Apparently the poll leader in the upcoming Mexican election is an extreme leftist. If he wins I predict an absolute unstoppable tsunami of illegal immigrants pouring across our borders in a couple of years. Brace yourselves, it’s gonna be a bumpy ride. It may be enough for Trump to get his wall. It will be ironic if Mexicans start fleeing into Guatemala instead of the other way around.
Mexican Election
- Thread starter Ponca Dan
- Start date
What are you thinking will be the impact on on the U.S.? Southern states especially.
But what does an open borders advocate believe will happen?
@Ponca Dan am I summarizing your position accurately?
@syskatine what is your border position?
I don’t know. Will this guy turn Mexico into the next Venezuela? Who could blame Mexican citizens from trying to get away from a situation like that? What will be our reaction?
Open borders is a risk you're willing to run?
What do you estimate are tangible things you are gambling with?
It may become largest moral dilemma this country has ever faced. It will not be people coming here looking for improved circumstances over the poverty they have endured. It will be people desperately fleeing from famine and a tyrannical government that will not care how many of them die as long as it can remain in power.
What will we do? What should we do? Should we turn our backs on them, build a wall in our hearts to match a physical wall on the border? Renounce our Christian heritage, the fundamental “American value” so many on the right are concerned the left is stripping away?
Do we silently watch as our neighbors fall deeper and deeper into servitude to their socialist government?
Do we allow them in under some sort of temporary special exemption? Then what would we do with them? If we created a path to citizenship for them would the left still be certain they would vote for the same policies that drove them here in the first place? Would young leftists like pilt and 2cents finally understand the horror of the ideology they advocate?
Nothing but questions.
send the 1st armoured thru to mexico city
put the country under martial law
execute cartels stamp out corruption
annex baja and the yucatán for our efforts
then come home
We build a wall that not even sticker heads can get through and then drop American history books on them. The rest is up to them.
Yes, it should be up to them. How should we react if a socialist Mexican dictator invites Russia or China (or both) to create military bases on or near our border, in exchange for economic help?
Trade and travel embargo. I hope it’s financially feasible for Russians and Chinese that like being waited on hand and foot by Mexicans at Cabo del Yucatán or wherever Americans leave fist fulls if cash.
Fyi it is my understanding that he hates the U.S. and had already called for Mexican citizens to rush the border.
That’s a not well thought out knee jerk reaction. In the first place there are around 300 million Soviet citizens and 1.3 billion Chinese. I would think Mexico would be an attractive place for them to visit. Secondly, and most importantly I believe a socialist dictator in Mexico would willingly trade some of the country’s tourism business for foreign economic aid and a secure defense from an American invasion.
Kind of ironic that he would encourage his own citizens to go to a place he hates. Why do you suppose he wants his people to do that? Do you think it will encourage more to come than already do? What sense would it make for his supporters to leave the country just as they attain power?
Good point. However what are the odds that Putin or the Chinese guy (I forgot his name) will feel honor bound by the Monroe Doctrine? They and Mexico can just point to Trump’s reneging on NAFTA and say turn about is fair play.
There is no such thing as a Soviet citizen and there are not close to 300 million Russians.
Good I hope they have a blast there. Mexico will really enjoy trading with them instead of us the most powerful buying force the world has ever known right next door to them. I would wish them the best.
We hold all the cards. We are the best, most powerful and biggest purchaser of goods in the history of man on this planet. It’s a privalage to trade with us.
You make an excellent argument. I only disagree with one point, albeit a significant one. We do not hold all the cards. We hold more than anyone else, but we don’t hold them all. I know I am repeating myself, but you are ignoring a very relevant point. They may need us more than we need them, but that doesn’t alter the fact that we need them. If we attempt to isolate ourselves from the rest of the world (as DJT seems to desire) we will fall like a house of cards and probably take the rest of the world with us.
We are getting off the subject of the OP. How should America respond when a socialist Mexico falls apart like every other socialist country in history? Do we sit back and watch them literally starve to death, desiccated bodies rotting in the streets? Will we be smug and content ourselves with the belief they brought it on themselves? Will we open our borders and get washed away by the flood? I don’t know the answer. Do you? Does anyone?
Colonize and tax the crap out of Mexico for the trouble.
That would give more weight to the Trump is Hitler talk.
That would give more weight to the Trump is Hitler talk.
The freedom to lose is what this country prides itself on. Yes we watch them pay for their own mistakes. We can drop food in them and put an extra lock on the door on the wall.
My knee jerk reaction is protect our border no question.
Then see if the liberal states are as generous as the red states in dealing with whatever apocalyptic result your seem to be predicting.
I may have missed the 1991 talk. The Soviet union doesn't exist anymore.
Maybe Mexico breaks into smaller rojo y azul nations.
He has and there is a very simple reason. Without repatriatiated greenbacks that whole flea infested shit hole country is in complete anarchy. More illegal mexicans more money therefore less burden on the government to provide jack crap for the peasants.
If they made Mexican flag doormats I’d buy a ton! The country is corrupt to the stinking core and honestly I see the whole region as Africa light. I refuse to vacation there and won’t even buy Mexican produce when shopping. If ever there was a place that needed a giant flamethrower taken to it, mexico is the place.
This guy is going to win, the question is how long will he live? Hard to fathom, but in this election cycle there have been 132 (so far) Mexican politicians/aspiring politicians assassinated.
This will be the USA’s EU moment. I see it boiling down to which states will take what. Places like California have already rolled out the unlimited, come screw us, welcome mat so really don’t see much changing there. But other states, we shall see. Maybe this will be the impetus for balkanizing the US.
I absolutely don’t see this as a moral dilemma though. We owe cowards nothing! Grab a weapon and stand your group you coward rat bastards! Create the country you want for yours and your children’s future. Don’t come suckle at the tit of a country that fought for and attained its own independence. Put up a wall, a giant trench don’t care. The flow should have been stopped long ago.
Yeah, my bad. Russia has a population of what, 150 million? But it still remains as the center of the sphere of influence over most of the old Soviet Union. My numbers may be a little distorted but the point remains valid. If the US boycotts tourism in Mexico tourists from other places will be encouraged to come instead. Will there be a drop in tourism and its money? Sure, but possibly not devastatingly so, and it’s unlikely a socialist dictator will care.
I’m looking at the worst case scenario and wondering how the US should react. I do think a Marxist/socialist government will decimate the country, possibly like Venezuela. Only this time it will be a country on our border. I’m not claiming Mexico will invite our supposed military enemies into its country. I’m just wondering what are our options if something like that happens. I assume some smart government bureaucracy (Ouch! It pains me to say that!) is making plans for just such a situation. I thought it would make for an interesting discussion .
If this is direction Mexico chooses to go, why wouldn't we put them under the same sanctions and no trade agreement we had with 'nearby' Cuba for the past 70 years. Unfortunately in this case, as Obama once said, elections have consequences. But us supporting the continuation of these regimes by absorbing their poor will create a never ending cycle of poor flooding into our country while extending the viability of the regimes that are creating these conditions in the first place.
The big winner in this scenario is likely China who is quite willing, though increasingly less able, to buy their way into new markets. Irritating DJT would be windfall.
China has already committed $250 bln USD in investments for Latin America, largely in infrastructure project funding. The Chinese National Oil Company is already sitting on several oil drilling blocks with indications that stake will increase in the next auction.
Good conversation if people are willing to look at it...
Will be interested to see how far they would go with this. I think some American's would be willing to do the same type of investments, however, we've seen the downside. We've seen Venezuela convert all the private oil companies into nationalized ones. If China is willing to take those risks and be on the hook to bail out these countries then more power to them. I bet they don't accept any Latin American 'refugees' though. I bet the UN doesn't criticize them for not doing so either.
Offer the people of Mexico for Mexico to become the 51st state and citizenship in 25 years. Not sure which side of the border would have more turmoil.
Putting them under the same sanctions as Cuba would be the first thing most of us would think of. However our current trade with Mexico overwhelmes any trade we ever had with Cuba. We pressured Cuba for decades and what did it get? What did we get? Desperate people braving the ocean to get away. The resulting tide of Mexicans fleeing to the US if we were to stop trading with them would be catastrophic for both sides. What would we do, gun down anyone that tries to escape? Is that what we supported when East Germans gambled their lives to get over the Berlin Wall?
Dan, you're gonna have to go out on a limb with your own opinion, or this thread sets up as you saying "so many questions" then taking pot shots at others. No skin in the game and therefore no real value to some of us.
You’re right, Brad. The problem is I have no idea what we should do.
On the one hand I don’t know how we could handle tens of millions of people invading our borders all at once. So should we keep them out? They climbed into the pot when they elected this guy, so they’ll just have to stew in their own juices? That may be emotionally satisfying to some people.
On the other hand are we not supposed to help one another? Isn’t that the moral thing to do? I don’t think I could stand the pictures and videos of starving Mexican children. You already saw how I reacted to that little two year old girl. My dismay if we refused to intervene would be awful.
But there is no way we can afford to take them in. I don’t know what we should do. Declare the Monroe Doctrine and invade? I brought this up for discussion because I am curious what others think, not because I had a cure. I probably am shooting down the suggestions because I see flaws in all of them. I would propose a solution if I had one.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/07/01/border-crisis-moms-perspective.html
From the above article.
“Yes, I care about illegal immigrant children. But, not at the exclusion of my own children. Facts do matter. According to Maryann Mendoza, founder of Advocates for Victims of Illegal Alien Crime, who lost her son to an illegal who hit him in a head-on collision, roughly 4,300 American citizens are killed by illegal immigrants every year. This matters to me. And newly released data from the Department of Homeland Security shows that 13 percent of DACA recipients have previous arrests, while roughly 55 percent of all approved DACA requestors had more than one arrest.”
Think of the toll with many more millions stampeding over the border.
From the above article.
“Yes, I care about illegal immigrant children. But, not at the exclusion of my own children. Facts do matter. According to Maryann Mendoza, founder of Advocates for Victims of Illegal Alien Crime, who lost her son to an illegal who hit him in a head-on collision, roughly 4,300 American citizens are killed by illegal immigrants every year. This matters to me. And newly released data from the Department of Homeland Security shows that 13 percent of DACA recipients have previous arrests, while roughly 55 percent of all approved DACA requestors had more than one arrest.”
Think of the toll with many more millions stampeding over the border.
