Hamas, other terrorist organizations and their sponsor Iran have been a constant threat of violence to Israel, US interests and the world in general. With this latest horror what should the response be, what is the goal and what is off limits?
While It's Still Early What Should Be The US & Israel's Response Be?
- Thread starter 2012Bearcat
- Start date
I don’t know what it should be, but I’m sure there are factions in Israel that want to level both Gaza and Tehran.
I think a more relevant question is what will Israel do, not what should they do
I think a more relevant question is what will Israel do, not what should they do
Have the air sorties been turned up yet. I would bet there will be a lot of precision guided bombs let loose.
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Unleash the dogs of war, no matter what the weak ass UN, muslim world, western world or anyone else says. Time to abolish Hamas & any tangible connection to Iran & those that helped plan this mass murder. Israel has practiced restraint on previous missile strikes & executed precise air strikes, no more. Think about nearly 1,000 (probably more) civilians summarily executed, for no other reason than being Israelis.
Lift all ROE's as well, you tote a weapon & run into a building level the whole dam thing. They have already given civilians the chance to leave so without obvious reasons to not shoot, go for broke.
It is amazing to me that the world has funneled millions of $$$ to these savages. When you see peopling killing the elderly, children, women & other non-combatants they have been inculcated with this hate since being very young they are probably beyond redemption as well.
I also believe that this attack was always timed to coincide with the release of the $6 billion. You don't have to have it in your hand to know it is coming. A humanitarian fund in the mullahs hands a week ago can easily be rerouted to something else with a plea to receive part of the $6 billion later for humanitarian funds from Qatar.
The Iranian regime needs to pay a sever price for this as well.
My step dad is headed to Iran on Wednesday to see his brother who is in bad health. Talked to my him last night and he will not change his plans. Worried he will get caught up in some kind of BS over there.
My step dad is headed to Iran on Wednesday to see his brother who is in bad health. Talked to my him last night and he will not change his plans. Worried he will get caught up in some kind of BS over there.
Israel Must Remove Hamas from the Gaza Strip
The scale of Hamas’ attack makes any such premature end to the operation unlikely. This is no more simply “mowing the grass,” but rather the wholesale removal of the lawn. Israel must remove Hamas from the Gaza Strip.
www.19fortyfive.com
If it is true Turkey helped supply those bastards how can they still be allowed to stay in NATO?
I don't think this war starts unless those attacking Israel thought they could end Israel as a sovereign state. The US has never been weaker. Appeasement in Afghanistan, appeasement in Iran, appeasement everywhere. Iran was selling 400,000 barrels of oil a day when Trump was in office and had $4B in reserves. Today, Iran sells 3M barrels of oil a day and has $70B in reserves. Biden has destroyed US energy independence and the US economy. The country has never been more divided. Biden can't lead at home and he can't lead abroad. Since it is Columbus day he can't bother to leave the barbeque to address the American people. He is living in a dementia ridden fantasy world. The Biden administration has taken Iran from an almost defeated terrorist state, to one that is now financially secure and emboldened thru appeasement.
We have an election coming up in 2024. The time is now for the enemies of Israel to take their best shot before a serious President takes power in the US and the US recovers economically, politically, and in regards to energy.
As a result, I don't think Israel has a choice in eliminating every enemy it has, no matter where it leads. Israel is as divided as the US is, maybe this brings their people together. If the enemies of Israel are as resolved as they might appear to be, based on the most favorable climate they have ever been in, Israel may not have a choice but to meet and exceed that resolve.
Maybe the Israeli people do not have the stomach to end this for once and for all, but they have been preparing for a long time for this possibility.
It will come down to a proportional response versus risk analysis of their short and long term survivability.
We have an election coming up in 2024. The time is now for the enemies of Israel to take their best shot before a serious President takes power in the US and the US recovers economically, politically, and in regards to energy.
As a result, I don't think Israel has a choice in eliminating every enemy it has, no matter where it leads. Israel is as divided as the US is, maybe this brings their people together. If the enemies of Israel are as resolved as they might appear to be, based on the most favorable climate they have ever been in, Israel may not have a choice but to meet and exceed that resolve.
Maybe the Israeli people do not have the stomach to end this for once and for all, but they have been preparing for a long time for this possibility.
It will come down to a proportional response versus risk analysis of their short and long term survivability.
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We just might need another January 6th. A true "insurrection" this go around. Dimms have sold our country.
Maybe George Washington knew what he was talking about when he advised the US to stay out of entangling alliances.
Back in the late 1700s that was probably good policy but as the world has progresses and become more global that is not a realistic option as proven in history by WWII.
You mean like the alliance with France that ended the Revolutionary War by bottling the limeys up, in Yorktown, from both land & sea?
Believe it or not the US has on occasions practiced restraint. During the siege at Dien Bien Phu in 1954, the French were begging the US to drop tactical nukes on the Vietminh surrounding them. Ironically the very units that would have been crispy crittered were the cadre that the US faced during our turn.
treaties & entanglements aren't all bad as long as the other signatories hold up their end.
Well, I think it's still good advice in 2023, but assuming you're right maybe the US should be a little more circumspect in the tangling alliances it gets involved in. Is there any place on the planet we haven't inserted a military force to "protect" an ally? And what's weird is a lot of those "allies" we've said we are there to "protect" turn out hating our guts. It's strange how hegemony works that way.
I've come to the point that you mostly stand on. The first criterion for a war is we go to win, or don't go. I think you're partially right about people hating us though, or should I say the original population we "protected." I think as the years have fluttered by & the schools systems or the governments have gotten more radical 2nd or 3rd generation citizens don't want us around. Think S Korea & Japan are still pretty happy, don't care about the Germans anymore, Afghanistan their hate is more about leaving them with their ass hanging in the wind, Iraq, who knows what they think/feel. But that illustrates a whole new dynamic in that if the people are used to being herded lemmings, can they truly be "saved."
I hope that someday our efforts in Iraq pay off & that society starts to resemble something of normalcy. The overarching thing we have to consider these days though is if Iran is willing to arm & oversee a massacre such as this one, do you think they would hesitate to give some terrorist group[ a small nuke to plant in Israel, The US, UK, France etc?
The twist in logic (I guess that's what you'd call it) is the society in Iraq was normal for them for a couple of thousand years, but we decided they needed to become western democracies like us, and are morally obligated to force it on them. I don't think we should be too surprised when they object to our interference.
Our response should be to call for an immediate halt to the violence from both sides. We should condemn the violence on both sides. We should make it clear that we desire a two-state solution for Israel and Palestine and that our foreign policy objective as it relates to Israel and Palestine will be to obtain this goal, not to back one side over the other.
We should call for immediate peace talks between Israel and Palestine. We should do everything we can do lead both sides to peace and a two-state agreement.
Great idea! We should ask a bunch of terrorists to stop it. Maybe Obama can wag his finger through a teleprompter at Hamas and Iran. I’m quite sure they’ll listen.
If only somebody would have thought of that sometime in the last 2,000 years.
Naw, F it. I hope Israel turns Gaza and Iran and anybody else that dares lifting a finger in the wrong direction into glass.
One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. The term terrorist is not helpful here and gets us no where closer to peace.
I'm also advocating for asking the Israelites to stop their violence against and inhumane treatment of the Palestinians. Something they too have so far refused to do.
Still, our policy and response should be a call for peace. Not actions that only make the situation worse. We shouldn't allow the bad actions of two actors dictate what we want to see occur.
Watch what happens. This attack was the straw that broke the camels back.
Nothing has broken the camels back. What we see occuring is nothing new Bearcat. This has been going on for decades. Decades.
What I hope is that all of this will finally make those who desire peace in Israel and Palestine realize that violence isn't going to solve their problems. Violence only begets more violence.
We should destroy Iran's navy. Without the White House PINO this likely would not have happened.
The powers that be in Israel is always fed up with it, at least they claim as much. They get mad, they kill some Palestinians, and then it stops. Only to start up again later.
It all just keeps repeating itself. Nothing ever changes.
And this is what you want? Seriously, do you not want to see peace between Israel and Palestine? And if so, why not?
Yes. Credible sources tell me Iran sponsers much terrorism.
Liberals and Conservatives won’t agree and you’re expecting Jews and Muslims to do the same?
How do you have peace with people that fully believe all Palestinians (or Muslims) should be denied basic human rights and killed?
See how this works Bearcat?
There are extremists on both sides. Seriously man, wake up!
Just look at your own posts. Look at how YOU talk about the Palestinian people.
Is “Freedom Fighters” a new term for people that mercilessly kill women and children and parade them through the streets while recording and posting the aftermath on social media? Or are “Freedom Fighters” people that torture to death any LGBTQ+ member? Or maybe “Freedom Fighters” could be used to described those societies that provide fewer rights to women than every other group on Earth?
That’s a Toon-level putz argument.
Terrorist started this fight and Israel is hopefully going to destroy every single one of them. And hopefully they don’t stop with Hamas. Hopefully they make their way into Iran and destroy the single largest state sponsor of terrorism in the world.
Being a Hamas apologist over this event is just sloppy trolling at this point. Nobody outside of the racists group of 8 is touching that turd.
Good luck dying on that hill.
Ok.
I don't war with Iran. I don't want to see Americans die over something they shouldn't die for.
If war is declared against Iran, will you be the first to sign up and go over there and fight? How about your grandson? Will you encourage him to sign up immediately and go over and perhaps die?
So what is your point?
We continue with the violence and claim it is hopeless? Continue to fight religious wars and claim there is no way anything can change?
btw, we liberal and conservatives aren't fighting a violent war in this country. Political disagreement isn't the same as a war.
Before this attack where have the Israelis called for the extermination of the Palestinians? We hear the Palestinians say this almost daily.
It's not me talking about the Palestinians it every Arab Country out there. You might should talk to people from these countries you might find it educational if you can open your mind. No one like the Palestinians they are merely useful idiots for those that hate Israel. You should be mad at Iran for taking advantage of the Palestinians for Iran's benefit, instead you get mad at the Israelis. SMFH
The Rhetorical War for Israel
With hundreds of Israelis killed and many more kidnapped or injured by the anti-Semitic Arab supremacists of Hamas, the rhetorical war for Israel has begun. This war, as has always been the case, is fought in the realm of rhetoric and argument and no...
“In one important respect, the Harvard students are correct: millions of Palestinians live in an open-air prison. But that prison is built, maintained, and held by the governance of Hamas and an array of even more radical splinter groups who view the human beings within their grasp as mere utilitarian means to their genocidal ambitions. The sovereignty of Hamas and its rival groups over the Gaza Strip must be ended with complete military force. The education provided by UNWRA that continues the indoctrination of children to accomplish Shahid must be ended. It is the false propaganda education of Gaza that propels the violence. The fact that American intellectuals fawn and obfuscate to encourage such a system is disgraceful and is worthy of all of our civil disobedience and a true quest for human freedom.”
Dr. Ben Voth is a professor of rhetoric and director of debate at Southern Methodist University in Dallas, Texas. His most recent books -- Political Campaign Communication 10th edition with Robert Denton and Centennial of the Modern American Presidency: The Presidential Rhetoric of Wilson, Harding and Coolidge (both with Lexington Books) come out in December.
By the way, there's no such MF'ing thing as "Palestine". It's "Fakestine" and "Pallywood".
