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The Supreme Court has agreed to address a challenge to the Electoral College

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January 18, 2020
The Supreme Court has agreed to address a challenge to the Electoral College
By Andrea Widburg


In 2016, Hillary Clinton won the popular vote. Donald Trump, however, won the Electoral College by focusing on all states, not just the most populous ones. Since then, Democrats have been bent on destroying the Electoral College by any means short of a constitutional amendment. The Supreme Court has now agreed to take up one of Democrats' attacks on the Electoral College.

The Founders created the Electoral College via Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 in the Constitution. Its purpose reflects the fact that America is not a direct democracy but is, instead, a representative democracy. The Electoral College is one of the many layers the Founders put between the government and the possible madness of the mob.

Before the 17th Amendment, senators were originally meant to be elected by state legislatures, putting them at a remove from voters. The president nominates judges, and the Senate votes on them. Only representatives come to D.C. via direct democracy — and the Senate tempers their initiatives (including impeachment), again protecting against voters' passions of the moment.

In addition to blocking mob rule, the Electoral College has another, extremely important, perhaps even more important, purpose: it ensures that presidents cannot campaign only in large population centers, pandering to the preferences of those centers, while ignoring the rest of the United States.

Without the Electoral College, presidential candidates would only campaign in, and shape their policies for, New York (Leftist), California (Leftist), Illinois (Leftist), Texas (generally conservative, but with its population centers rapidly going Left), Florida (a swing state, hewing Left because of northeastern snowbirds), Ohio (another swing state), Washington state (Leftist), Colorado (Leftist), and Massachusetts (Leftist). They would ignore the rest of America.
The Electoral College stands as a bright line between an Executive who must campaign in all of the states, taking note of the needs and values of all Americans, and an Executive who can govern to the left of Bernie Sanders after getting votes from a handful of states. No wonder Democrats hate the Electoral College.

One of the challenges to the Electoral College is the "National Popular Vote Interstate Compact." The 15 states (plus D.C.) that have already agreed to that compact want to ignore their citizens' votes and, instead, assign their electoral votes to the candidate with the most national popular votes.

In the short term, immediately after President Trump won the Electoral College, Democrats began to bully Democrat and NeverTrump electors in states Trump won, demanding that they vote for Hillary to protect America from the insanity of Trump voters. Those who, out of "principle" or fear, switched their votes came to be called "faithless electors." Prof. William Jacobson described the faithless elector movement as "nothing short of an attempt to steal the election."

Thirty-two states have laws mandating that electors cast their votes consistent with the will of the state's voters. Washington and Colorado are among that number and, in cases arising out of faithless electors, it is their laws that the Supreme Court is going to address. William Jacobson, a law professor at Cornell, has weighed in on the issue:

I don't know enough about the legal issues to opine — I have some reading up to do.

But the politics are clear. This may be the single most important case this year. If the Supreme Court rules that electors can be faithless, then there is going to be mayhem in 2020 when Trump wins again. Those who sought to intimidate and bully electors in 2016 were largely viewed as being out of bounds.

But if given a legal green light, there's no telling how much damage could be done to the stability of the nation if the electoral counts is close and bullying a small number of electors to go faithless swings the Electoral College to Democrats.

Perhaps because I'm less informed than Prof. Jacobson, I am willing to opine on the matter: one of the Founders wanted to ensure that voters in each state had a say in electing the president. Any attempt to warp the Electoral College into a vehicle for enacting the national popular vote is antithetical to that purpose.

It's true that the Founders also wanted to protect against mob passions, but one has to ask: in 2016, was the mob the people who politely voted for a candidate who was consistent with American norms before 2008, or was the mob the people who took to the street after the election, threatening to destroy American institutions if their demands were not met? Moreover, would the Founders side with the existential screamers if that meant erasing the voters of most American states?

Ultimately, those Leftists who want to destroy the Electoral College still can, but they must do so via the constitutional amendment process.
 
This is a huge story. Thank God the supremes are going to rule on this before the election - hopefully. The National Popular Vote BS has irked me from it's beginning. Nothing but an attempt by the slimy left to subvert the Electoral College.

The one thing that bothers me is (in my understanding) is that the SCOTUS is going to review the "faithless voter" complaints from two states, but I don't believe it mentions the NPV by name. However if the ruling is that the Electoral College voters are required to cast their votes based on the state's votes, then it reasons that this cancels out the NPV.

Good Lord, leftists are such evil maggots.
 
This will work out well for the moronic socialists.

We have brilliant founding fathers that protected us from the Bernie Sanders idiot liberals.

I offer a one way ticket to Venezuela (as long as you agree to live there for at least 2 years) to any board socialist who wants to live under socialism.
 
El lol, definitely not scared.
latest
 
This will work out well for the moronic socialists.

We have brilliant founding fathers that protected us from the Bernie Sanders idiot liberals.

I offer a one way ticket to Venezuela (as long as you agree to live there for at least 2 years) to any board socialist who wants to live under socialism.
A lot of this debate is hinged on whether or not you believe the popular vote is truly the " rule of the mob".
 
January 18, 2020
The Supreme Court has agreed to address a challenge to the Electoral College
By Andrea Widburg


In 2016, Hillary Clinton won the popular vote. Donald Trump, however, won the Electoral College by focusing on all states, not just the most populous ones. Since then, Democrats have been bent on destroying the Electoral College by any means short of a constitutional amendment. The Supreme Court has now agreed to take up one of Democrats' attacks on the Electoral College.

The Founders created the Electoral College via Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 in the Constitution. Its purpose reflects the fact that America is not a direct democracy but is, instead, a representative democracy. The Electoral College is one of the many layers the Founders put between the government and the possible madness of the mob.

Before the 17th Amendment, senators were originally meant to be elected by state legislatures, putting them at a remove from voters. The president nominates judges, and the Senate votes on them. Only representatives come to D.C. via direct democracy — and the Senate tempers their initiatives (including impeachment), again protecting against voters' passions of the moment.

In addition to blocking mob rule, the Electoral College has another, extremely important, perhaps even more important, purpose: it ensures that presidents cannot campaign only in large population centers, pandering to the preferences of those centers, while ignoring the rest of the United States.

Without the Electoral College, presidential candidates would only campaign in, and shape their policies for, New York (Leftist), California (Leftist), Illinois (Leftist), Texas (generally conservative, but with its population centers rapidly going Left), Florida (a swing state, hewing Left because of northeastern snowbirds), Ohio (another swing state), Washington state (Leftist), Colorado (Leftist), and Massachusetts (Leftist). They would ignore the rest of America.
The Electoral College stands as a bright line between an Executive who must campaign in all of the states, taking note of the needs and values of all Americans, and an Executive who can govern to the left of Bernie Sanders after getting votes from a handful of states. No wonder Democrats hate the Electoral College.

One of the challenges to the Electoral College is the "National Popular Vote Interstate Compact." The 15 states (plus D.C.) that have already agreed to that compact want to ignore their citizens' votes and, instead, assign their electoral votes to the candidate with the most national popular votes.

In the short term, immediately after President Trump won the Electoral College, Democrats began to bully Democrat and NeverTrump electors in states Trump won, demanding that they vote for Hillary to protect America from the insanity of Trump voters. Those who, out of "principle" or fear, switched their votes came to be called "faithless electors." Prof. William Jacobson described the faithless elector movement as "nothing short of an attempt to steal the election."

Thirty-two states have laws mandating that electors cast their votes consistent with the will of the state's voters. Washington and Colorado are among that number and, in cases arising out of faithless electors, it is their laws that the Supreme Court is going to address. William Jacobson, a law professor at Cornell, has weighed in on the issue:

I don't know enough about the legal issues to opine — I have some reading up to do.

But the politics are clear. This may be the single most important case this year. If the Supreme Court rules that electors can be faithless, then there is going to be mayhem in 2020 when Trump wins again. Those who sought to intimidate and bully electors in 2016 were largely viewed as being out of bounds.

But if given a legal green light, there's no telling how much damage could be done to the stability of the nation if the electoral counts is close and bullying a small number of electors to go faithless swings the Electoral College to Democrats.

Perhaps because I'm less informed than Prof. Jacobson, I am willing to opine on the matter: one of the Founders wanted to ensure that voters in each state had a say in electing the president. Any attempt to warp the Electoral College into a vehicle for enacting the national popular vote is antithetical to that purpose.

It's true that the Founders also wanted to protect against mob passions, but one has to ask: in 2016, was the mob the people who politely voted for a candidate who was consistent with American norms before 2008, or was the mob the people who took to the street after the election, threatening to destroy American institutions if their demands were not met? Moreover, would the Founders side with the existential screamers if that meant erasing the voters of most American states?

Ultimately, those Leftists who want to destroy the Electoral College still can, but they must do so via the constitutional amendment process.
So ill informed. Embarrassed for you that you thought this was the take worth sharing.

You might do a little reading from relevant source materials. Publius addressed this directly in Federalist #68. While I think a change in the EC is worth considering, there is no doubt of the founders intent.
 
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This is a huge story. Thank God the supremes are going to rule on this before the election - hopefully. The National Popular Vote BS has irked me from it's beginning. Nothing but an attempt by the slimy left to subvert the Electoral College.

The one thing that bothers me is (in my understanding) is that the SCOTUS is going to review the "faithless voter" complaints from two states, but I don't believe it mentions the NPV by name. However if the ruling is that the Electoral College voters are required to cast their votes based on the state's votes, then it reasons that this cancels out the NPV.

Good Lord, leftists are such evil maggots.
Hamilton - the first evil maggot. You should get a bumper sticker made....
 
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This will work out well for the moronic socialists.

We have brilliant founding fathers that protected us from the Bernie Sanders idiot liberals.

I offer a one way ticket to Venezuela (as long as you agree to live there for at least 2 years) to any board socialist who wants to live under socialism.
Read what your founders actually said:

Talents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity, may alone suffice to elevate a man to the first honors in a single State; but it will require other talents, and a different kind of merit, to establish him in the esteem and confidence of the whole Union, or of so considerable a portion of it as would be necessary to make him a successful candidate for the distinguished office of President of the United States.
Some of you are better than this....
 
To summarize - the Founders designed the Electoral College precisely for Faithless Electors to be a check on the election of an unqualified or corrupt candidate.

That the Trumpets are wringing their hands over this speaks volumes.
 
Read what your founders actually said:

Talents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity, may alone suffice to elevate a man to the first honors in a single State; but it will require other talents, and a different kind of merit, to establish him in the esteem and confidence of the whole Union, or of so considerable a portion of it as would be necessary to make him a successful candidate for the distinguished office of President of the United States.
Some of you are better than this....
What do you think is being said with that passage?
 
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Read what your founders actually said:

Talents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity, may alone suffice to elevate a man to the first honors in a single State; but it will require other talents, and a different kind of merit, to establish him in the esteem and confidence of the whole Union, or of so considerable a portion of it as would be necessary to make him a successful candidate for the distinguished office of President of the United States.
Some of you are better than this....
after three years, they never were.
 
Don't think this is as cut and dried as you think it is. There's a very real chance that the NPV compact would be ruled constitutional.

Of course, that'll hasten the separation of the states when large population states encourage rampant cheating.

I'd like to see Oklahoma certify eleventy billion votes for the Republican candidate just moments prior to the deadline. Since Oklahoma is free to handle their elections as they see fit, there's nothing stopping us from doing just that. Or any other state for that matter. Hence, the hastening of the fall of the federation.
 
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Don't think this is as cut and dried as you think it is. There's a very real chance that the NPV compact would be ruled constitutional.

Of course, that'll hasten the separation of the states when large population states encourage rampant cheating.

I'd like to see Oklahoma certify eleventy billion votes for the Republican candidate just moments prior to the deadline. Since Oklahoma is free to handle their elections as they see fit, there's nothing stopping us from doing just that. Or any other state for that matter. Hence, the hastening of the fall of the federation.
That would be awesome. Hawaii then would determine the popular vote winner to the contentment of all!
 
Don't think this is as cut and dried as you think it is. There's a very real chance that the NPV compact would be ruled constitutional.

Of course, that'll hasten the separation of the states when large population states encourage rampant cheating.

I'd like to see Oklahoma certify eleventy billion votes for the Republican candidate just moments prior to the deadline. Since Oklahoma is free to handle their elections as they see fit, there's nothing stopping us from doing just that. Or any other state for that matter. Hence, the hastening of the fall of the federation.
Can you expound on "cheating"? How does NPV encourage cheating? Would there be political consequences in States adopting NPV should it disenfranchise a significant portion of the citizenry?
 
lol for the usual dodge from Dave.
I get the sense you have something you want so say on this topic Medic. I want to assure you this is a safe space. You might be ridiculed, but you won't be physically harmed no matter what you might have to add. Please proceed...
 
I get the sense you have something you want so say on this topic Medic. I want to assure you this is a safe space. You might be ridiculed, but you won't be physically harmed no matter what you might have to add. Please proceed...
Do you have that much difficulty recognizing a simple question, dave? I usually expect that someone who uses a quote from a historical document as a "bolster" for their argument would have no problems articulating how it supports their argument when asked. I did take into consideration who I was asking the question to, but I honestly had no idea you wouldn't be able to articulate your position outside of what Rachel Maddow and CNN have provided to you. My bad.
 
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We have the electoral college in part for low pop states. There is no arguing that.
 
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Do you have that much difficulty recognizing a simple question, dave? I usually expect that someone who uses a quote from a historical document as a "bolster" for their argument would have no problems articulating how it supports their argument when asked. I did take into consideration who I was asking the question to, but I honestly had no idea you wouldn't be able to articulate your position outside of what Rachel Maddow and CNN have provided to you. My bad.
Your bad is presuming I want to play gotcha. The quote provided implies the duty of electors. That is so simple it should not require explanation but alas apparently not. 68 includes plenty of the same. Enjoy.
 
We have the electoral college in part for low pop states. There is no arguing that.
That was part of the appeal and hence why it was broadly supported by the those who advocated for strong states rights.

The EC was very clearly intended to be a safety valve which is only achievable via Faithless Electors which so many in this thread oppose. Many of the same who call themselves strict Originalists.
 
Your bad is presuming I want to play gotcha. The quote provided implies the duty of electors. That is so simple it should not require explanation but alas apparently not. 68 includes plenty of the same. Enjoy.
dave, that got an actual laugh out loud from me.
 
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That was part of the appeal and hence why it was broadly supported by the those who advocated for strong states rights.

The EC was very clearly intended to be a safety valve which is only achievable via Faithless Electors which so many in this thread oppose. Many of the same who call themselves strict Originalists.
Lol. Who elects the electors, dave?
 
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That was part of the appeal and hence why it was broadly supported by the those who advocated for strong states rights.

The EC was very clearly intended to be a safety valve which is only achievable via Faithless Electors which so many in this thread oppose. Many of the same who call themselves strict Originalists.
If I happens and changes an election, it will be war.
 
If it passes muster in SCOTUS and becomes a “popular vote,” type deal the cheating and skullduggery will be rampant. Would be time to say hello to the Balkanization of the US. Can’t think there are many states that want to be run by the voters of CA, NY, MA, IL, OR, VT, NH, MI and WA, since they have manifestly proved they mostly can’t keep their own states and cities solvent.

I said last summer that the potential for this happening is why CA was looking into voter laws to allow 16 year olds to vote (may have already passed by now who knows).
 
Read what your founders actually said:

Talents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity, may alone suffice to elevate a man to the first honors in a single State; but it will require other talents, and a different kind of merit, to establish him in the esteem and confidence of the whole Union, or of so considerable a portion of it as would be necessary to make him a successful candidate for the distinguished office of President of the United States.
Some of you are better than this....
This has nothing to do with faithless electoral college votes. It is about not allowing a select group to pick the President and that a majority of states would insure to make a wiser decision.

Totally antithetical to the point you are trying to make.
 
This has nothing to do with faithless electoral college votes. It is about not allowing a select group to pick the President and that a majority of states would insure to make a wiser decision.

Totally antithetical to the point you are trying to make.

He's totally oblivious to what's going on. His comment above, "So ill informed. Embarrassed for you that you thought this was the take worth sharing" proves that.
 
A lot of this debate is hinged on whether or not you believe the popular vote is truly the " rule of the mob".

Looking at a map of counties won across the nation by Trump the "rule of the mob" would be the popular vote. California, New York and the Northeastern states should not determine who leads our country. If the rest of the states essentially have no say, then why should they stay part of the Union?
 
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