Lack Of Early Season Matches

[Okie_Pat]

It’s been 3 or 4 years now since our starters wrestled in an early season tournament in November. The last one was the OCU open I believe. After watching the Minn dual it just looked like several guys came out flat and not ready. The starters have only had 3 matches up to that point of which were mostly with below par competition. I would really like to see our main guys get in more live mat time earlier on. Just not sure why we wrestle so little the first couple of months of the season maybe besides trying to avoid injuries.

 

[turfpoke]

It’s been 3 or 4 years now since our starters wrestled in an early season tournament in November. The last one was the OCU open I believe. After watching the Minn dual it just looked like several guys came out flat and not ready. The starters have only had 3 matches up to that point of which were mostly with below par competition. I would really like to see our main guys get in more live mat time earlier on. Just not sure why we wrestle so little the first couple of months of the season maybe besides trying to avoid injuries.

If trying to avoid injuries is the reason I say go back to wrestling more matches.

 

[Okie_Pat]

I have no clue why. Just throwing possible reasons out there. Seems like the pros outweigh any cons.

 

[ionel]

I have no clue why. Just throwing possible reasons out there. Seems like the pros outweigh any cons.

We've seen way too many injuries the last few years, the cons outweigh the pros, many of the top programs are reducing total matches and first semester match/tournaments for starters/top guys, its all about peaking in March.

 

[vhsalum]

I have no clue why. Just throwing possible reasons out there. Seems like the pros outweigh any cons.

Have you seen your back half schedule???? There's no need for that, let alone an additional early season tournament. John refuses to get with the times.

 

[Pokes1988]

We've seen way too many injuries the last few years, the cons outweigh the pros, many of the top programs are reducing total matches and first semester match/tournaments for starters/top guys, its all about peaking in March.

I can understand protecting some of your assets....Like Sheets/Fix/Plott....But to me, the rest would probably benefit from a busy schedule. Would love to see the young guys get some good runs...Voinovich, Young, Doucet, etc. could all benefit greatly...

Basically, any Freshmen and Sophomores, starters or not should get some extended action imo.

 

[Wrassler17]

I can understand protecting some of your assets....Like Sheets/Fix/Plott....But to me, the rest would probably benefit from a busy schedule. Would love to see the young guys get some good runs...Voinovich, Young, Doucet, etc. could all benefit greatly...

Basically, any Freshmen and Sophomores, starters or not should get some extended action imo.

Yeah I agree, I think you need to decide what's best for each guy. Maybe the underclassmen need matches. Or maybe guys at new weights need matches. Whatever works for each individual. No one peaks better than PSU and they just sent multiple starters to an Invite in November.

Also, I believe the OCU Open was last held in November in 2019, so pre Covid. And this year the Viking Open and Lindenwood didn't work out date wise.

 

[ionel]

I can understand protecting some of your assets....Like Sheets/Fix/Plott....But to me, the rest would probably benefit from a busy schedule. Would love to see the young guys get some good runs...Voinovich, Young, Doucet, etc. could all benefit greatly...

Basically, any Freshmen and Sophomores, starters or not should get some extended action imo.

Didn't they send Haas to an early tournament to get matches? Could've maybe used Haas in the lineup against Minny.

 

[Okie_Pat]

That was kind of my thinking behind the post. I know we have added a couple of more duals to the schedule since Covid. I'm sure that was to make up for it. I just think the young guys like Carter Young and Voinovich would of benefitted. Along with maybe Wittlake and Surber getting in more matches at their new weights. You could also put Doucet in that conversation. I feel like Wittlake could of used a couple of extra early matches to test out his knee against lesser opponents. As long as you are wrestling there is always the risk of injury.

 

[DPJ]

Didn't they send Haas to an early tournament to get matches? Could've maybe used Haas in the lineup against Minny.

I think he got injured in that tournament, haven't heard how he's doing since.

 

[vhsalum]

That was kind of my thinking behind the post. I know we have added a couple of more duals to the schedule since Covid. I'm sure that was to make up for it. I just think the young guys like Carter Young and Voinovich would of benefitted. Along with maybe Wittlake and Surber getting in more matches at their new weights. You could also put Doucet in that conversation. I feel like Wittlake could of used a couple of extra early matches to test out his knee against lesser opponents. As long as you are wrestling there is always the risk of injury.

I think you're missing the part where guys have to make weight. That's not easy for 90% of college wrestlers and wears on the body. Wittlake has PLENTY of matches under his belt. He's also in a great room.

Even "younger" guys don't need matches in the way you're thinking of. The recruits John is bringing in have 3x to 4x the amount of matches guys in the 90s did. And high level ones at that.

Not being injured in March is the absolute most important thing for you guys. Period. Your starters need less matches, not more.

 

[ionel]

I think he got injured in that tournament, haven't heard how he's doing since.

hmm

 

[vhsalum]

hmm

lol

 

[Wrassler17]

Ok, here goes...

- PSU sent 6 starters to the Black Knight Invite in November, a D1 tourney. And Cael has proven to be the best at preparing for March.
- The OCU Open is largely non D1. You make weight once, blow out your lungs, and get your hands on someone other than a teammate. A lot of positives early in the season.
- John has said multiple x that injuries happen when you relax, meaning they are more likely to occur during practice than a live match.
- Haas got injured at Lindenwood because he loves the lat throw. In 2019 Kyle won the Cadet trials in both freestyle & greco, a rare feat. He was hitting lat throws on everyone in both styles. But now everyone knows it's coming. In 2020 he lost to the guy ranked #117 PFP (Haas was #6 PFP) because the guy countered it. At Lindenwood, the Mizzou wrestler knew it was coming (Brian Smith was cornering) and came right down on Kyle's shoulder. He needs to stick that move on the shelf and forget about it for a while.

 

[MiccoMacey]

According to wrestlestat, there are at least 11 wrestlers with 14 or more matches. I’ll bet that’s way higher if that list showed everybody. Or at least statistically it gets almost exponentially bigger as you add matches.

 

[Okie_Pat]

If some of our starters were to wrestle in a early season tournament and had around 3 matches. That would put the total matches wrestled before January and Southern Scuffle at 8 total matches total with 3 additional on top of our 5 regularly scheduled duals.

Looking at the top 33 ranked guys on intermat's rankings and their current records, below is the total number of the 33 ranked guys at each weight who have had at least 8 matches or more currently to date. We do wrestle in the Southern Scuffle and that's anywhere around 3-6 matches per wrestler. And although there are a lot of guys at each weight with 8 or more matches its important to note that not all those guys will wrestle another tournament until their conference championships and likely don't have as many scheduled duals as OSU after the new year.

# of top 33 ranked wrestlers with 8 or more matches
125) 18
133) 13
141) 16
149) 19
157) 14
165) 17
174) 13
184) 19
197) 13
285) 17

We are currently at 4 total matches so just comparing our mat time to other competitive programs and quality wrestlers. This is just my humble opinion but I don't think sending a select number of our starters to a early season tournament would be putting them in a situation to get hurt or burnt out by nationals. If you are smart about who you are sending I see more guys benefiting from it than not.

 

[Wrassler17]

Using this thread because it's about Open tournaments...

6 guys registered for the Bob Smith Open today:
Bloemhof, Cutter Sheets, Mastro (157), McLane, Dopps & Simpson

Edit: streaming on Flo

 

[Harleycowboy]

Using this thread because it's about Open tournaments...

6 guys registered for the Bob Smith Open today:
Bloemhof, Cutter Sheets, Mastro (157), McLane, Dopps & Simpson

Edit: streaming on Flo

Thru the quarterfinals Mastro has 3 1st period pins, quite the cradler. Cutter has 3 tech falls. Both are in the semi's but not great competition so far.

 

[Wrassler17]

Thru the quarterfinals Mastro has 3 1st period pins, quite the cradler. Cutter has 3 tech falls. Both are in the semi's but not great competition so far.

Harley, check out Hayden Simpson's matches. I'd never seen him wrestle before. He's bigger than I figured - weighed in at 276. So far I've seen an ankle pick, a head inside single, a body lock, a cradle for a pin, and a cartwheel on bottom. Fun to watch.

 

[Harleycowboy]

Harley, check out Hayden Simpson's matches. I'd never seen him wrestle before. He's bigger than I figured - weighed in at 276. So far I've seen an ankle pick, a head inside single, a body lock, a cradle for a pin, and a cartwheel on bottom. Fun to watch.

Wrassler, I will check on the HWT. Thanks.

 

[Harleycowboy]

Wrassler, I will check on the HWT. Thanks.

Travis got a first period pin in the semi's cradle. Cutter is rough on division 2 wrestlers with his legs in twisting from the legs, with arms twisting the neck and head until the back is exposed. Also a nice duck. With Simpson I saw the nice ankle pick, body lock and uses the cradle a lot especially for a HWT( got the pin in the quarters. He is big and strong and shows some skills. I have not seen his semifinals match yet but it is Bedlam time. I hope we wrestle today.

 

[topc22blue]

Harley, check out Hayden Simpson's matches. I'd never seen him wrestle before. He's bigger than I figured - weighed in at 276. So far I've seen an ankle pick, a head inside single, a body lock, a cradle for a pin, and a cartwheel on bottom. Fun to watch.

Like Doucet?

 

[Wrassler17]

Like Doucet?

Like twins, lol.

In the final things got chippy, a lot of hard clubs. He was losing 6-0 with over 4 minutes of riding time against him. In the last 30 seconds the other guy went for a turn. Hayden rolled thru and pinned him with a head lock with 15 seconds left. His first college title.

 

[Harleycowboy]

Travis got a first period pin in the semi's cradle. Cutter is rough on division 2 wrestlers with his legs in twisting from the legs, with arms twisting the neck and head until the back is exposed. Also a nice duck. With Simpson I saw the nice ankle pick, body lock and uses the cradle a lot especially for a HWT( got the pin in the quarters. He is big and strong and shows some skills. I have not seen his semifinals match yet but it is Bedlam time. I hope we wrestle today.

Well only a few wrestled today.. Travis Mastro won 8 to 2 in the finals against a Fort Hays State opponent that was a 2 time Kansas State Champion, Cutter won by major in the finals. As you stated Wrassler Simpson won by pin when his opponent tried to tilt Simpson a big opponent and ended up with Simpson on top and it didn't fare well for him.