Pyles and the guys talked about it heavily on FRL this week but it got me thinking…. If one group of guys could open multiple academies across the state of Wisconsin and completely change the landscape of wrestling in a state…. Then who could be that guy to do something like that in OK? Do we have an Oklahoma guy with that kind of high end potential as a coach?
AWA’s effect on Wisconsin wrestling
- Thread starter AtownPoke
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It doesn't take a big name guy either. Just someone that is great with the kids, has a sound system to develop, and can manage all it takes to getting his kids to one day get to the big tourneys and produce. I live in Johnstown where McCort HS is and where Bassett is from. This area was never really a hot bed for talent like many other areas of PA but I attribute the success we are seeing now to Jody Strittmatter and his Young Guns club. Aside from our local boys, kids moved into this area from out of state just to be part of his club and to have training partners he helped to produce.
We have had an explosion of good academies imo and they’ll really help but every state taking itself seriously has those. Askren’s group is different. They sped up the process and took it to an elite level very very fast
There was exactly two guys I did not want to see coaching at Iowa. Taylor and Askren. I'm almost certain their training and development methods are both similar to Cael.
Askren had a lot of things going in his favor.
the biggest thing is how much money he had/has. He can afford to purchase buildings and pay coaches. So to get that expansion, he ponied up his own dollars.
Then couple that with the fact that Wisconsin is not a saturated market. Even right down to the schools. Schools like Stillwater, Edmond N., Tuttle - don't exist like that in Wisconsin. So he created a monopoly REALLY quick.
the biggest thing is how much money he had/has. He can afford to purchase buildings and pay coaches. So to get that expansion, he ponied up his own dollars.
Then couple that with the fact that Wisconsin is not a saturated market. Even right down to the schools. Schools like Stillwater, Edmond N., Tuttle - don't exist like that in Wisconsin. So he created a monopoly REALLY quick.
Oklahoma has the names and the talent to have multiple high level clubs that trickle into one main club for competitions....or not.
Bixby has EG, Joseph, Roller and a few others coaching. That is one club possibility that would do well. Facilities, names and money.
Edmond area, similar deal.
We need an Altus hub and a south/central/eastish club.
So we could have 3-5 hubs as a place were elite kids train majority of the time. Then when it's time for the big tourneys, the best go forward and the rest Wrestle on the 2team or unattached.
My buddies and I have been talking about doing something down here (SC OK) for a few years. I am pretty sure we have alot of the stuff donated (land, electric, HVAC, travel, dirtworks) and we'll only have to purchase a large building. This area down here is begging for high-level training and it's not going to happen until we all get on the same page.
Plainview has been trying.
Altus is trying too. There are some wheels starting to turn but it’s slow.
We have Keilan Torres coaching the high school. Having a ncaa qualifier that was the 18th ranked recruit in the country helps but he hasn’t got the traction I had hoped yet
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Oklahoma already performs really well when you look at things on a per student or wrestler basis.
But... I don't think you can really look at what Askren is doing specifically, and try to copy something like that on a large scale in Oklahoma.
Askren is pretty progressive in his coaching philosophy, basically no competition until 10+ and only limited for the next few years after that. He emphasizes skill and mat awareness and doesn't really focus as much on toughness and the old school grit and grind mindset. There isn't much focus on competitive results up through middle school, with the intent of building a solid base so that that athletes are rapidly ascending through their high school years. Even with his high school kids, he doesn't focus on a lot things that are considered essential by the Oklahoma establishment like dominating on top.
Could someone implement a program and system like his in Oklahoma? Sure they could try, but it would be hard to carve out a niche. You would have to get parents and kids on board with seriously delayed results and completely different culture than almost every other youth club in the state.
edit: I think the best chance for a change in this direction would be if the Oklahoma kids who come up under DT, head back home and get involved with the club scene post competition.
How awesome would it be if Lockett took over CWC and you get something like a Routledge Wrestling Academy in the Metro area in 10-15 years.
But... I don't think you can really look at what Askren is doing specifically, and try to copy something like that on a large scale in Oklahoma.
Askren is pretty progressive in his coaching philosophy, basically no competition until 10+ and only limited for the next few years after that. He emphasizes skill and mat awareness and doesn't really focus as much on toughness and the old school grit and grind mindset. There isn't much focus on competitive results up through middle school, with the intent of building a solid base so that that athletes are rapidly ascending through their high school years. Even with his high school kids, he doesn't focus on a lot things that are considered essential by the Oklahoma establishment like dominating on top.
Could someone implement a program and system like his in Oklahoma? Sure they could try, but it would be hard to carve out a niche. You would have to get parents and kids on board with seriously delayed results and completely different culture than almost every other youth club in the state.
edit: I think the best chance for a change in this direction would be if the Oklahoma kids who come up under DT, head back home and get involved with the club scene post competition.
How awesome would it be if Lockett took over CWC and you get something like a Routledge Wrestling Academy in the Metro area in 10-15 years.
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Haven’t seen Hardell’s name mentioned. He’s doing good things in OKC. Would be cool to see what he could do if he could devote himself full time.
OWA is doing good things. Tuttle’s two clubs are great. Shelton is a unique club. Tulsa has some killer clubs that are moving kids in. There is alot going on but I think similar things are happening in Iowa, Illinois, Ohio and now Texas. We need something special. I bet something is on the horizon with people like DT and Richison setting the bar. We need an updated approach though imo. We need to new age PSU/Askren type of wrestling culture to move through Oklahoma. Most clubs and coaches are still doing things mostly the way they learned it. The old school OSU / Oklahoma way.
There is something special: David Taylor.
None of this stuff happens overnight. Between him & Robison’s commitment, things will begin to change, and that will matriculate to the youth levels.
It is not generally acceptable to force big changes by those being changed, but if these "hubs" could work together Oklahoma could do some really cool stuff with youth and women's Wrestling.
If you had 4-5 clubs that communicated and collaborated, you'd have a super set of clubs. These clubs would act as a farm system for Oklahoma colleges (Little Rock too) and would propel the state back to the hierarchy of HS and down Wrestling.
The money is available in all areas of the hubs and creative thinking with action could really promote the sport, creating participation that we haven't seen in awhile, if ever.
OWA in OKC is a good club for youth kids, but doesn't currently have any notable HS guys in the program which is likely due to competing with Edmond North. I know Plott and Gfeller trained there under Hardell but I cant think of anyone else. Outside of Edmond North, the OKC metro doesn't have any good HS programs unlike Tulsa. The powerhouse OK HS wrestling programs are starting their own clubs with ex college wrestlers on staff etc. Something like the Askren Academy probably wouldn't work well anywhere but Tulsa. I could see Daton possibly doing something like that one day, but my guess is once he's done competing he wants to coach on the college level.
If, IF, we could get everyone on the same page we could have what Askren is doing on steroids.
Tulsa - EG, Roller, Joseph Smith and Fix. I know there are more names of technicians up there, but I can't think of them. This would be a youth to HS club that trains all Wrestlers in the area. Not sure how big that area would be and what school system that would entail?
OKC metro area - Same as above
West (Altus hub) - there would likely have to be some recruitment for big names here
SC - My area. I know Madill is ready to burst and has great support. Plainview has support. Lone Grove started a program and has support. Sulphur/Davis has great talent and support. We could get good names down here.
SE - Mcalester or Poteau? Similar to Altus hub I would think?
The trick is getting everybody on the same playbook and not poaching kids to other schools that participate. If you had all of these clubs collaborating, cooperating and building in like fashion the state of Oklahoma would be a super power again. I see a few hurdles:
-AD's (generally Football coaches)
-Football (uO getting gangraped in the SEC will help here)
-Overall specialization
-Adaptation to a uniform procedure for all hubs
-Fear of poaching talent to other schools.
It would be super cool to get an event at Winstar. It would be huge and I could probably get something started there. I know this is all a pipe dream, but I think it would be awesome...Im probably over simplifying it.
Altus already works as a hub for SW Ok and NTx but it’s purely developmental. During freestyle we’ll have everyone from Elk City down to Vernon in the room. Like you alluded too though if it was tied in a common network where kids could travel to other rooms and roll without stepping on toes that would be cool. A fresh message like Askren’s that focuses on retention & fun to grow a love for the sport, would be great. We have way too many parents worrying about wins and dragging kids to every single tourney when kids are 6.
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This f'ing kills me... I've been involved with several youth programs now, and I've had so many parents freak out and demand we teach headlocks and chinwhips because the 6-8 year olds who practice those moves win local tournaments. Nope... we will definitely lose matches because of it (if the parents insist on competing young) but if I'm organizing it, we'll teach great stance and position, double legs and work towards a high-c and head inside single, sprawls, a basic standup, and good positioning and pressure on top with a half for the early years, with a focus on fun and games in room.
Exactly! As to the remark on Askren's message would be a part of the process/program.
What has been talked about down here is a facility south of Ardmore that has indoor Track availability too as well as room for speed/strength programs for other sports. So, 3 mats in the middle, with a PV Pit, LJ Pit, HJ Pit, throwers net and a 40 yard track all with the S/C equipment. The location would benefit central and up Texas, all the way to Duncan, north to Wynnewood, east to Durant.
I am telling you, it would be sweet.
I will never understand the parent who is obsessed with ensuring their kid wins.
I want my kids to be mentally tougher than I am. I’m not sure I’m doing so well at that, but for crying out loud, kids have to learn that losing is learning and next time is another opportunity to win.
T
That and they have to care about improvement and effort not wins. Wins are byproduct
I made my little boy “ineligible” tonight at tball because he has a problem doing the things he knows as doing what he’s supposed to do…minding his Mother, putting trash where it’s supposed to go, not trying to catch the barn cats, feeding the horses and etc.!
He had to sit out in front of his bag and watch everyone play.
I don’t care if he wins or excels at sports, at all! I want him to do what it takes to be a good man. Winning just comes when your the best at doing what needs to be done.
It takes money to really ramp something up like this. Bixby is probably the closest one to really exploding and that is largely due to the investments of the Roller family and recently the Mullin family.
Askren had a really good landscape for turning this into a giant but he also invested significantly into as well.
Askren had a really good landscape for turning this into a giant but he also invested significantly into as well.
To Chase’s point… you could do it a lot cheaper through cooperation but it’s tough when everyone still sees it as feeding their high schools vs feeding the colleges or state teams.
As we’ve seen at various places around the state though… all it takes is the availability of good/relevant coaches. It can take off anywhere you have enough good coaching and interest to get good practice partners in the room.
chasepollard said;
"-Football (uO getting gangraped in the SEC will help here)"
This is my number-one non-Wrestling Christmas wish.
"-Football (uO getting gangraped in the SEC will help here)"
This is my number-one non-Wrestling Christmas wish.
Like I mentioned, it is probably a pipe dream. But, DT could probably put a stamp of approval on some clubs and move things along nicely. Basicly, if you aren't Wrestling (most of the year) at one of these clubs, it is really going to be hard to garner an offer from OSU. Throw John in the mix with promoting it, and you probably aren't getting much of look from coaches in his tree. It is a simple idea that is far from simple to execute.
A rising tide lifts all boats kinda deal really.
Yep. The simple fact is that the state has to get alot better for OSU to get and stay where we want to be
He just took a step back and is taking more time for his family and himself, however he is still on OWA's board. Eli Hale is the Head Coach now.
