Germanwings Airbus crash
- Thread starter Rulz
- Start date
Hope I'm wrong, but I'm getting a sickening vibe in my gut about this one.
Similar to Malasian 370, no word from cockpit, even after the plane is obviously in peril. The Malasian plane changed course before beginning its long descent into the ocean, never to be seen again.
The GermanWing stayed very near on course but descended fairly rapidly into the side of a mountain -- all while seemingly under control. The plane was going 450 mph when it hit solid rock.
People who have been to the site say there are no human body parts large enough to be recoverable. The photos show the plane itself looks like it had been fed through a giant metal grinder that reduced it to tiny pieces.
One black box has already been found. If they find the other one, the two may give us insight into Malasian 370. If someone is hacking into airliners' communications and control signals ... wow, they will paralyze air travel. Their power over the world would be limitless.
Similar to Malasian 370, no word from cockpit, even after the plane is obviously in peril. The Malasian plane changed course before beginning its long descent into the ocean, never to be seen again.
The GermanWing stayed very near on course but descended fairly rapidly into the side of a mountain -- all while seemingly under control. The plane was going 450 mph when it hit solid rock.
People who have been to the site say there are no human body parts large enough to be recoverable. The photos show the plane itself looks like it had been fed through a giant metal grinder that reduced it to tiny pieces.
One black box has already been found. If they find the other one, the two may give us insight into Malasian 370. If someone is hacking into airliners' communications and control signals ... wow, they will paralyze air travel. Their power over the world would be limitless.
I wouldn't. Why hurry?
I'd let the black boxes speak for me on this one. If investigators can prove this plane's contols were over-ridden by someone on the ground (or a suicide perp on the plane), they will also realize these two crashes are essentially identical. They may or may not announce their findings -- if they know someone else was controlling the planes.
Then, the ultimate terror infliction for the perps is to announce, six months from now, that a plane already in the air is about to be brought down. When it happens, what recourse would we have but to ground flights?
Until the perps were located and eliminated, it would change life as we know it. I guess the game then would be to encrypt the fly-by-wire controls or protect them from outside interference some way.
I'd let the black boxes speak for me on this one. If investigators can prove this plane's contols were over-ridden by someone on the ground (or a suicide perp on the plane), they will also realize these two crashes are essentially identical. They may or may not announce their findings -- if they know someone else was controlling the planes.
Then, the ultimate terror infliction for the perps is to announce, six months from now, that a plane already in the air is about to be brought down. When it happens, what recourse would we have but to ground flights?
Until the perps were located and eliminated, it would change life as we know it. I guess the game then would be to encrypt the fly-by-wire controls or protect them from outside interference some way.
The distress signal was sent by controllers on the ground who realized the plane was losing altitude at a steady rate but could not get a response from the pilots about what was going on.
Not a word from the cockpit before or during the descent -- just like Malasia 370.
Not a word from the cockpit before or during the descent -- just like Malasia 370.
This prompted me to do a little research. Wow! Talk about a terrifying possibility. Also, I agree with AggiesBoy on not taking credit for take down, optimally they would stay quiet to ensure maximum use of this method in one quick shot. The thing that would make the most sense to me is that they are perfecting the method and keeping quiet. If they can perfect their method they could select multiple flights with almost the exact same time and date of departure, have multiple individuals purchase tickets to board, and then bring down dozens, if not hundreds, of flights at exactly the same time all over the world. Then they make an announcement. As someone that flies frequently for work this scares the shit out of me. And the potential for mass chaos and death only increases if they can do it remotely without ever boarding.
It also makes me think perhaps I should have reported an incident last September on a flight from Atlanta to Dallas. The guy beside me was on a smart phone and the screen showed flight information and he was taking notes. And I'm not talking flight tracker like what my wife uses, it was detailed information. The screen showed latitude, longitude, speed, elevation, direction, our flight number, he could toggle to see other flights in our area, and even had what looked like what I would call a digital flight control panel, I'll see if I can find a picture kind of like what I'm describing. He never took his eyes off the thing and he was writing stuff down. I know nothing about flying outside of being a passenger. So I chalked it up to me being paranoid. I searched a ton of apps when I landed trying to find what he was looking at and I even memorized some of the stuff he had written down at the time. Can't remember it at all now.
guys...there is back up equipment to eliminate any of this. You can also go back to your backup steam powered gauges (analog) and fly the aircraft. No way they could make this happen. What you probably saw was a program similar to ForeFlight which can do everything for the pilot...and it may have been Foreflight.
Thank you purkey. I just looked up foreflight and that is exactly what I saw. Hope you are right about prevention of remote hijack. I know the military uses Sincgars but what about frequency jamming to eliminate communication for airlines? How hard would that be to pull off?
Even with analog instruments giving the pilot enough basic flight info to fly the aircraft, a fly-by-wire plane still is vulnerable to outside control override.
When the pilot moves the flight controls, the movements of the wheel and rudder are digitized and enter the flight computer which may tweek the commands before sending the signal "by wire" to the control surfaces. It's in the computer where some believe the pilot's instructions can be intercepted and/or over-ridden.
The Airbus went down in a rapid, but controlled, 32,000-foot descent in clear weather, daylight, straight into the side of a mountain. The descent was constant. It maintained cruise airspeed which would indicate engines throttled back in addition to a nose down attitude. It also maintained directional control by not deviating from its planned flight path.
Any way you look at it, it's spooky. The CEO said he cannot understand how a plane which was inspected hours before its flight and with two pilots of this pair's expertise could crash in these conditions.
I can't go to another site without losing what I've written, so I will look up more info on the Malasian crash later. But I think it was also an airbus (the 320 series and the Boeing triple 7 are the only(???) fly by wire planes in commercial use), also lost communications before control was lost and also went into a (much, much slower) controlled descent until flew out if radar range and has not been seen to this day.
I need to get a couple of vehicles inside, so here's my last crazy idea: don't forget Putin's recent insane saber rattling when you consider that our best military aircraft are fly by wire.
When the pilot moves the flight controls, the movements of the wheel and rudder are digitized and enter the flight computer which may tweek the commands before sending the signal "by wire" to the control surfaces. It's in the computer where some believe the pilot's instructions can be intercepted and/or over-ridden.
The Airbus went down in a rapid, but controlled, 32,000-foot descent in clear weather, daylight, straight into the side of a mountain. The descent was constant. It maintained cruise airspeed which would indicate engines throttled back in addition to a nose down attitude. It also maintained directional control by not deviating from its planned flight path.
Any way you look at it, it's spooky. The CEO said he cannot understand how a plane which was inspected hours before its flight and with two pilots of this pair's expertise could crash in these conditions.
I can't go to another site without losing what I've written, so I will look up more info on the Malasian crash later. But I think it was also an airbus (the 320 series and the Boeing triple 7 are the only(???) fly by wire planes in commercial use), also lost communications before control was lost and also went into a (much, much slower) controlled descent until flew out if radar range and has not been seen to this day.
I need to get a couple of vehicles inside, so here's my last crazy idea: don't forget Putin's recent insane saber rattling when you consider that our best military aircraft are fly by wire.
Looking more likely that it was terrorism...NY Times reporting that black box indicates that pilot was locked out of cockpit. Also, no response from cockpit to attempts by French air control to request what was going on during the descent.
On Sunday morning I flew on an A320 from Barcelona to Munich on a Lufthansa flight. the Dusseldorf flight was parked almost in the next gate to ours.
I really need to write down all my strange international flight experiences. If any of you remember in 2006 when they caught the terrorists in London going to blow up planes with liquids, it's very possible that I would have been on one of the targeted flights.
But unfortunately for you all I'm still here.
I really need to write down all my strange international flight experiences. If any of you remember in 2006 when they caught the terrorists in London going to blow up planes with liquids, it's very possible that I would have been on one of the targeted flights.
But unfortunately for you all I'm still here.
One pilot being locked out explains a lot. It also makes finding the missing memory card from the flight info recorder less critical. I'm glad it wasn't what I feared.
Will be very interesting to learn the story of the pilot who actually was flying the plane.
Will be very interesting to learn the story of the pilot who actually was flying the plane.
I was about to post this. The recording evidently has audio of him frantically pounding on the door and trying to smash it down.
TOG, no one wants anything horrible to happen to you, we'd just like you to go somewhere far away.
And stay there.
Seriously, I'll bet when you realized how close you were to the doomed plane, your hair really stood on end.
Oh, DAMNit!!!!
And stay there.
Seriously, I'll bet when you realized how close you were to the doomed plane, your hair really stood on end.
Oh, DAMNit!!!!
looks like the pilot who was in the cockpit just got out of school and had like 700 hours total time. At least that is what's being reported. That makes it doubtful the pilot in the cockpit, who had to be pretty young, was having any kind of a medical emergency. Unfortunately, there is no way to determine that. Still some missing pieces to the puzzle.
He was born in Germany and a German citizen. Most likely not Muslim, unless he converted as an adult. It will be very interesting to find out more about his background/life.
Starting to remind me of the Egyptair crash of 99, which is still in contention as to whether the copilot was committing suicide.
The planes nosed over and the copilot said "I rely on God" over and over as the plane went down. The Egyptians would never say for sure the pilot committed suicide, but I believe the NTSB felt that was the case after their portion of the investigation. I haven't looked at that case in a while, can't remember all the details. I have researched plane crashes on the Internet for awhile now, cvr transcripts and such. The air crash investigation and Mayday shows are quite interesting. I would assume this event will be one of those shows in the future. But it can take a looong time for the full investigation to be over. It took two years to find that Egyptair plane. I assume it will be at least that long to find the maylaysian plane.
This post was edited on 3/26 8:52 AM by Rulz
The planes nosed over and the copilot said "I rely on God" over and over as the plane went down. The Egyptians would never say for sure the pilot committed suicide, but I believe the NTSB felt that was the case after their portion of the investigation. I haven't looked at that case in a while, can't remember all the details. I have researched plane crashes on the Internet for awhile now, cvr transcripts and such. The air crash investigation and Mayday shows are quite interesting. I would assume this event will be one of those shows in the future. But it can take a looong time for the full investigation to be over. It took two years to find that Egyptair plane. I assume it will be at least that long to find the maylaysian plane.
This post was edited on 3/26 8:52 AM by Rulz
If it was a terrorist group, I would guess "yes".
If you want think Hollywood Mission Impossible level villians, maybe not. Just to be clear, I don't give any credence to this possability. But, what if, someone was able to start hacking into planes controls and sending them smashing into the earth or ocean at any time. Could they attempt to hold many of the Tier I countries hostage in exchange for not causing complete travel chaos?
If suicide
which is what this appears to be
what the f*** happened to just blowing your own brains out. Seriously, what a f***-upped individual. I guess the reality is all suicidal people are messed up, but why are there those that have to take out others on their way out?
I don't know, just a heart wrenching story. I can't imagine what it would be like to be a person on a flight like that.
This is a bad deal for a lot of reasons, but it's brings about the question in everyone's mind the next time you step on a plane....
In the 80s and 90s, you just worried about the pilot being drunk or perhaps the plane not being serviced well. Now, you have to worry about bombs, rockets, fighter jets, exploding shoes, box cutters and pilots in need of Prozac....or Zoloft.
Makes DB Cooper look like a nice guy.
In the 80s and 90s, you just worried about the pilot being drunk or perhaps the plane not being serviced well. Now, you have to worry about bombs, rockets, fighter jets, exploding shoes, box cutters and pilots in need of Prozac....or Zoloft.
Makes DB Cooper look like a nice guy.
I once heard on some cop docu-drama show that suicidal people are often also homicidal.
I'm not sure that that is true and I certainly don't have any idea if that was the case here, but it sounds reasonable to me.
I am no pilot.... don't know the first thing about flying an airplane.... My boss is a liscensed pilot, but on my smaller planes. He is telling me that he thinks there is a problem with some of the sensors on the Airbus. Says the rate of descent decreased if you look at the flight log. He thinks the reason that the co-pilot left the pilot locked out is that he had both hands on the stick trying to pull it out of the autopilot descent and he didn't want to take his hands off the stick to let the pilot in because the rate of descent was getting better...... I have no idea whether or not my boss is right....just thought that I would throw that theory out there given all the character assassination going on in the media, just because the guy had a doctors note.....
Very interesting here is that there is an emergency entry code. I wonder if the "alpha protection mode" has any affect on the emergency entry code. Why could the pilot not use the emergency entry code?
A320 Cockpit Door
A320 Cockpit Door
The pilot did use the emergency code, but the cockpit has a switch that you can hit within 30 seconds to keep the door remaining locked.
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