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Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire

Been Jammin

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Jun 27, 2003
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I haven't been keeping track. Is the AP part of the fake news media?

AP FACT CHECK: Trump considers 20 million people 'very few'
By ALICIA A. CALDWELL and RICARDO ALONSO-ZALDIVAR
52 minutes ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump said Friday that his predecessor's health care law covers "very few people" as he minimized the impact of replacing it. That's only true if you consider more than 20 million people to be very few.

He took another mysterious poke at Sweden, too, and decried open U.S. borders that are not.

Here's a look at his statements at the Conservative Political Action Conference on Friday:

TRUMP: "Obamacare covers very few people."

THE FACTS: More than 20 million people are covered by the two major components of former President Barack Obama's health care law: expanded Medicaid and subsidized private health insurance.

The Medicaid expansion, adopted by 31 states and Washington, D.C., covers about 11 million low-income people, according to the Congressional Budget Office. The fate of the expansion is a major sticking point as Republicans try to complete their repeal plan. Sixteen states with GOP governors have expanded their Medicaid programs.

The other more visible component is HealthCare.gov. The federal website and state-run online insurance markets have signed up 12.2 million people for this year, according to an Associated Press count earlier this month, based on federal and state reports.

This is lower than the 12.7 million who initially enrolled for 2016. But it is not dramatically lower when considering the problems the markets have had with rising premiums and dwindling insurer participation, not to mention Trump's vow to repeal the program.

Altogether, since Obama's law passed in 2010, the number of uninsured people has dropped by about 20 million and the uninsured rate has declined below 9 percent, a historic low.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 48.6 million Americans were uninsured in 2010. Through the first nine months of last year, that figure was down to 28.2 million.

Although employers also added coverage as the economy recovered, experts say the vast majority of the coverage gains are due to Obama's law.

However, the progress in reducing the number of uninsured people appears to have stalled. The 28.2 million uninsured last year, from January to September, is not statistically different from the 28.6 million uninsured for all of 2015, according to the CDC.

___

TRUMP, repeating a week-old assertion that Sweden is an example of violence and extremism due to immigration: "Take a look at what happened in Sweden. I love Sweden, great country, great people, I love Sweden. But they understand. The people over there understand I'm right."

THE FACTS: Trump was ridiculed in Sweden after he warned at a rally in Florida that terrorism was growing in Europe and something terrible had happened in Sweden the previous night. But there had been no extraordinary trouble that night in Sweden, a country welcoming to immigrants. Two days later, though, a riot broke out after police arrested a drug crime suspect. Cars were set on fire and shops looted, but no one was injured. Attacks in the country related to extremism remain rare; the biggest surprise for many Swedes was that a police officer found it necessary to fire his gun.

___

TRUMP: The U.S. is providing security to other nations "while leaving our own border wide open. Anybody can come in. But don't worry, we're getting a wall. ... We're getting bad people out of this country."

THE FACTS: His wide-open border claim is bogus. The number of arrests of illegal border crossers — the best measure of how many people are trying to cross illegally — remains at a 40-year low. The U.S. government under presidents George W. Bush and Barack Obama roughly doubled the ranks of the Border Patrol in the last decade or so.

In addition, the number of people expelled from the country since Trump took office Jan. 20 has not been released. No available data supports his claim, made Thursday, that immigrants in the country illegally are being expelled at a rate "nobody has ever seen before." Deportations were brisk when Obama was president.

Altogether in January, 16,643 people were deported, a drop from December (20,395) but a number that is similar to monthly deportations in early 2015 and 2016.

This month, Homeland Security officials have said 680 people were arrested in a weeklong effort to find and arrest criminal immigrants living in the United States illegally. Three-quarters of those people had been convicted of crimes, Homeland Security Secretary John Kelly said. The remaining 25 percent were not. The government has not provided information about who was arrested in that roundup, so it's impossible to determine how many gang members or drug lords were in that group. It is also unclear how many of those "bad people" have actually been deported.

That roundup was largely planned before Trump took office and was alternately described by the Trump administration as a routine enforcement effort and a signal of his pledge to take a harder line on illegal immigration. During the Obama administration, similar operations were carried out that yielded thousands of arrests.

___

Find all AP Fact Checks here: http://apne.ws/2kbx8bd
 
It is illegal not to be insured. How many people break the law and pay the fine to have no part of it?

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 48.6 million Americans were uninsured in 2010. Through the first nine months of last year, that figure was down to 28.2 million.

A). Is it your contention that a significant number of those (approximately) 20 million people wish they did not have health insurance coverage?

B). I noticed that you are deflecting from Trump's claim that "very few people" are covered, when, in reality, the correct number is either about 48 Million or about 20 Million depending upon how you want to look at it.
 
It doesn't matter what they wish, obama made it illegal not to be insured so there is zero reason to brag when millions would rather break the law than be on it. The sell was "everyone" would have insurance.

What percentage is 20 million out of our entire population?
 
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It doesn't matter what they wish, obama made it illegal not to be insured so there is zero reason to brag when millions would rather break the law than be on it. The sell was "everyone" would have insurance.

What percentage is 20 million out of our entire population?

About 6.5%
 
Of course there is the number who were kicked off their plan and had to get signed up right?

I'm just repeating what I hear on Fox News so correct me if I'm wrong.
 
About 6.5%

raw
 
Of course there is the number who were kicked off their plan and had to get signed up right?

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 48.6 million Americans were uninsured in 2010. Through the first nine months of last year, that figure was down to 28.2 million.

US population is approximately 323 million. So, only about 9% of the population is uninsured.

Altogether, since Obama's law passed in 2010, the number of uninsured people has dropped by about 20 million and the uninsured rate has declined below 9 percent, a historic low.

But, I didn't start the thread to discuss the pros/cons of the ACA. My point is that the AP article pointed out 3 instances where Trump stated something questionable/erroneous. I am trying to figure out where the AP ranks as a source of news. Can they be trusted to give us factual information, or are they part of the liberal media conspiracy against Trump?
 
Been, believe the Medicaid expansion was turned down in some states because after 2017 the portion the fed would pay dropped from 100% to 90% (or maybe 80%), which constitutes an unfunded mandate. Why would states already in financial distress, agree to take on more expenditures for that.
 
About 6.5%
And yes, a significant portion of that % do NOT have the required coverage because they choose NOT to. Why in the **** do you think they REQUIRED you to have coverage and require employers to provide tax forms proving you have coverage and require you to state when completing your 1040 that you have health insurance?

No offense, but citing an AP fact-check is a ****ing joke. Do you think they submitted every throwaway line Obama uttered to the same level of fact-check scrutiny?
 
And yes, a significant portion of that % do NOT have the required coverage because they choose NOT to. Why in the **** do you think they REQUIRED you to have coverage and require employers to provide tax forms proving you have coverage and require you to state when completing your 1040 that you have health insurance?

No offense, but citing an AP fact-check is a ****ing joke. Do you think they submitted every throwaway line Obama uttered to the same level of fact-check scrutiny?

You talkin' to me Willis?

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No offense, but citing an AP fact-check is a ****ing joke. Do you think they submitted every throwaway line Obama uttered to the same level of fact-check scrutiny?

So, the AP is part of the liberal MSM and can not be trusted? That is what I am trying to determine. As far as I know, Trump has not yet called out the AP as fake news. I follow the AP on Twitter and want to know if I am getting CNN level propaganda when I read their stories.
 
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So, the AP is part of the liberal MSM and can not be trusted? That is what I am trying to determine. As far as I know, Trump has not yet called out the AP as fake news. I follow the AP on Twitter and want to know if I am getting CNN level propaganda when I read their stories.


Now this is a great post. Been jammin stay with the 24/7 board we will have you straightened out by Christmas!
 
So, the AP is part of the liberal MSM and can not be trusted? That is what I am trying to determine. As far as I know, Trump has not yet called out the AP as fake news. I follow the AP on Twitter and want to know if I am getting CNN level propaganda when I read their stories.
Correct. CNN level? -- Not sure.
 
The problem is that any news outlet that Mr. Trump does not agree with, he labels as "fake news" , or any news outlet that fact checks him, or calls him out he says is fake........the worse part though, is that people actually believe him when he says that............He likes Fox, because if he says something, they just produce the story of what he says, the other media outlets produce the story, then fact check it, and report what is true about it and what is not...........when they do that , to him its "fake news"...........EVERYTHING he says should be fact checked and when not accurate, he needs to be held accountable...........
 
The problem is that any news outlet that Mr. Trump does not agree with, he labels as "fake news" , or any news outlet that fact checks him, or calls him out he says is fake........the worse part though, is that people actually believe him when he says that............He likes Fox, because if he says something, they just produce the story of what he says, the other media outlets produce the story, then fact check it, and report what is true about it and what is not...........when they do that , to him its "fake news"...........EVERYTHING he says should be fact checked and when not accurate, he needs to be held accountable...........
I don't particularly like it when he says this all the time. But, what he is doing is refusing to play by their rules and turning a stupid phrase they tried to use as a cudgel to squelch any media outside "the MSM" right back against them. Using the Rules for Radicals playbook against Democratic spokespersons with bylines.
 
I don't particularly like it when he says this all the time. But, what he is doing is refusing to play by their rules and turning a stupid phrase they tried to use as a cudgel to squelch any media outside "the MSM" right back against them. Using the Rules for Radicals playbook against Democratic spokespersons with bylines.
Whether you like it or not, ANYONE in power who sets out to de legitimize the media is someone who needs to be watched very close. Whether they slant one way or the other , the media is one of the few ways normal citizens can keep leaders in check.
 
Whether you like it or not, ANYONE in power who sets out to de legitimize the media is someone who needs to be watched very close. Whether they slant one way or the other , the media is one of the few ways normal citizens can keep leaders in check.
Thanks for reminding me Professor Civics.
 
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Do your own work. Answering my question lets you know exactly how stovepiped news is.
 
Question

Does this count as a bed shitting?

( remember, this is for science)
 
Yeah, I sleep well every night knowing the propaganda machine of the left is looking out for their self-interests.
I look at Fox, CNN and Skynews, as far as on the internet. They all report the same news, the biggest difference is that CNN tends to look more into the facts and reports on what is correct and what is not.......one example was after Mr. Spicer's first press briefing where he jumped all over the media .........both CNN and Fox did articles that told what Mr. Spicer had said. Fox left it right there, CNN took the stats that Mr. Spicer told the group and reported which were accurate and which were not, and then gave the correct ones. To me that is not propaganda, it is holding the WH accountable for the information they disseminate. When Kelly Ann Conway was told they facts were not accurate, that is when she came out with the "Alternative facts" statement.........I am sorry, that is not acceptable..................
 
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Altogether, since Obama's law passed in 2010, the number of uninsured people has dropped by about 20 million and the uninsured rate has declined below 9 percent, a historic low.
If it's so great, why is it falling apart? Insurers are bailing and it isn't sustainable in its current form. It has to be changed to even survive.

The reality is that it's great for those fortunate enough to suckle the government tit through Medicaid expansion and subsidies, and it's great for folks that have plenty of disposable income to buffer the rate and deductible increases, and it blows for us working joes who have neither.

The folks suckling the tit have it made. I'm taking it by a fist covered by a very dry falconers glove with the falcon still perched. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a higher insured rate, but I'm getting to pay a decent amount for the government cash handout to work. In some cases, these folks could have had insurance before but didn't want the hassle of paying for it.
 
If it's so great, why is it falling apart? Insurers are bailing and it isn't sustainable in its current form. It has to be changed to even survive.

It surely isn't perfect. Even if it is not repealed, it needs to be adjusted.

I don't think it is fantastic, but it has made a significant positive difference for millions of US citizens. I am pretty confident that this is what will prevent the GOP from repealing it. (or, possibly they will repeal it and replace it with something very similar, just so they can say they repealed it).

I figure that the GOP will realize that enough people will be effed over, if they repeal, that they (the GOP) will end up keeping it in place but making significant adjustments that will (hopefully) fix some of the negatives.

I had insurance before, and my premiums have increased significantly. I own a small business, and the ACA has put a hit on my bottom line. But, some of my employees, who never had access to insurance before, have it now, and my son, who has autism, can no longer be denied services due to "preexisting conditions". I would prefer to pay less, and prefer more options. But, it is pretty common that pros are accompanied by cons.
 
It surely isn't perfect. Even if it is not repealed, it needs to be adjusted.

I don't think it is fantastic, but it has made a significant positive difference for millions of US citizens. I am pretty confident that this is what will prevent the GOP from repealing it. (or, possibly they will repeal it and replace it with something very similar, just so they can say they repealed it).

I figure that the GOP will realize that enough people will be effed over, if they repeal, that they (the GOP) will end up keeping it in place but making significant adjustments that will (hopefully) fix some of the negatives.

I had insurance before, and my premiums have increased significantly. I own a small business, and the ACA has put a hit on my bottom line. But, some of my employees, who never had access to insurance before, have it now, and my son, who has autism, can no longer be denied services due to "preexisting conditions". I would prefer to pay less, and prefer more options. But, it is pretty common that pros are accompanied by cons.
Don't disagree at all. But this is what happens with party line legislation. All of the goodies still haven't kicked in. When the taxpayer guaranteed profits for insurance companies got axed by Cruz (and rightfully so), the thing started to unravel. I firmly believe bipartisan legislation would have exposed some of the bullshit and sought compromise.

I'm all in on healthcare reform that's actually reform. Disguised cash grabs are never good regardless of what they are called.
 
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