Clean Power Plan

[Marshal Jim Duncan]

The EPA estimates if the CPP is FULLY enacted, it will avert 0.018 degrees of warming; i.e. < 2/100 of a degree, by the year 2100.

The EPA and folks like the Environmental Defense Fund have commented about all the great thigns going on in the clean energy field and all the expansion that occurred in clean energy production/utilization.

Given these facts, why do we need the CPP?

 

[imprimis]

It's all about control.

 

[windriverrange]

Heard a guy the other day say...Environmentalists of today are green on the outside but still red on the inside, like a watermelon. Interesting take.

 

[Marshal Jim Duncan]

Heard a guy the other day say...Environmentalists of today are green on the outside but still red on the inside, like a watermelon. Interesting take.

Certainly not all of them, but there is a lot of overlap.

 

[imprimis]

Heard a guy the other day say...Environmentalists of today are green on the outside but still red on the inside, like a watermelon. Interesting take.

One of the companies I own is a pest control company. Many years ago one of the environmental zealots who worked to shut down the cement plants in Midlothian, TX, called me and asked me to give her a bid on killing the termites in her garage. I told her what my company would charge and she said that she would get her husband to pour chlordane on them instead. The problem here was chlordane was banned from use in 1988, but, Ms. Environmentalist didn't care since the termites were eating her house.

 

[davidallen]

The EPA estimates if the CPP is FULLY enacted, it will avert 0.018 degrees of warming; i.e. < 2/100 of a degree, by the year 2100.

The EPA and folks like the Environmental Defense Fund have commented about all the great thigns going on in the clean energy field and all the expansion that occurred in clean energy production/utilization.

Given these facts, why do we need the CPP?

Can you share the source on this? Everything I have been reading points to big estimates from EPA on positive impact including:


BENEFITS OF IMPLEMENTING THE CLEAN POWER PLAN
 The transition to clean energy is happening faster than anticipated. This means carbon and air pollution are already decreasing, improving public health each and every year.
 The Clean Power Plan accelerates this momentum, putting us on pace to cut this dangerous pollution to historically low levels in the future.
 When the Clean Power Plan is fully in place in 2030, carbon pollution from the power sector will be 32 percent below 2005 levels, securing progress and making sure it continues.
 The transition to cleaner sources of energy will better protect Americans from other harmful air pollution, too. By 2030, emissions of sulfur dioxide from power plants will be 90 percent lower compared to 2005 levels, and emissions of nitrogen oxides will be 72 percent lower. Because these pollutants can create dangerous soot and smog, the historically low
2
levels mean we will avoid thousands of premature deaths and have thousands fewer asthma attacks and hospitalizations in 2030 and every year beyond.
 Within this larger context, the Clean Power Plan itself is projected to contribute significant pollution reductions, resulting in important benefits, including:
o Climate benefits of $20 billion
o Health benefits of $14-$34 billion o Net benefits of $26-$45 billion
 Because carbon pollution comes packaged with other dangerous air pollutants, the Clean Power Plan will also protect public health, avoiding each year:
o 3,600 premature deaths
o 1,700 heart attacks
o 90,000 asthma attacks
o 300,000 missed work days and school days

 

[Marshal Jim Duncan]

I didn't mention any impacts stated by the EPA other than temperature decrease.

But, taking your first bullet point above --


"The transition to clean energy is happening faster than anticipated. This means carbon and air pollution are already decreasing, improving public health each and every year."

Why do we need a plan that is going to seriously increase energy costs in the short term, having a massive impact on the poor? Why not let the transition to clean energy occur organically since it will have basically nil impact on warming?

 

[davidallen]

Very interested in this statement:

The EPA estimates if the CPP is FULLY enacted, it will avert 0.018 degrees of warming; i.e. < 2/100 of a degree, by the year 2100.

The 2/100 of a degree is that from current projections for 2100 or current temps? The math just doesn't look right...

Do you have a source on that - would like to read more.

 

[wyomingosualum]

Within this larger context, the Clean Power Plan itself is projected to contribute significant pollution reductions, resulting in important benefits, including:
o Climate benefits of $20 billion

What in the world is that and how is the dollar value calculated?

 

[07pilt]

Very interested in this statement:

The 2/100 of a degree is that from current projections for 2100 or current temps? The math just doesn't look right...

Do you have a source on that - would like to read more.

The CATO institute did the analysis. Turns out the electric sector in the US is a small contributor to global CO2 according to projections.

I'm curious what impact this plan will have on electricity prices. Any one have anything on that?

 

[davidallen]

Looked at the Cato study - it was using modeling that was never intended to go out 85 years. Was hoping that wasn't the "source" of the EPA estimates... Have a keen interest in this area.