There Is A Rapidly Changing Paradigm Shift

[Ponca Dan]

In America’s “special relationship” with Israel. AIPAC better pony up gobs more money than it has in the past and even that may not be enough. Young Americans, especially young Jewish Americans, are discovering they’ve been given a sanitized version of Israeli history and are mad as hell and aren’t going to put up with it any more. “Not in Our Name” is about all Americans, not just the Jewish ones. The world will be a better place when the “special relationship” is not so special any more. The shift is on and there’s nothing AIPAC can do about it, the toothpaste is out of the tube.

American Intifada for Gaza: What Should We Expect? - Antiwar.com

The mass protests at dozens of US universities cannot be reduced to a stifling and misleading conversation about antisemitism. Thousands of American - Ramzy Baroud for Antiwar.com

original.antiwar.com

 

[22LR]

I've got your pArAdIgM sHiFt right here.

 

[Ponca Dan]

I've got your pArAdIgM sHiFt right here.

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Blinkering your eyes will not change anything. Israel has screwed the pooch this time. Things are going to change, for the betterment of the world, Israel included, and if that terrifies you you should wrap a blindfold tight around your eyes.

 

[22LR]

Blinkering your eyes will not change anything. Israel has screwed the pooch this time. Things are going to change, for the betterment of the world, Israel included, and if that terrifies you you should wrap a blindfold tight around your eyes.

Calm down Dan. No need to throw a temper tantrum. You'll hurt yourself and your pets. I just read an article that anger can cause a heart attack. It's only a message board Dan. Take a deep breath.

 

[Ponca Dan]

Calm down Dan. No need to throw a temper tantrum. You'll hurt yourself and your pets. I just read an article that anger can cause a heart attack. It's only a message board Dan. Take a deep breath.

There, I took three deep breaths. I’m all calmed down now. Do you need me to tie your blindfold for you? It’s not easy tying it on the back of your head. It is a blindfold after all.

 

[22LR]

There, I took three deep breaths. I’m all calmed down now. Do you need me to tie your blindfold for you? It’s not easy tying it on the back of your head. It is a blindfold after all.

You claim to be a libertarian. Yet you demand control over people's opinions and beliefs. When you don't get what you want, you go off the rails.

Go figure.

 

[soonerinlOUisiana]

Things are going to change, for the betterment of the world

More dead moslems? I thought Israel already GeNoCiDeD them?

 

[Ponca Dan]

You claim to be a libertarian. Yet you demand control over people's opinions and beliefs. When you don't get what you want, you go off the rails.

Go figure.

You mean because I don't immediately agree with your opinions I'm demanding control? You sound strangly familiar to @Ostatedchi. Sorry, but I pretty much stay on the rails. My opimions are soldily emtrenched unless someone says something worth questioning them. You don't do that. The only one on this board I know who did that was @007Pilt. I miss that guy!

 

[2012Bearcat]

You mean because I don't immediately agree with your opinions I'm demanding control? You sound strangly familiar to @Ostatedchi. Sorry, but I pretty much stay on the rails. My opimions are soldily emtrenched unless someone says something worth questioning them. You don't do that. The only one on this board I know who did that was @007Pilt. I miss that guy!

Yep you're right, your opinions are solidly entrenched no matter the facts, evidence or truth to the contrary of your opinion.

 

[OrangeTuono]

Yep you're right, your opinions are solidly entrenched no matter the facts, evidence or truth to the contrary of your opinion.

You may have well considered your position(s) - i.e. Jews are God's Chosen People so support regardless of consequences or actions - but it's not clear from your posts that this is the case.

 

[22LR]

The only one on this board I know who did that was @007Pilt. I miss that guy!

He invited you to Reddit.

 

[aix_xpert]

Blinkering your eyes will not change anything. Israel has screwed the pooch this time. Things are going to change, for the betterment of the world, Israel included, and if that terrifies you you should wrap a blindfold tight around your eyes.

Are you sure about this. End Israel's "special relationship" and you just might be taking off the only leash that dog has. And if genocide of Palestinians truly is their goal, as you have spouted more times than I can count, who would be responsible for stopping them?

 

[LAY THE WOODY]

More dead moslems? I thought Israel already GeNoCiDeD them?

Israel ain't done.

 

[Ponca Dan]

Are you sure about this. End Israel's "special relationship" and you just might be taking off the only leash that dog has. And if genocide of Palestinians truly is their goal, as you have spouted more times than I can count, who would be responsible for stopping them?

Stop the flow of weapons and make it clear they are on their own against the supposed enemies that surround them, they no longer have "the big dog" backing their play, and they might get a lot less militant. At this point in time no one, not even you, can pretend they are being held back by a leash.

 

[Ponca Dan]

You may have well considered your position(s) - i.e. Jews are God's Chosen People so support regardless of consequences or actions - but it's not clear from your posts that this is the case.

My position is any god that tells people they are his chosen ones over all others and they have his permission to kill every man, woman, child, baby and their livestock to achieve their ends, is not a god I will believe in. I find it incredible that some on this board are all-in on that notion and then turn around and condemn Islam as a violent religion.

 

[22LR]

My position is any god that tells people they are his chosen ones over all others and they have his permission to kill every man, woman, child, baby and their livestock to achieve their ends, is not a god I will believe in. I find it incredible that some on this board are all-in on that notion and then turn around and condemn Islam as a violent religion.

What he is really trying to say is, (his) god is created in the image of man. Dan's ways are not your ways. Seek first the kingdom of Dan, and all these things shall be added unto you. Dan will provide all your needs, according to Dan's riches in the nursing home. 😟

It's always all about Dan.

 

[LAY THE WOODY]

What he is really trying to say is, (his) god is created in the image of man. Dan's ways are not your ways, god. Seek first the kingdom of Dan, and all these things shall be added unto you, god. Dan will provide all your needs, according to Dan's riches in the nursing home. 😟

Promises of apple sauce and chocolate pudding?

 

[2012Bearcat]

Stop the flow of weapons and make it clear they are on their own against the supposed enemies that surround them, they no longer have "the big dog" backing their play, and they might get a lot less militant. At this point in time no one, not even you, can pretend they are being held back by a leash.

If only you had the same thoughts about the Iranians supplying weapons to Hamas. If Hamas didn't have Iranian support, Hamas would not have attacked Israel and started a war.

 

[LAY THE WOODY]

If only you had the same thoughts about the Iranians supplying weapons to Hamas. If Hamas didn't have Iranian support, Hamas would not have attacked Israel and started a war.

Really is that simple. 👍

 

[EZ Reyes]

Dan doesn't have a pair-o'-dimes to rub together.

 

[aix_xpert]

Stop the flow of weapons and make it clear they are on their own against the supposed enemies that surround them, they no longer have "the big dog" backing their play, and they might get a lot less militant. At this point in time no one, not even you, can pretend they are being held back by a leash.

Israel has a $500B dollar (in 2022) GDP yet receives $4B/year in military subsidies from the US. They built the Iron Dome without US funding. US came in afterwards with funding because they wanted the technology to use for themselves. If the US stopped giving Israel money AND prevented Israel from buying (with their own money) weaponry from the US, they'd just reallocate their considerable wealth and resources and buy weapons elsewhere.

And I think you are wrong on them being less militant in that scenario. They are surrounded by countries/societies that want to genocide them. Being less militant would give the impression that they are weak and would lead to more attacks and provocations against them. Thus, I'd expect them to come out swinging against at least one of the major players (similar to the 6-day war) to prove to the rest of the region, that even without the U.S., they aren't someone to F with. To not do so, would be just inviting further proxy attacks by the minor league teams (Hamas, Hezbollah, etc).

 

[OrangeTuono]

Regarding the "Paradigm Shift", that's a classic tactic of Marxist/Neo Marxists to "declare victory".

As I've said in other threads the Israeli's are masterful at steering narratives. I wouldn't write off Israel, unless Biden get's reelected.

What's so creepy about it is that his entire cabinet are Jewish - Blinken, Mayorkas, Yellen, ... Throw in the Swamp Rats for which Biden is doing the bidding - Soros, Klain, et al... Some might claim they are actually anti-Zionists.

This appears to be as much a Jewish vs Jewish factions battle as it is Israel vs Islam.

 

[Ponca Dan]

Israel has a $500B dollar (in 2022) GDP yet receives $4B/year in military subsidies from the US. They built the Iron Dome without US funding. US came in afterwards with funding because they wanted the technology to use for themselves. If the US stopped giving Israel money AND prevented Israel from buying (with their own money) weaponry from the US, they'd just reallocate their considerable wealth and resources and buy weapons elsewhere.

And I think you are wrong on them being less militant in that scenario. They are surrounded by countries/societies that want to genocide them. Being less militant would give the impression that they are weak and would lead to more attacks and provocations against them. Thus, I'd expect them to come out swinging against at least one of the major players (similar to the 6-day war) to prove to the rest of the region, that even without the U.S., they aren't someone to F with. To not do so, would be just inviting further proxy attacks by the minor league teams (Hamas, Hezbollah, etc).

You make a compelling argument, but it leads to this question: if they’re so tough, so indomitable, what do they need us for. If they’re the unquestionable big dog in the region they don’t need us to babysit them, the “special relationship” could just be a relationship.

 

[aix_xpert]

You make a compelling argument, but it leads to this question: if they’re so tough, so indomitable, what do they need us for. If they’re the unquestionable big dog in the region they don’t need us to babysit them, the “special relationship” could just be a relationship.

They don't need us. I think we are more of the leash than the babysitter. Its ironic that you post basically non-stop about how Israel is genociding a population, so you clearly understand that they have that capability, while in parallel think that they need the US as a protector. Spoiler alert: They don't. But WE need Israel to play nice in the Middle East. If war were to break out, then you'd see the closure of the Suez Canal, and you can guarantee that Israel would strike the ports of each of the opposition countries, all of whom provide about 30-40% of the world's daily energy consumption. You dry up that energy, and the whole world crashes down. The WORLD needs Israel to coexist with its neighbors, and thus we take the mantle of protectorate because the Middle Eastern countries need us to buy their energy. So we keep Israel in check, and keep the Middle Eastern countries playing nice in order to sell us their oil, and as such an uneasy truce had been formed. The outlier to that is Iran, who has no interesting in trading oil for peace. We know this as we've seen both Obama and Biden attempt to appease Iran through the release of money, the easing of sanctions, and the Iran Nuclear deal, and yet each attempt has lead to escalated attacks by the Iranian controlled terrorist proxies.

And we fund Israel for one other reason: Because Jewish Americans have GOBS and GOBS of money and spend it in the right circles to manifest political power and have for the past 80+ years. (As an aside, I recommend the book Outliers. It has a great chapter about the rise of power for Jewish lawyers in NYC).

 

[Ponca Dan]

They don't need us. I think we are more of the leash than the babysitter. Its ironic that you post basically non-stop about how Israel is genociding a population, so you clearly understand that they have that capability, while in parallel think that they need the US as a protector. Spoiler alert: They don't. But WE need Israel to play nice in the Middle East. If war were to break out, then you'd see the closure of the Suez Canal, and you can guarantee that Israel would strike the ports of each of the opposition countries, all of whom provide about 30-40% of the world's daily energy consumption. You dry up that energy, and the whole world crashes down. The WORLD needs Israel to coexist with its neighbors, and thus we take the mantle of protectorate because the Middle Eastern countries need us to buy their energy. So we keep Israel in check, and keep the Middle Eastern countries playing nice in order to sell us their oil, and as such an uneasy truce had been formed. The outlier to that is Iran, who has no interesting in trading oil for peace. We know this as we've seen both Obama and Biden attempt to appease Iran through the release of money, the easing of sanctions, and the Iran Nuclear deal, and yet each attempt has lead to escalated attacks by the Iranian controlled terrorist proxies.

And we fund Israel for one other reason: Because Jewish Americans have GOBS and GOBS of money and spend it in the right circles to manifest political power and have for the past 80+ years. (As an aside, I recommend the book Outliers. It has a great chapter about the rise of power for Jewish lawyers in NYC).

That makes very little sense. Why would Israel do that knowing it would take them down with the rest of the world? It would make more sense for them to become a true democracy and seek accommodation with their neighbors rather than cultivate hostility.

 

[2012Bearcat]

That makes very little sense. Why would Israel do that knowing it would take them down with the rest of the world? It would make more sense for them to become a true democracy and seek accommodation with their neighbors rather than cultivate hostility.

Except their neighbors do not want peace, they want the extermination of the Jewish people. You know that whole genocide thing you claim to be against.

 

[Ponca Dan]

Except their neighbors do not want peace, they want the extermination of the Jewish people. You know that whole genocide thing you claim to be against.

I’ve asked you several times now to explain why the Palestinians didn’t kill all the Jews when they ruled over the land? The world was busy occupied with a world war, the Palestinians could have killed the Jews and no one would have had the interest or resources to stop them. So if killing all the Jews is priority for every Palestinian in all time, why didn’t they do it when they could?

 

[2012Bearcat]

I’ve asked you several times now to explain why the Palestinians didn’t kill all the Jews when they ruled over the land? The world was busy occupied with a world war, the Palestinians could have killed the Jews and no one would have had the interest or resources to stop them. So if killing all the Jews is priority for every Palestinian in all time, why didn’t they do it when they could?

No idea, wasn't alive then.

 

[aix_xpert]

That makes very little sense. Why would Israel do that knowing it would take them down with the rest of the world? It would make more sense for them to become a true democracy and seek accommodation with their neighbors rather than cultivate hostility.

Because Israel is content to coexist, as long as they can exist. That's why they play nice.

 

[aix_xpert]

I’ve asked you several times now to explain why the Palestinians didn’t kill all the Jews when they ruled over the land? The world was busy occupied with a world war, the Palestinians could have killed the Jews and no one would have had the interest or resources to stop them. So if killing all the Jews is priority for every Palestinian in all time, why didn’t they do it when they could?

When was this? Are you confusing the Palestinians with the Philistines? Remind me again when the Palestinians ruled that land.

 

[Ponca Dan]

When was this? Are you confusing the Palestinians with the Philistines? Remind me again when the Palestinians ruled that land.

Circa WW2, Palestinians vastly overpopulated Jews in the land now called Israel. They could have swept in and genocided the lot of them in a matter of days before England could have stopped it. But they didn’t. Why? Bearcat is insistent every Palestinian of all time lives for one reason only, to kill Jews. Hell, not just Palestinians, but every Muslim, every Arab on the face of the planet has a burning desire to kill all the Jews.

 

[LAY THE WOODY]

Dan's on the FBI's watch list.

 

[OrangeTuono]

Circa WW2, Palestinians vastly overpopulated Jews in the land now called Israel. They could have swept in and genocided the lot of them in a matter of days before England could have stopped it. But they didn’t. Why? Bearcat is insistent every Palestinian of all time lives for one reason only, to kill Jews. Hell, not just Palestinians, but every Muslim, every Arab on the face of the planet has a burning desire to kill all the Jews.

We have several $K's in Palestinian Christian religious artwork in our home. Beautiful olive wood carvings of the Last Supper, Virgin Mary, and St. Michael the Archangel. The Christians that have been "allowed to leave" consider themselves Palestinian, not Israeli.

Guess what the term for God is in Aramaic, the language Jesus spoke?

 

[aix_xpert]

Circa WW2, Palestinians vastly overpopulated Jews in the land now called Israel. They could have swept in and genocided the lot of them in a matter of days before England could have stopped it. But they didn’t. Why? Bearcat is insistent every Palestinian of all time lives for one reason only, to kill Jews. Hell, not just Palestinians, but every Muslim, every Arab on the face of the planet has a burning desire to kill all the Jews.

They tried, and couldn't succeed. The Palestinians (who were just a subfaction within the Ottoman) were weakened following the fall of the Ottoman Empire in WW1. So even with the Jerusalem riots in the '20s and the Arab riots of the '30s, the Palestinians never had the muscle to move the Israelis out. It wasn't for lack of trying. It was lack of ability. After WW2, the UN, contrary to the wishes of the Arab nations, treatied the Israeli's with their original borders, and then Israel gained control of Gaza and the so-called "occupied territories" during the 6-day war. And that's where we are today.

 

[LAY THE WOODY]

They tried, and couldn't succeed. The Palestinians (who were just a subfaction within the Ottoman) were weakened following the fall of the Ottoman Empire in WW1. So even with the Jerusalem riots in the '20s and the Arab riots of the '30s, the Palestinians never had the muscle to move the Israelis out. It wasn't for lack of trying. It was lack of ability. After WW2, the UN, contrary to the wishes of the Arab nations, treatied the Israeli's with their original borders, and then Israel gained control of Gaza and the so-called "occupied territories" during the 6-day war. And that's where we are today.

Dan and his brother deserve that little bit of history.

 

[aix_xpert]

Dan and his brother deserve that little bit of history.

Remember, prior to October 27th, Dan couldn't spell Gaza even if you spotted him the G and Z.

 

[LAY THE WOODY]

Remember, prior to October 27th, Dan couldn't spell Gaza even if you spotted him the G and Z.

I worry Dan may have sold the farm to fight the Gaza/terrorist fight.

 

[OrangeTuono]

They tried, and couldn't succeed. The Palestinians (who were just a subfaction within the Ottoman) were weakened following the fall of the Ottoman Empire in WW1. So even with the Jerusalem riots in the '20s and the Arab riots of the '30s, the Palestinians never had the muscle to move the Israelis out. It wasn't for lack of trying. It was lack of ability. After WW2, the UN, contrary to the wishes of the Arab nations, treatied the Israeli's with their original borders, and then Israel gained control of Gaza and the so-called "occupied territories" during the 6-day war. And that's where we are today.

Minor clarification. The Ottomans are Turkic people speaking a Turkic language - now modern day Turkey.
The Palestinians, Lebanese, Syrians were Arabicized Aramaic speaking Syriac/Assyrian peoples with the Jewish speaking the Hebrew branch of Aramaic. They were only a "subfaction" in that they were a conquered by the Turks - very different cultures, languages, religions.

As with the Arab conquest of the Levant, the Ottoman's also spread Islam and persecuted the Christians, Jews, Druze and ethnic minorities.

"Arab" is more a linguistic designation than racial. The entire region was populated with Assyrians (Cannaites, Hebrews, etc). Arabic gets conflated with the Saudi/Bedouin's of Mohammed who unified the Saudi pagan tribes to roll out their conquest in the vacuum caused by the 6th centruy bubonic plagues destroying the Roman, Egyptian, and Byzantine population centers.

The Bedouins were much less impacted by the plague due to sparse density and isolation. Mohammed did an amazing (and brutal) job unifying the Saudi's with his bastardization of the Old Testament, then rolling across Anatolia, North Africa and much of the Mediterranian.