Why is Trump so demonized?

[MegaPoke]

I laid out some concerns I have yesterday but the question really should be - where does the fantastic hyperbole come from?

Fascist, etc. where does this silly shit originate and to what purpose? So many legit things to be at least a little concerned about, why isn't the cartoon criticism and hitler inferences laughed away by grown ups in the media and establishment opposition.

Discuss.

 

[imprimis]

When you have sunk to the levels explained in this article there is nothing left to use to hold onto power than these attacks. Desperate times...

Democrats in the Wilderness.

http://www.politico.com/magazine/st...nistration-wilderness-comeback-revival-214650

 

[07pilt]

I laid out some concerns I have yesterday but the question really should be - where does the fantastic hyperbole come from?

Fascist, etc. where does this silly shit originate and to what purpose? So many legit things to be at least a little concerned about, why isn't the cartoon criticism and hitler inferences laughed away by grown ups in the media and establishment opposition.

Discuss.

1) He doesn't play by the traditional rules of politics. 2) Some people see that as a general disregard for rules. 3) Some people think regard for rules is necessary to maintain a functional constitutional republic.

I think 1) is unquestionable and everyone can agree
I agree with 2) but it is debatable
I agree with 3) and don't see it as debatable, but I think Pence and Preibus and other can check this.

Then when you combine that with the nationalism and populism it is kind of a recipe for fascism. I am not saying he is a fascist but the ingredients are there.

Why do you think the nazis and klan supported him over Ted Cruz?

The Muslim ban and the way he talked about deporting immigrants in real terms not just in the abstract were the only things that really make him stand out from as worse standard Republican in terms of proposals.

Do you remember the hyperbole surrounding Obama? The hyperbole surrounding Trump is a little more extreme and coming from different sources (naturally) but it isn't outside of what you would expect in these times of hyperpartisanship.

 

[CowboyJD]

I laid out some concerns I have yesterday but the question really should be - where does the fantastic hyperbole come from?

Fascist, etc. where does this silly shit originate and to what purpose? So many legit things to be at least a little concerned about, why isn't the cartoon criticism and hitler inferences laughed away by grown ups in the media and establishment opposition.

Discuss.

I agree the fascist hyperbole is stupid and should be laughed away.......

Fantastic hyperbole coming from his twitter account leads to the feeling by the other side that has to resort to the same thing. Fantasticly hyperbolic tweets/memes/articles from the #MAGA crowd proclaiming the second coming add to the frenzied response.

Retweeting tweets of white/European nationalists and other far, far right people by Trump and retweeting Mussolini quotes doesn't help either.

Finally, I think some of it is attempted payback for Trump's and other "birthers" claims and demands during the past eight years. I personally considered all the birther and Muslim screeches as having about the same credibility level, but there are people still....eight years later....arguing those claims are entirely credible or that "there's something to that" even now, and some of them may very well do so in response to this.

We just seem to be in an era of governance, politics, and pretty much all debate and discussion being done by meme and troll rather than reasoned discussion.

 

[CowboyJD]

Do you remember the hyperbole surrounding Obama? The hyperbole surrounding Trump is a little more extreme and coming from different sources (naturally) but it isn't outside of what you would expect in these times of hyperpartisanship.

This.

There is no longer an "honorable opposition" for either side....merely "enemies" and "devils" that must be crushed to save all of the great unwashed masses soles.

 

[squeak]

1) He doesn't play by the traditional rules of politics. 2) Some people see that as a general disregard for rules. 3) Some people think regard for rules is necessary to maintain a functional constitutional republic.

I think 1) is unquestionable and everyone can agree
I agree with 2) but it is debatable
I agree with 3) and don't see it as debatable, but I think Pence and Preibus and other can check this.

Then when you combine that with the nationalism and populism it is kind of a recipe for fascism. I am not saying he is a fascist but the ingredients are there.

Why do you think the nazis and klan supported him over Ted Cruz?

The Muslim ban and the way he talked about deporting immigrants in real terms not just in the abstract were the only things that really make him stand out from as worse standard Republican in terms of proposals.

Do you remember the hyperbole surrounding Obama? The hyperbole surrounding Trump is a little more extreme and coming from different sources (naturally) but it isn't outside of what you would expect in these times of hyperpartisanship.

He talked about deporting legal immigrants?

 

[MegaPoke]

Good answers. I've got follow up thoughts I'll post this evening.

 

[07pilt]

He talked about deporting legal immigrants?

It is not that he talked about it, it is how he talked about it. All the Republicans talk about it. But, usually they talk about it in the abstract, and you can tell they are just saying it to trick the rubes. Trump talked in fairly vivid detail that made it much more believable.
When Romney talked about immigration I felt bad for the 10-20 families that were going to get deported as a symbollic gesture. When Trump talked about it I felt bad for the millions of families that were going to get deported because no one told him it was all just a con for the rubes.

 

[squeak]

But you mean illegal immigrants, correct?

 

[Medic007]

the way he talked about deporting ILLEGAL immigrants

FIFY. Not that the word "illegal" is of any significance to what Trump said. Immigrant, ILLEGAL immigrant, same thing to the liberal, right?

 

[07pilt]

Yeah he didn't talk about deport legal immigrants did he?

 

[07pilt]

Also @MegaPoke I would like to report medic for calling me a liberal.

 

[squeak]

Also @MegaPoke I would like to report medic for calling me a liberal.

I second that. Pilt is definitely a commie.

 

[squeak]

Yeah he didn't talk about deport legal immigrants did he?

No, but an African American woman I work with is convinced she's going to get sent back to Africa. Must be that private school education she received.

 

[ThorOdinson13]

No, but an African American woman I work with is convinced she's going to get sent back to Africa. Must be that private school education she received.

Shirley,

you are joking.

 

[Medic007]

Yeah he didn't talk about deport legal immigrants did he?

No, he did. Constantly. It was one of the cornerstones of his campaign. He talked about deporting legal immigrants at every rally, campaign event, interview, debate, and he even had it painted on the Trump Tower. He said he's deporting all legal immigrants to make room for the illegal immigrants that want to be here. I heard him say he's even deporting his wife. I think that was when he came to Norman.

 

[anon_xl72qcu5isp39]

Back out the racism stuff, as if nobody thinks hes racist. Back out his women issues. He's a shitty person. He cheats good people. Small businesses by the thousands, even the lawyers that defended him. His university was a big fraud. He lied plainly and loudly early on about his p.i.'s in Hawaii having a bombshell next Monday. (The anti-Obama crowd didn't care that he lied.) He cheated veterans and vendors. He lies constantly. He bulked his own campaign with exorbitant rental rates and self dealing. He's not setting up a blind trust or functional equivalent. (You would shit the Internet if Obama did that) He won't release his tax returns because there's something incriminating in them. He hasn't outperformed an index fund with his inherited wealth but acts like he's a genius, just like Bloomberg said. And that's not counting his bankrupted liabilities. He'd have been insolvent three times over. He really hurt Atlantic city after making vague, grandiose promises. He eats his steak well done. Never drank alcohol. There's probable cause to believe he's compromised or conflicted with Russia. One of his sons inspired the character of lucius malfoy. He's a narcissist and probably clinically loony. He's an international pariah for bragging about building a wall and making Mexico pay for it, just like Biff woupdate. He lost by 2,800,000 votes. He appointed Scott Pruitt over the EPA and Rick Perry over the DOE. Perry says now it should NOT be closed because he's found out what they do, like regulating nuclear energy plants. So we're in good hands there.

 

[poke2001]

Back out the racism stuff, as if nobody thinks hes racist. Back out his women issues. He's a shitty person. He cheats good people. Small businesses by the thousands, even the lawyers that defended him. His university was a big fraud. He lied plainly and loudly early on about his p.i.'s in Hawaii having a bombshell next Monday. (The anti-Obama crowd didn't care that he lied.) He cheated veterans and vendors. He lies constantly. He bulked his own campaign with exorbitant rental rates and self dealing. He's not setting up a blind trust or functional equivalent. (You would shit the Internet if Obama did that) He won't release his tax returns because there's something incriminating in them. He hasn't outperformed an index fund with his inherited wealth but acts like he's a genius, just like Bloomberg said. And that's not counting his bankrupted liabilities. He'd have been insolvent three times over. He really hurt Atlantic city after making vague, grandiose promises. He eats his steak well done. Never drank alcohol. There's probable cause to believe he's compromised or conflicted with Russia. One of his sons inspired the character of lucius malfoy. He's a narcissist and probably clinically loony. He's an international pariah for bragging about building a wall and making Mexico pay for it, just like Biff woupdate. He lost by 2,800,000 votes. He appointed Scott Pruitt over the EPA and Rick Perry over the DOE. Perry says now it should NOT be closed because he's found out what they do, like regulating nuclear energy plants. So we're in good hands there.

Learn to use paragraphs fella. I got lost reading this.

 

[anon_xl72qcu5isp39]

Learn to use paragraphs fella. I got lost reading this.

It's scripture. 1000 years from now they'll break it up into verses.

 

[Medic007]

Back out the racism stuff, as if nobody thinks hes racist. Back out his women issues. He's a shitty person. He cheats good people. Small businesses by the thousands, even the lawyers that defended him. His university was a big fraud. He lied plainly and loudly early on about his p.i.'s in Hawaii having a bombshell next Monday. (The anti-Obama crowd didn't care that he lied.) He cheated veterans and vendors. He lies constantly. He bulked his own campaign with exorbitant rental rates and self dealing. He's not setting up a blind trust or functional equivalent. (You would shit the Internet if Obama did that) He won't release his tax returns because there's something incriminating in them. He hasn't outperformed an index fund with his inherited wealth but acts like he's a genius, just like Bloomberg said. And that's not counting his bankrupted liabilities. He'd have been insolvent three times over. He really hurt Atlantic city after making vague, grandiose promises. He eats his steak well done. Never drank alcohol. There's probable cause to believe he's compromised or conflicted with Russia. One of his sons inspired the character of lucius malfoy. He's a narcissist and probably clinically loony. He's an international pariah for bragging about building a wall and making Mexico pay for it, just like Biff woupdate. He lost by 2,800,000 votes. He appointed Scott Pruitt over the EPA and Rick Perry over the DOE. Perry says now it should NOT be closed because he's found out what they do, like regulating nuclear energy plants. So we're in good hands there.

None of what he did happened while being paid to do a job by the taxpayers. Sucks, but it is what it is. Hillary had plenty of chances to be honest about anything, any one thing, and chose to continue to think people were dumb enough to believe her bullshit. Poor calculation on her part.

I feel ya bro, but elections have consequences. I still maintain that the Dems need to clean house and come back to reality or it's going to get worse. The country needs a CREDIBLE opposition party.

 

[WCPoke]

I laid out some concerns I have yesterday but the question really should be - where does the fantastic hyperbole come from?

Fascist, etc. where does this silly shit originate and to what purpose? So many legit things to be at least a little concerned about, why isn't the cartoon criticism and hitler inferences laughed away by grown ups in the media and establishment opposition.

Discuss.

Reason = He's the President and a Republican.

Dems will try to rationalize the defeat for years. Excuses will be plenty and attempts to change the narrative will be commonplace.

End of the day = Donald Trump is the President of the United States.

 

[Medic007]

Reason = He's the President and a Republican.

Dems will try to rationalize the defeat for years. Excuses will be plenty and attempts to change the narrative will be commonplace.

End of the day = Donald Trump is the President of the United States.

And it was Democrats who chose to select someone under FBI criminal investigation to run against him. They should be fiercely kicking their own ass.

 

[windriverrange]

The whole thing with Trump reminds me of The MASH episode where Hawkeye and Trapper created "Captain Tuttle" who donated supplies to the orphanage, gave his 14 months back pay to the orphanage and was an all-American type guy. They created him out of thin air, and by the end of the show everyone was acting like they knew him, his bravery and his generosity. Same with Trump, most of the people terrified of him are basing everything off of something someone else said, or something they have read in this or that publication, probably a lie or certainly out of context (see Robert Bork or Jeff Sessions previously). Eventually the group think grabs their ass and they are poking knitting needles in Donald Trump dolls. Not because they have done any insightful research, but simply because they are being told (or led) to base conclusions that are just crap.

There are times Trump has done himself no favors, some of it is unforced errors but some of it just pure brilliance. As someone on this board said before, and quoting Denzel, he is playing chess while the press is playing checkers. Gonna be an interesting 4 or 8 years......doubt he will get any slack, even if he has a GDP of 5%+ and creates 60 million jobs. Oh and for the libs, The Rodent in Chief still sucks!

 

[squeak]

Shirley,

you are joking.

I'm not joking, and please don't call me Shirley.

 

[MegaPoke]

1) He doesn't play by the traditional rules of politics. 2) Some people see that as a general disregard for rules. 3) Some people think regard for rules is necessary to maintain a functional constitutional republic.

I think 1) is unquestionable and everyone can agree
I agree with 2) but it is debatable
I agree with 3) and don't see it as debatable, but I think Pence and Preibus and other can check this.

I agree with you that these things are concerning or could be - but it doesn't understand the fascism accusations. It just explains why people are uneasy and susceptible to buying into the accusations that come from somewhere else.

Then when you combine that with the nationalism and populism it is kind of a recipe for fascism. I am not saying he is a fascist but the ingredients are there.

Totally disagree that a recipe for this exists in American politics, and I really think a ton of other context would have to exist for your recipe to make anything other than Teddy Roosevelt style nationalism.

Why do you think the nazis and klan supported him over Ted Cruz?

Did they? I had no idea. I've never met a member of either bunch. I would submit that they are so statistically irrelevant that their main purpose is to be straw men for the narrative I'm questioning ITT.

The Muslim ban and the way he talked about deporting immigrants in real terms not just in the abstract were the only things that really make him stand out from as worse standard Republican in terms of proposals.

This is actually a pretty good example of the problem. He advocated extreme vetting and a temporary ban on immigrants from specifically high terror countries - not all muslims. And there is a difference you must admit in "immigrants" and "illegal immigrants who have committed crimes."

o you remember the hyperbole surrounding Obama? The hyperbole surrounding Trump is a little more extreme and coming from different sources (naturally) but it isn't outside of what you would expect in these times of hyperpartisanship.

I really don't. I'm sorry. I've never seen anything like this in my life. I think this is an unprecedented level of division and hysteria.

 

[MegaPoke]

Fantastic hyperbole coming from his twitter account leads to the feeling by the other side that has to resort to the same thing. Fantasticly hyperbolic tweets/memes/articles from the #MAGA crowd proclaiming the second coming add to the frenzied response.

I think you are assuming an organic reaction to provocation and I feel like I'm seeing something much more organized by every level of opposition. I don't think the ho ho hey hey no fascist USA stuff from right after the election were anything but an organized effort to get the ball rolling that the election was illegitimate.

Retweeting tweets of white/European nationalists and other far, far right people by Trump and retweeting Mussolini quotes doesn't help either.

Agreed, but we can surly agree that those were not intentionally emblematic of fascism or white nationalism right? Just the unfortunate consequence of a 70 year old guy doing his own thing on twitter, most likely. I agree that isn't good but I don't think it explains the hysteria either.

Finally, I think some of it is attempted payback for Trump's and other "birthers" claims and demands during the past eight years. I personally considered all the birther and Muslim screeches as having about the same credibility level, but there are people still....eight years later....arguing those claims are entirely credible or that "there's something to that" even now, and some of them may very well do so in response to this.

I guess so - but I'm not seeing the connection between this and fascism, nazism, white nationalism, racism, etc. I never understood why the birther thing was considered racist, but I never really bought into it either. It seems like a very weird thing to still be pissed off about.

We just seem to be in an era of governance, politics, and pretty much all debate and discussion being done by meme and troll rather than reasoned discussion.

I do agree with this as part of the underlying problem and I blame the old media for this. All the analyst driven 24 hour news cycle shows on every network tend to perpetuate the team politics, identity politics divide. I think this is a big part of what made so many people ripe for buying into the demonization, but again, not sure it's the cause of that.

 

[MegaPoke]

Back out the racism stuff, as if nobody thinks hes racist. Back out his women issues. He's a shitty person. He cheats good people. Small businesses by the thousands, even the lawyers that defended him. His university was a big fraud. He lied plainly and loudly early on about his p.i.'s in Hawaii having a bombshell next Monday. (The anti-Obama crowd didn't care that he lied.) He cheated veterans and vendors. He lies constantly. He bulked his own campaign with exorbitant rental rates and self dealing. He's not setting up a blind trust or functional equivalent. (You would shit the Internet if Obama did that) He won't release his tax returns because there's something incriminating in them. He hasn't outperformed an index fund with his inherited wealth but acts like he's a genius, just like Bloomberg said. And that's not counting his bankrupted liabilities. He'd have been insolvent three times over. He really hurt Atlantic city after making vague, grandiose promises. He eats his steak well done. Never drank alcohol. There's probable cause to believe he's compromised or conflicted with Russia. One of his sons inspired the character of lucius malfoy. He's a narcissist and probably clinically loony. He's an international pariah for bragging about building a wall and making Mexico pay for it, just like Biff woupdate. He lost by 2,800,000 votes. He appointed Scott Pruitt over the EPA and Rick Perry over the DOE. Perry says now it should NOT be closed because he's found out what they do, like regulating nuclear energy plants. So we're in good hands there.

OK, there are legitimate reasons here to question his character - but I'm still not seeing anything remotely like fascism or cause for hysteria here.

Your best arguments are the well-done steak and no alcohol points. These are not endearing qualities to me.

 

[EvilPOKES]

Too.many sensitive pussy snowflakes about...

 

[MR. TANNER BOYLE]

It's all bs and we would be seeing the same crap, just different adjectives, had Hillary been elected.

America has been overtaken by self-centered, entitled a-holes on both sides of the aisle that can't win or lose with dignity, and politics brings these fools out of the woodwork. Seems like it began with the bush/gore circus and I'm guessing will continue to snowball and get worse with each election from now on.

 

[MegaPoke]

I'm going to go ahead and say plainly what I think is driving the over the top stuff. Not the deserved 'he's an asshole' stuff, but the 'this guy is literally hitler' stuff.

I really think that the establishment - and by this, I mean anyone who profits from big government, perpetual inner city poverty and conflict in specific global engagement zones like Syria. Neocons, Liberal democrats, media, intelligence community, and so on. The establishment is fearful that he will be successful in the changes he's promised.

His victory was so off script that it is an existential threat to "the swamp." And fellas, the swamp ain't happy. If he turns out to be successful, it is a game changer that echoes across the globe and costs powerful people a lot in terms of power, money, influence and agenda.

Lots of legit things in this thread that made some people open to the idea, but the idea that was presented to them by the media and the establishment leadership was a coordinated reaction to protect itself and undermine him before he gets started.

Dangerous, irresponsible games in my opinion. But on the other hand, it is highly entertaining.

 

[squeak]

The "live a day as a lion than a 100 years as a sheep" is arguably not an El Duce original and, even if it was, it's an awesome quote.

 

[CBradSmith]

I'm going to go ahead and say plainly what I think is driving the over the top stuff. Not the deserved 'he's an asshole' stuff, but the 'this guy is literally hitler' stuff.

I really think that the establishment - and by this, I mean anyone who profits from big government, perpetual inner city poverty and conflict in specific global engagement zones like Syria. Neocons, Liberal democrats, media, intelligence community, and so on. The establishment is fearful that he will be successful in the changes he's promised.

His victory was so off script that it is an existential threat to "the swamp." And fellas, the swamp ain't happy. If he turns out to be successful, it is a game changer that echoes across the globe and costs powerful people a lot in terms of power, money, influence and agenda.

Lots of legit things in this thread that made some people open to the idea, but the idea that was presented to them by the media and the establishment leadership was a coordinated reaction to protect itself and undermine him before he gets started.

Dangerous, irresponsible games in my opinion. But on the other hand, it is highly entertaining.

This and what @EvilPOKES said. Both. In Spades.

 

[HighStickHarry]

The answer is the left relies on emotion instead of logic. Sys had some great points but look how many things in his ramble are pure speculation. He can't help it. If he was sensible and his party was sensible they would be in power right now but instead they think the kkk infiltrated Ohio Florida and Pennsylvania and they all voted ten times a piece because Russia made them.

 

[MegaPoke]

we would be seeing the same crap, just different adjectives, had Hillary been elected.

I disagree that we would see the same crap - because the crap originates from the top of the establishment, of which Hillary is a lifetime member. I don't recall riots when Obama was elected and doubt we would've had any had Jeb Bush accidentally won.

 

[07pilt]

I agree with you that these things are concerning or could be - but it doesn't understand the fascism accusations. It just explains why people are uneasy and susceptible to buying into the accusations that come from somewhere else. Totally disagree that a recipe for this exists in American politics, and I really think a ton of other context would have to exist for your recipe to make anything other than Teddy Roosevelt style nationalism.

Tell me what do you think fascism means? How will we know if the next president is fascist, besides the funny little mustache? If Trump's disregard for rules does end our constitutional republicanism is he a fascist then or something different?

Did they? I had no idea.

This seems dishonest. Check out stormfront if you dare. Our very own board phrenologists are Trump supporters.

I've never met a member of either bunch. I would submit that they are so statistically irrelevant that their main purpose is to be straw men for the narrative I'm questioning ITT.

They are too statistically irrelevant to make a statement like "if you support Trump you are probably a nazi." But, I feel pretty comfortable with saying "if you are a nazi you probably support Trump." If you honestly want an answer to your question and you aren't just being polemic, figure out why he is well liked by nazis and that will probably tell you why people are hyperbolic about him.

This is actually a pretty good example of the problem. He advocated extreme vetting and a temporary ban on immigrants from specifically high terror countries - not all muslims. And there is a difference you must admit in "immigrants" and "illegal immigrants who have committed crimes."

You are talking about his positions after he walked back his original statements.
His original statement on the Muslim ban (from his campaign's press release):
"Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on,"
On deportations:
In an interview that aired in September 2015 on CBS’ 60 Minutes, Scott Pelley pressed Trump about what he would do with the population.

Pelley: "Eleven, 12 million illegal immigrants --"

Trump: "Or whatever the number is."

Pelley: "Still in the country, what do you do?"

Trump: "If they've done well, they're going out and they're coming back in legally. Because you said it--"

Pelley: "You're rounding them all up?"

Trump: "We're rounding 'em up in a very humane way, in a very nice way. And they're going to be happy because they want to be legalized. And, by the way, I know it doesn't sound nice. But not everything is nice."

Trump has also discussed having a "deportation force" to remove undocumented immigrants from the country, though he’s also said he would let some come back legally.

Trump stuck to the deportation plan for all undocumented immigrants in some of the GOP primary debates. During the CNN/Telemundo debate on Feb. 25, 2016, host Wolf Blitzer asked about his deportation force idea and whether his plan to let "good ones" back in amounted to amnesty. Trump said "we either have a country, or we don’t have a country."

"We have at least 11 million people in this country that came in illegally," he continued. "They will go out. They will come back -- some will come back, the best, through a process. They have to come back legally. They have to come back through a process, and it may not be a very quick process, but I think that's very fair, and very fine. They're going to get in line with other people."

I really don't. I'm sorry. I've never seen anything like this in my life. I think this is an unprecedented level of division and hysteria.

You see no parallels between Trump is a fascist and Obama is a Communist? No parallels between Obama is Muslim Kenyan and the Trump is Russian thing? Obamacare death panels? Luckily the internet was in almost full swing in 2008. You can still find some of the stuff people were saying about his election. I remember in 2012 people on this board thought it was end of America. Hell check out a Dinesh Dsouza doc.

 

[MegaPoke]

Tell me what do you think fascism means? How will we know if the next president is fascist, besides the funny little mustache? If Trump's disregard for rules does end our constitutional republicanism is he a fascist then or something different?

Fascism is an authoritarian form of government. I'll be the first to agree that is what he is if he ends our Constitutional republic, but I'm not seeing indicators of this. Just today, there is a report of cutting the size of government massively. That's not what an authoritarian does.

This seems dishonest. Check out stormfront if you dare.

It's 100% honest. No idea what storefront is either without googling, but I think nazis are exactly as big a problem as Bigfoot. Sorry @JonnyVito

They are too statistically irrelevant to make a statement like "if you support Trump you are probably a nazi." But, I feel pretty comfortable with saying "if you are a nazi you probably support Trump."

I'll let you have that for now, but just as the nazi losers assholes abandoned the "Deplora Ball" organizers and split the "alt right" - they are about 24 hours away from finding out that Trump ain't Der Fuhrer and will abandon him as a cuck. Again, who cares? They aren't real people. They are cartoon characters.

If you honestly want an answer to your question and you aren't just being polemic, figure out why he is well liked by nazis and that will probably tell you why people are hyperbolic about him.

I do want answers. I'm interested in your answers. As I said above, I think they are believing as much of a made up myth about Trump as the idiot nihilists protesting the inauguration. All of them have one thing in common - abject stupidity.

You see no parallels between Trump is a fascist and Obama is a Communist?

There may be some philosophical parallels, but how many republicans boycotted his inauguration? How many riots were there when he was elected? It is not a statistically representative comparison. I think you know that.

 

[JonnyVito]

@MegaPoke its all fun and games until a 12 foot skunk ape bends you over the Webber grill and corn holes you.

 

[CowboyJD]

I think you are assuming an organic reaction to provocation and I feel like I'm seeing something much more organized by every level of opposition. I don't think the ho ho hey hey no fascist USA stuff from right after the election were anything but an organized effort to get the ball rolling that the election was illegitimate.

I'm not assuming anything. I'm giving you my "feeling" the same as you are. Organic, natural reaction to provocation and organized effort aren't actually mutually exclusive. So there is that.

Agreed, but we can surly agree that those were not intentionally emblematic of fascism or white nationalism right? Just the unfortunate consequence of a 70 year old guy doing his own thing on twitter, most likely. I agree that isn't good but I don't think it explains the hysteria either.

I didn't say anything about his intentions in doing so....but there is the notion if you quote a duck often enough, you very well might be a duck sympathizer.....if you post enough crazy cat videos, people might reasonably questioning whether you are a crazy cat lady.


I guess so - but I'm not seeing the connection between this and fascism, nazism, white nationalism, racism, etc. I never understood why the birther thing was considered racist, but I never really bought into it either. It seems like a very weird thing to still be pissed off about.

Whether it was racist or not, it was an organized questioning of the legitimacy of his,Presidency from the get go. I'm calling bs on you REALLY believing that it is "a very weird thing to still be pissed off about" and not understanding the very real possibility...I'd dare say likelihood....that the present legitimacy attacks on Trump (Nazi, fascist, popular vote, all of them) are nothing more than a quid pro quo for the legitimacy attacks by Trump and others (that really didn't end until some point in the election for Trump and never ended for others).


I do agree with this as part of the underlying problem and I blame the old media for this. All the analyst driven 24 hour news cycle shows on every network tend to perpetuate the team politics, identity politics divide. I think this is a big part of what made so many people ripe for buying into the demonization, but again, not sure it's the cause of that.

I blame the old media, to an extend, but I also blame the "new media" that have bought into the notion of a "post fact world" and really haven't shown any really propensity of interest in accuracy,fact checking, objectivity, or lack of clear bias for one of the two "sides".

 

[squeak]

There was noise back in 08 but I feel like the reps said, ok, we had 8 years, lets support this community organizer. 84% approval before he was sworn in!!! I didn't want him but I was pretty excited about it bc there was so much optimism. Plus, the first black president. My kids have only known a black president.

This time around I can't even tell people - friends, co-workers - who I voted for! Are you ****ing kidding me!?!?!? He's president tomorrow and if I tell the wrong person I voted for trump I could be attacked. That's ****ed up.

 

[CowboyJD]

I'm going to go ahead and say plainly what I think is driving the over the top stuff. Not the deserved 'he's an asshole' stuff, but the 'this guy is literally hitler' stuff.

I really think that the establishment - and by this, I mean anyone who profits from big government, perpetual inner city poverty and conflict in specific global engagement zones like Syria. Neocons, Liberal democrats, media, intelligence community, and so on. The establishment is fearful that he will be successful in the changes he's promised.

His victory was so off script that it is an existential threat to "the swamp." And fellas, the swamp ain't happy. If he turns out to be successful, it is a game changer that echoes across the globe and costs powerful people a lot in terms of power, money, influence and agenda.

Lots of legit things in this thread that made some people open to the idea, but the idea that was presented to them by the media and the establishment leadership was a coordinated reaction to protect itself and undermine him before he gets started.

Dangerous, irresponsible games in my opinion. But on the other hand, it is highly entertaining.

I haven't seen many of his appointments to his cabinet that would reflect any sort of an existential threat to "the swamp".

Seems more like business as usual to me.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.