We had a good tournament. Proud of the team. We're not far off but still not close either. We have two hammers at 133 and 197 for the next 2-4 years. High All-American potential at 165. Other than that? Need two more hammers and 3-5 other AA types.
NCAA
- Thread starter Mrgrapple
- Start date
Didn’t that match end with an injury?
Ferrari lost to Adams in the same round
& no shame in losing to Buchanan as a true Freshman with limited experience.
Surber is an important prospect in the program with upset. Is he an NC contender next year? Likely not. That doesn’t diminish his future prospects.
The best thing for the team is AJ at 197 until Stevenson is gone. AJ can win the next 3-4 NC titles at 197.
I like Surber...but if AJ leaves for HWT, I'd hope we have someone up and ready. If Surber is just average, then I'd rather see AJ at 197 for the time being, but the weight cut is brutal for him.
IMO I'd let him be at 197 another year, and then consider HWT. Gable is a different kind of HWT, and Gable will score on him...I agree about Parris as well....From a style standpoint I think both would cause problems for Ferrari. 197 is where it's at for him at this particular juncture.
After watching him win as true freshman. Your going to bet against him?
Have you seen Gable Steveson? I think the world of AJ, but if you've watched Gable you wouldn't be asking that question in the first place.
I know this is new to you but Iowa nor penn state have the best facilities in the ncaa.
Ohio State does, you think that some big secret? WTF does that have to do with anything in my post?
Surber is a good wrestler and he has the frame for hwt. AJ is not very tall when talking about the 285 group. AJ needs to stay at 197 in my mind and grow Surber the next 2 years into a hwt.
I live in the current...not the past. Gable is a different animal. Literally no knock on AJ. If I had to pick who would in a head to head....I'd pick Steveson. Yes Gable is that good...not many HWT move like a 125er. Just cause AJ won a natty as a freshman, doesn't all of a sudden make him superior...sure doesn't make him teflon either.
AJ is a stud , daton needs to get more aggressive and we need a couple studs between 133 and 197
get the Stanford kid over here, he as the outstanding wrestler this year and is at 165
get the Stanford kid over here, he as the outstanding wrestler this year and is at 165
No, the problem is we saw Penn. St. show their continued greatness in the finals again. I did not think that RBY would win Nationals and have 2 years left. I thought Lee versus Eierman was an even battle bit Lee won. I thought Kemmerer would wreck Starocci like he did in the Big 10 finals but he didn't. Starocci has 4 years left. Brooks has 3 years left and was undefeated this year. They have Kerkvliet who is injured but is an All American and he has 4 years left. Beard is an All American and he has 4 years left. Berge got injured in the quarters and medical forfeited. He has 3 years left. True freshmen Bartlett and Howard look very good and were top 10 recruits. Besides having 2 of the top 3 recruits in the country coming in next year Facundo and VanNess. Yes things are looking much better for us. However Plott has struggled with serious injuries' for 2 straight years so we don't know what he can do. Older Mastro was pretty good for a true freshman but Howard has beaten him every time they have wrestled. It appears to me that Penn. St administration and financial backing is 10 times better than ours. Cael and his staff have clearly demonstrated they are superior Coaches to ours( we can not get a better Coach than John Smith). I think we will get team trophies for the next 5 years but I really question if we can beat Penn. St. in that time period. Iowa may beat us most of those years also. I really don't like it that Daton lost but I really don't like that 2 years ago Daton would have kicked RBY and lost to him tonight where RBY was clearly the better wrestler. Now my biggest problems is expectation of a team Championship in less than 20 years since we won our last 1. Coach Smith rigidness is a concern and that he did not push for upgrades like he should have. John thinks old school where you don't want shiny new stuff because you will become soft. Again I stress unless we could get Cael we can not find a better Coach. Also the sky is not falling . But I am left wondering how will we beat Penn. St. although Iowa did this year ( they have pulled in some great transfers and of course Spencer Lee).
I think the more likely scenario is Surber bulking up. He is getting big and has the frame to grown and add mass.
Ironically, not everyone remembers National Champs. Dean Heil has won since Alex.
I'm old and more forgetful than most. I appreciate the reminder and apologize to a great Cowboy wrestler Dean Heil. 2 time National Champion. His wrestling style on defense frustrated many wrestlers and non Cowboy fans that they changed rules(Can't hold unto a leg and be on your back more than a few counts) to combat his defense after his junior year.
Hey guys, it's been a while, congrats for a great tourney!. Mad respect for Sheets going alternate to AA! *oh, and AJ is absolutely hilarious! This is coming from a fellow Guido.
Yes. He's a scowling grumpy old man who hurts the team with his attacks on the refs. Get him out of the corner at least. Further, his individual achievements cast too long a shadow. His staff seems scared of him.
That quad-pod opens up a lot of scoring opportunities and is his favorite set up for his wing-roll-of-death /s
Hope AJ stays at 197 and Picklo goes 197 at OU. Would love to see them square off a few times!
another year and it will take snyder and cox to square off with AJ
kid simply broke the mold last night
He was able to take down a world class wrestler in Amine. I don’t see why people think he wouldn’t be competitive with anyone.
Think about this, AJ was only taken down ONCE in an entire season. His only TD was to Adams in his lone lose. Reversal is a different story but to only be taken down once in a season is pretty damn impressive. The splits this due can do to prevent a TD is freaking amazing. My balls hurt everytime I see him do that move to prevent a TD.
Nm
He corrected himself in his interview after wining his individual title and said he was taken down twice.
He corrected himself in his interview after wining his individual title and said he was taken down twice.
Those jumped off about 5 years ago when it became obvious there is nothing to be fair weather about.
When was the 2nd one? All I remember is Adams from WVU. He was reversed in the Big 12 finals against Buchanan from WYO.
AJ beat Amine by submission
Amine will never be a threat to AJ
Cox and Snyder are another level
He also gave up a takedown to Buchanan in the last 30 seconds of the Big12 final.
AJ had cut him to go for the major and I don't think he expected Buchanan to shoot again. AJ immediately got the reversal, but then ran out of time to get bonus points.
Fun fact about AJ... of the 7 other AAs @ 197 this year, AJ beat 5 of them during the college season. He also beat Elam at Junior Nationals in November. So the only guy he didn't beat was Beard from PSU because they didn't wrestle.
Gotcha, I must have missed it while watching the finals at Big 12. Still only giving up 2 TD in a year is still damn impressive.
AJ could not have been better prepared for the NCAA’s because of the talent in the Big 12 at 197
Adams has the power that prepared him for Amine
Buchanan is a bit under horse powered but an absolute cobra
Last might was a perfect storm for Fix that RBY was prepared to take advantage of
Another thought on this "fair weather" fan stuff. For whatever reason, OSU fans have always enjoyed attacking "fair weather" fans mostly over OU football. It was some defense mechanism to make our fandom more pure and better.
The big problem is fair weather fan revenue spends the same as an alums or someone who is staying with the program even when it sucks.
Fair weather fans is a sign of great success, branding, and marketing. Those revenues can boost your program far past what the alum base can support, any great program needs them. Fair weather fans jumping off the boat is usually the earliest sign you have a problem. These are fans that whose emotions are not tied in to the school and they want to identify with a winner and they want to be entertained and so for them this nothing more then spending their entertainment budget.
In a sport like wrestling, that has a very small fanbase to begin with and one that is knowledgeable and loves the sport, once you lose interest from the fair weather fans, it is that much harder to get back.
I started at OSU in the fall of 1979, the OSU/OU bedlam wrestling ticket was by far the most coveted on campus. I know times have changed, but there was serious passion for wrestling.
Making fun of someone as a fair weather fan from an old loyal alum, is usually coming from a defense mechanism to somehow elevate ourselves over our competition and silence those who perhaps who are not as emotionally involved.
The current HC and administration inherited the best sports program in all of North America, college or pro. It is their job to be good trustees of the program, a so called fair weather fan does not care about excuses. You sucked them in with excellence, they will run when you start to fail. The oddity of it all? It is those fair weather fans at OU in football that keep the bar raised high and non-alums sending their football playing son to OU, when they lose they run, and it hurts economically. Anyone remember the number of fans in the stands for OU/A&M for that blow out by A&M? Got their attention fast.
This is not about who should be fired or not, it is not about the quality of your fans, or what fans opinion should be listened to. It is about winning, that is the way it is in this state when it comes to OU football and at one time OSU wrestling.
I am willing to bet, that wrestling as a men's team sport at the collegiate level, the dispersion of national titles among the number of schools that have won one, is the least of all men's sports. Not only that, you have fewer programs. To finish in the top 10 at nationals each year? OSU should be able to do it falling out of bed.
We need to get at least 3,000 of those fair weather fans back to dual meets and at least sell out the lower bowl 4 or 5 times a year.
If we can't get in to the BIG, schedule the top 5 BIG teams each year and use that to get some sell outs and prepare your team for nationals.
Wrestling has changed over the decades, so many reasons why. It could be the alums and diehards without some new juice behind the program may have to lower their expectations just like the fair weather fans figured out years ago and decided to invest in something more rewarding to them.
It is a complicated situation, but doing the same thing is not working, and we should be situated based on our branding to do something about it but we are losing our branding. We will be getting close here soon that an 18 year old recruit will have never seen OSU win a NC in wrestling in his lifetime, and yet he is to believe while he is at OSU it is going to happen? For that 18 year old, OSU winning a NC is ancient history.
The big problem is fair weather fan revenue spends the same as an alums or someone who is staying with the program even when it sucks.
Fair weather fans is a sign of great success, branding, and marketing. Those revenues can boost your program far past what the alum base can support, any great program needs them. Fair weather fans jumping off the boat is usually the earliest sign you have a problem. These are fans that whose emotions are not tied in to the school and they want to identify with a winner and they want to be entertained and so for them this nothing more then spending their entertainment budget.
In a sport like wrestling, that has a very small fanbase to begin with and one that is knowledgeable and loves the sport, once you lose interest from the fair weather fans, it is that much harder to get back.
I started at OSU in the fall of 1979, the OSU/OU bedlam wrestling ticket was by far the most coveted on campus. I know times have changed, but there was serious passion for wrestling.
Making fun of someone as a fair weather fan from an old loyal alum, is usually coming from a defense mechanism to somehow elevate ourselves over our competition and silence those who perhaps who are not as emotionally involved.
The current HC and administration inherited the best sports program in all of North America, college or pro. It is their job to be good trustees of the program, a so called fair weather fan does not care about excuses. You sucked them in with excellence, they will run when you start to fail. The oddity of it all? It is those fair weather fans at OU in football that keep the bar raised high and non-alums sending their football playing son to OU, when they lose they run, and it hurts economically. Anyone remember the number of fans in the stands for OU/A&M for that blow out by A&M? Got their attention fast.
This is not about who should be fired or not, it is not about the quality of your fans, or what fans opinion should be listened to. It is about winning, that is the way it is in this state when it comes to OU football and at one time OSU wrestling.
I am willing to bet, that wrestling as a men's team sport at the collegiate level, the dispersion of national titles among the number of schools that have won one, is the least of all men's sports. Not only that, you have fewer programs. To finish in the top 10 at nationals each year? OSU should be able to do it falling out of bed.
We need to get at least 3,000 of those fair weather fans back to dual meets and at least sell out the lower bowl 4 or 5 times a year.
If we can't get in to the BIG, schedule the top 5 BIG teams each year and use that to get some sell outs and prepare your team for nationals.
Wrestling has changed over the decades, so many reasons why. It could be the alums and diehards without some new juice behind the program may have to lower their expectations just like the fair weather fans figured out years ago and decided to invest in something more rewarding to them.
It is a complicated situation, but doing the same thing is not working, and we should be situated based on our branding to do something about it but we are losing our branding. We will be getting close here soon that an 18 year old recruit will have never seen OSU win a NC in wrestling in his lifetime, and yet he is to believe while he is at OSU it is going to happen? For that 18 year old, OSU winning a NC is ancient history.
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AJ does a fantastic job of promoting Oklahoma State wrestling. He might be a pied piper for Cowboy wrestling. Actually already is with Anthony coming after next year because his older brother is here.
