Businessmen Explain Why Trump’s Tariffs Are Bad Economics
- Thread starter Ponca Dan
- Start date
The Trump tarrifs have ruined the economy, we are screwed....wait, what? The economy is the best in decades?
Uh never mind.
Uh never mind.
Ponca dans grave stone will read as follows:
Here lies Ponca Dan, crushed to death by falling sky.
Here lies Ponca Dan, crushed to death by falling sky.
The Trump 25% tariffs on 1300 Chinese products have not been put into effect yet. The businessmen were there pleading with him not to do it. No one here is arguing it will crush the economy. But it will slow It noticeably, and will cost several tens of thousands of jobs. I don’t want to see that happen. Do you?
Dan,
I understand your tariff position. I even agree that in the long run, tariff's are bad. But if they can be used in short increments to improve our trade positions for the future, you have to admit that they can have benefits. This is what I see our president doing. Already, you've seen China come to the table for discussions. You've seen the EU come to the table to improve the balance of trade between us and them. NAFTA partners came to the table.
Its like being at the doctor and you're complaining about the pain of the shot when the medicine provided will (in time) make you better.
I understand your tariff position. I even agree that in the long run, tariff's are bad. But if they can be used in short increments to improve our trade positions for the future, you have to admit that they can have benefits. This is what I see our president doing. Already, you've seen China come to the table for discussions. You've seen the EU come to the table to improve the balance of trade between us and them. NAFTA partners came to the table.
Its like being at the doctor and you're complaining about the pain of the shot when the medicine provided will (in time) make you better.
I understand what you are saying, but I disagree. Your analogy would be better stated as the doctor misdiagnosing the ailment and giving you the wrong shot. An even better analogy would be that Trump thinks he is playing chess and his constituents are nothing more than pawns to be sacrificed as he sees fit. Government interference in the marketplace is never a good thing, long term or short term. The market is self regulating and does not need Trump or anyone else messing around with it. Government interference always has negative unforeseen consequences. These tariffs are not an exception. They will have negative ramifications on the economy.
We'll agree to disagree then. Under ideal conditions you are correct. But as long as other governments meddle in the trade affairs to protect their citizens, I'll accept that ours does the same.
That's fine, we'll disagree. But please explain to me how other governments meddle in trade affairs to protect their citizens. Take China as an example. The Chinese government taxes its citizens in order to subsidize many of its companies, who then sell their products to Americans at lower prices. How have the Chinese citizens been protected?
China has import tariffs on nearly every thing they import. In addition, they charge VAT taxes on many of the higher quality (such as most American goods) sold. Finally, some of our biggest ticket items such as cars (one of are largest export items) are taxed by the local communities at (literally) 100% rates making them nearly impossible to be competitive against cheaper, local competitors. In fact, their whole tax structure is so significant that it makes it challenging to sell any 'higher' priced items. Yet if we counter with a single tariff of our own, the whole free market community is shouting from the rooftops that we are going to significantly hurt our economy.
That's because we would be hurting our own economy! Do you not see that they are hurting their own people by making American products more expensive than necessary? They have reduced the options for their consumers. They have eliminated competition, which is harmful to their people in multiple ways. The fact that they are harming their own people is not justification for our government to harm us.
How many American jobs are worth a 1 cent price increase (the estimated cost increase of aluminum and tin cans due to the Steel/Aluminum tariff)? Particularly, when you can't get counter jobs back by selling goods to China due to their tariff and tax rules?
I refer you to the link I posted at the top of this thread, which, apparently, you have not read. First, the 1 cent per can increase has been debunked (but hell if I remember where I've seen it). Second, the tariffs threaten far more jobs than they save (read the link). China is not hurting the US. China is hurting their own people. China is taxing their own people so Americans can buy their goods cheaper than market prices would call for. And as a double whammy China is eliminating consumer options to their own people, forcing them to pay prices higher than the market would dictate. Trump's tariffs will do the same thing to us. Tariffs are bad economics. I guess they are good politics though, because so many of our own people are clamoring for our government to double whammy us like China does to its citizens.
A timely letter from Don Boudreaux:
http://cafehayek.com/2018/05/zero-tolerance-economics-ignorance-trade.html
I agree with aix_xpert. If you are dealing with a level playing field tariffs are bad. When every large trading partner in the world is playing games and screwing you you have to gain leverage on them to stop.
China and the rest of the world need the USA more than the USA needs them it's time we stopped bending over and force these countries for more fair trade.
China and the rest of the world need the USA more than the USA needs them it's time we stopped bending over and force these countries for more fair trade.
