to share.

I don't see where in this thread he's provided opportunity for criticism.

What it boils down to is Harry shot off at the mouth, like he normally does, and others took offense to it, and it became a personal issue when in reality, everyone needs to just relax and call it for what it is, opinionated people using hyperbole and arguing over shit they normally wouldn't in a way they normally wouldn't.

Things were said, insults were perceived, or real but slight, none were intended to inflame. Just message boards being message boards.

I love you all. Kum Bah Yah. Group huh.

Theeeeeere. Alllll better now.

Get a room. With yourself.

 

[Rulz]

Interesting thread.

One that I wouldn't usually touch, but since I have a step kid with ADD, one that I have now read fully and am intrigued about now.

My stepson has pretty severe ADD...or so we are told. But, I also have found a photo of him shortly after birth, with a blue face after forceps and auction and Apgars of 1 and 2. They actually ran a code on him as well.

He was diagnosed like most kids during elementary school. His grades continued to be for shit...until I met my wife and stepped into this family when he was 11. He's 18 now, about to graduate from high school and has nearly a 4.0 average, but he's in some of the alternative classes and his mom does help him quite a bit. He's usually in better spirits now as well.

What changed? Well, in that time I have had to lay hands on him once in defense. He took a swing at me once when I was telling him to stop playing video games (this was at age 13) and dodged it and ended it with a bear hug and him chilling out finally. Since then, no more physical altercations. He got into one fight at school and got his ass beat. That ended his fighting at school as well. I am strict on him, he doesn't get by with doing bullshit, but I have to walk that line since he's not my blood son and I don't want to alienate him. But, I do not have ADD/ADHD, more like OCD and so I'm probably looked on as a necessary thorn in his ass. But that's what my dad to me, and it worked.

He's on one medication, very light dose of Straterra. If he's off of it, he's not fun to be around, not one bit. He is VERY immature still, couldn't drive until 18 because he just couldn't figure it out. He's very slow on testing, and even with meds struggles with learning simple tasks such as putting gas into his car. He can't follow step by step instructions. Pretty much anything that takes several steps to complete is a mystery, he loses shit all the time, and still blames everyone else for any mistakes he makes.

Quite simply, he's a pain in the ass at times lol. But, the teachers have helped him quite a bit and so that has been great for him to get the grades he has so far.

I feel ADD/ADHD is a real issue, but how to handle it is different for everyone. With him, I think he was misdiagnosed and had some brain damage at birth (he has headaches a lot as well), and while I believe the ADD symptoms are there, I feel it's a result of something else that went unchecked due to a young mother who had no support from the FOB in this deal (he is dead now, took a header off of a motorcycle right when I met my wife...another can of worms) and her not insisting on more investigation of the delivery at the time.

I don't know what his future will be...he can't get up and get out the door without prodding, doesn't like instruction, and has yet to claim responsibility for a great many things when they occur. He has difficulties talking to people at times and his vocabulary is pretty limited. But, I have done what I could with what I had to work with. If I had been around In his formative years from say, 2 to 11, I could have developed a more fatherly relationship. But it's hard to come in and take over that role when he was so into his dad (who was a dead beat until he turned 11 and came in as a "hero" and then subsequently died), and he was just getting to know him during that time as well.

Should I have done more? Should I have punished him every time he starts cussing at his mom or blaming everyone in the house for "stealing" his stuff when he loses it? Maybe. But like he said once..."I feel like you are the enforcer"...which is true to a degree. Before me, he would push his 5 foot mom around when she would get onto him, but he won't do that now. But he still has his little anger issues, and there's the psychology of this whole thing coupled with his diagnosis that I have had to overcome. I really believe the trauma from a forceps plus auction delivery affected him greatly...and I'm not an OBgyn, but I don't think you are supposed to do both at the same time...

Anyway, I have rambled enough here. I didn't really add anything. Maybe I'm just wanting to know if there's anything else I should do. Besides reinforcements, punishment for behavior, and the drugs he's on, I as a guy that didn't have kids going into this situation have done the best I could I think, it's been a helluva deal really. I'm actually going through his records myself now, because I want to know if there's anything there that was I could do.

Also, this is pretty long...i don't know if the ADD guys will be able to read it all and give me any insight LOL!!! Ok, just kidding...

 

[SamuraiFred]

Interesting thread.

One that I wouldn't usually touch, but since I have a step kid with ADD, one that I have now read fully and am intrigued about now.

My stepson has pretty severe ADD...or so we are told. But, I also have found a photo of him shortly after birth, with a blue face after forceps and auction and Apgars of 1 and 2. They actually ran a code on him as well.

He was diagnosed like most kids during elementary school. His grades continued to be for shit...until I met my wife and stepped into this family when he was 11. He's 18 now, about to graduate from high school and has nearly a 4.0 average, but he's in some of the alternative classes and his mom does help him quite a bit. He's usually in better spirits now as well.

What changed? Well, in that time I have had to lay hands on him once in defense. He took a swing at me once when I was telling him to stop playing video games (this was at age 13) and dodged it and ended it with a bear hug and him chilling out finally. Since then, no more physical altercations. He got into one fight at school and got his ass beat. That ended his fighting at school as well. I am strict on him, he doesn't get by with doing bullshit, but I have to walk that line since he's not my blood son and I don't want to alienate him. But, I do not have ADD/ADHD, more like OCD and so I'm probably looked on as a necessary thorn in his ass. But that's what my dad to me, and it worked.

He's on one medication, very light dose of Straterra. If he's off of it, he's not fun to be around, not one bit. He is VERY immature still, couldn't drive until 18 because he just couldn't figure it out. He's very slow on testing, and even with meds struggles with learning simple tasks such as putting gas into his car. He can't follow step by step instructions. Pretty much anything that takes several steps to complete is a mystery, he loses shit all the time, and still blames everyone else for any mistakes he makes.

Quite simply, he's a pain in the ass at times lol. But, the teachers have helped him quite a bit and so that has been great for him to get the grades he has so far.

I feel ADD/ADHD is a real issue, but how to handle it is different for everyone. With him, I think he was misdiagnosed and had some brain damage at birth (he has headaches a lot as well), and while I believe the ADD symptoms are there, I feel it's a result of something else that went unchecked due to a young mother who had no support from the FOB in this deal (he is dead now, took a header off of a motorcycle right when I met my wife...another can of worms) and her not insisting on more investigation of the delivery at the time.

I don't know what his future will be...he can't get up and get out the door without prodding, doesn't like instruction, and has yet to claim responsibility for a great many things when they occur. He has difficulties talking to people at times and his vocabulary is pretty limited. But, I have done what I could with what I had to work with. If I had been around In his formative years from say, 2 to 11, I could have developed a more fatherly relationship. But it's hard to come in and take over that role when he was so into his dad (who was a dead beat until he turned 11 and came in as a "hero" and then subsequently died), and he was just getting to know him during that time as well.

Should I have done more? Should I have punished him every time he starts cussing at his mom or blaming everyone in the house for "stealing" his stuff when he loses it? Maybe. But like he said once..."I feel like you are the enforcer"...which is true to a degree. Before me, he would push his 5 foot mom around when she would get onto him, but he won't do that now. But he still has his little anger issues, and there's the psychology of this whole thing coupled with his diagnosis that I have had to overcome. I really believe the trauma from a forceps plus auction delivery affected him greatly...and I'm not an OBgyn, but I don't think you are supposed to do both at the same time...

Anyway, I have rambled enough here. I didn't really add anything. Maybe I'm just wanting to know if there's anything else I should do. Besides reinforcements, punishment for behavior, and the drugs he's on, I as a guy that didn't have kids going into this situation have done the best I could I think, it's been a helluva deal really. I'm actually going through his records myself now, because I want to know if there's anything there that was I could do.

Also, this is pretty long...i don't know if the ADD guys will be able to read it all and give me any insight LOL!!! Ok, just kidding...

I think this is fascinating. One point that really hits home is what happens when they move into adulthood. My nephew is 10 and has major issues. I can't imagine what his adult life will look like.

 

[Rulz]

Man...I don't know if it helps or hurts sometimes that I'm not his real father. Because if I was, I would probably be more likely to come down harder on him at times. Because I can be pretty brutal when I'm highly annoyed. So in this situation I have been more lenient which has helped him in some ways...maybe hurt in others.

 

[Rdcldad]

Man...I don't know if it helps or hurts sometimes that I'm not his real father. Because if I was, I would probably be more likely to come down harder on him at times. Because I can be pretty brutal when I'm highly annoyed. So in this situation I have been more lenient which has helped him in some ways...maybe hurt in others.

god bless you

you are on the right track with childhood trauma as a root cause

i am a firm believer there are ways a fantastic therapist can get into repair or rewire those neuro pathways in your stepson and find a healthy more balanced adulthood

 

[nathajw]

Used a lot of adderral in college, a lot to study, a lil' to party, and none of it prescribed to me. You have a scrip on a college campus and you can make you some damn good money like a lot of people I know did. (good money for being a broke college kid anyway)

Used to take those 15 & 25 mg XR time released and go out, party till 5 in the morning, felt bullet proof. Pretty stupid looking back on it, stuff is powerful.