The Left knows Leftism doesn't Work

[OrangeTuono]

Do not expect the radical left to survey the wreckage of socialism and communism in history and accept that statism impoverishes people and erodes their freedoms. There will never be admissions by our elite that progressivism exists mainly for the acquisition of power by the utopian and virtue-signaling few, who ensure that they are never subject to the baleful implementation of their ideological agendas on the rest of us.

Still, leftists look around at what they have done to America in the last four years and implicitly know that the plan did not work, the people detested it, or both.

How do we know this? By a variety of barometers.

None of the major Biden “achievements”—10 million illegal aliens across a nonexistent border, key components of the cost of living 25-30 percent higher than in 2020, wars and chaos abroad, DEI racial and tribal obsessions, wars on fossil fuels—poll at even 40-45 percent. Biden’s own approval ratings, as the nominal architect of the most left-wing agenda since the Roosevelt administration, hover between 36 and 34 percent.
https://ruamupr.com/wc/3607/13496/18544/18544,18694.html
But most importantly, the left is not running on its record of the last three-and-a-half years but instead studiously ignoring it, at least temporarily through November.

The Left Knows Leftism Doesn’t Work › American Greatness

Do not expect the radical left to survey the wreckage of socialism and communism in history and accept that statism impoverishes people and erodes their freedoms. There will never be admissions by our…

amgreatness.com

 

[2012Bearcat]

The reasons for the failure are ancient, given that socialism and progressivism are contrary to human nature.

 

[my_2cents]

@OrangeTuono the article you shared is so wrong on so many levels it is hard to know where to start when critiquing the article. I will start then with just responding to the part you quoted in your original post.

Do not expect the radical left to survey the wreckage of socialism and communism in history and accept that statism impoverishes people and erodes their freedoms.

What does Mr. Hanson mean by the terms "socialism" and "communism?" There are numerous types of socialism and numerous types of communism. Some have been tried throughout history, others have not been. And among those that have been tried, some have been successful while others have not.

I understand many on the right like to use these words pejoratively when talking about the left, but it just makes those who do look so foolish. No precision from Mr. Hanson. Very lazy and foolish.

There will never be admissions by our elite that progressivism exists mainly for the acquisition of power by the utopian and virtue-signaling few, who ensure that they are never subject to the baleful implementation of their ideological agendas on the rest of us

lol, then look at what Mr. Hanson does here. He equates progressivism with his previously flawed use of the terms socialism and communism. Three different systems, with numerous sub-systems, all equated as being the same. When they clearly aren't.

And you seriously find this somehow convincing Tuono?

btw, progressives would argue that progressivism exists to benefit all people, not just the elite. And progressives would have no problem pointing to policy positions (universal healthcare, universal education, child tax credits, etc.) that illustrate this fact. Also, progressives would argue that progressivism exists to balance the scales of power in favor of the people, not the elite. Again, citing the policy endeavors they pursue.

Still, leftists look around at what they have done to America in the last four years and implicitly know that the plan did not work, the people detested it, or both.

Now they all are "leftists." lol!

And what is this "plan" he is speaking of. Does Mr. Hanson believe there is some secret plan that all socialists, communists, progressives, and leftists agree on? Seriously? Is Mr. Hanson even paying attention?

Can you define what he means when he speaks of a "plan" that all these groups (and subgroups) have developed and are in agreement on Tuono?

None of the major Biden “achievements”—10 million illegal aliens across a nonexistent border, key components of the cost of living 25-30 percent higher than in 2020, wars and chaos abroad, DEI racial and tribal obsessions, wars on fossil fuels—poll at even 40-45 percent. Biden’s own approval ratings, as the nominal architect of the most left-wing agenda since the Roosevelt administration, hover between 36 and 34 percent.

And next up, the political spin by Mr. Hansen. Statistics without context and right-wing talking points. Any reference to the actual successes of the Biden administration? Nope. Any context for his statistics or talking points? Nope. Any comparison with the previous administration? Nope.

For example, Trump also had low approval ratings. Would Mr. Hanson use this fact to make similar claims about right-wing policies?

But most importantly, the left is not running on its record of the last three-and-a-half years but instead studiously ignoring it, at least temporarily through November.

This is not true. The Biden administration talks often about its record and accomplishments. Democrats cite the record and accomplishments too. Perhaps one believes this false claim if one gets all their news from sources such as Fox News and amgreatness.com. But nevertheless, it is a false claim.

A very weak, dense, and easily refutable article @OrangeTuono .

 

[OrangeTuono]

2Bits, I appreciate your well thought out (for you) reply. Now let's try and focus here for just a minute before your Progressive Narcassistic Mind Virus ADHD kicks in.

You spew a "Vision of Utopia", "if only we could do it our way" without ever checking in on reality of the world we live in. That's the issue with you disconnected from reality narcissistic psychopaths.
Any questions?

 

[my_2cents]

You spew a "Vision of Utopia", "if only we could do it our way" without ever checking in on reality of the world we live in. That's the issue with you disconnected from reality narcissistic psychopaths.
Any questions?

I don't spew a vision of utopia. I support and defend policies that I believe will make the lives of all Americans better and will strengthen and improve our nation. I am not seeking to create a utopia in the United States.

I am also very familiar with "reality." But I also know that realities change. Human realities have consistently changed throughout history, including realities found in the United States. Mankind, and Americans, are hardly ever imprisoned by their temporary realities. Just study a little history if you are unsure about this.

 

[aliabedi]

Do not expect the radical left to survey the wreckage of socialism and communism in history and accept that statism impoverishes people and erodes their freedoms. There will never be admissions by our elite that progressivism exists mainly for the acquisition of power by the utopian and virtue-signaling few, who ensure that they are never subject to the baleful implementation of their ideological agendas on the rest of us.

Still, leftists look around at what they have done to America in the last four years and implicitly know that the plan did not work, the people detested it, or both.

How do we know this? By a variety of barometers.

None of the major Biden “achievements”—10 million illegal aliens across a nonexistent border, key components of the cost of living 25-30 percent higher than in 2020, wars and chaos abroad, DEI racial and tribal obsessions, wars on fossil fuels—poll at even 40-45 percent. Biden’s own approval ratings, as the nominal architect of the most left-wing agenda since the Roosevelt administration, hover between 36 and 34 percent.
https://ruamupr.com/wc/3607/13496/18544/18544,18694.html
But most importantly, the left is not running on its record of the last three-and-a-half years but instead studiously ignoring it, at least temporarily through November.

The Left Knows Leftism Doesn’t Work › American Greatness

Do not expect the radical left to survey the wreckage of socialism and communism in history and accept that statism impoverishes people and erodes their freedoms. There will never be admissions by our…

amgreatness.com

The only thing working are the leftist policies after the depression.
With the largest army in the world and cutting taxes is what bush said voodoo economics.
Since then your debt has increased to point that's repayment is a bigger expense than your military budget and social security
Read rise and fall of civilization by Wagner or history of the world by toynbee

 

[OrangeTuono]

I don't spew a vision of utopia. I support and defend policies that I believe will make the lives of all Americans better and will strengthen and improve our nation. I am not seeking to create a utopia in the United States.

I am also very familiar with "reality." But I also know that realities change. Human realities have consistently changed throughout history, including realities found in the United States. Mankind, and Americans, are hardly ever imprisoned by their temporary realities. Just study a little history if you are unsure about this.

Another drop of Revisionist Marxism? You know it's never worked out well before, right?

How have realities changed from say the American Citizen of 1900 to the American Citizen of 2024?

And what is this "plan" he is speaking of. Does Mr. Hanson believe there is some secret plan that all socialists, communists, progressives, and leftists agree on? Seriously? Is Mr. Hanson even paying attention?

While you did read the article, you didn't comprehend the article. It's an easy mistake that many of us can/do make, myself included in the past. The "plan" is Authoritarianism - the consolidation of power into an every tighten circle of Elite - under multiple guises. And to be fair to your whinging about Marxism, some are Marxist (that's their Utopian pitch), some are NeoCon nationalists, some NeoGon Globalists, some Marxist Globalists, some are simply corrupt power grabbers.
As you show, "their plan" has worked with you ( and many others here). You're completely bought in on handing over more authority, more power while diminishing your Individual Agency. You're good with it, which means they've won.

 

[OrangeTuono]

The only thing working are the leftist policies after the depression.
With the largest army in the world and cutting taxes is what bush said voodoo economics.
Since then your debt has increased to point that's repayment is a bigger expense than your military budget and social security
Read rise and fall of civilization by Wagner or history of the world by toynbee

You're completely untethered from the Individual, the Citizen, and how's that working out for you in Pakistan? But in your defense, Pakistan has never had the concept of egalitarianism every so a wholly foreign concept.

You do point to issues that we need to fix - the sooner the better - so our massive economic engine can start running again.

Question for you - do you think Pakistan (or India or China) will have an government changing economic meltdown before the US does?

 

[GunsOfFrankEaton]

 

[my_2cents]

Another drop of Revisionist Marxism? You know it's never worked out well before, right?

Actually it has worked out well numerous times before and continues to do so.

How have realities changed from say the American Citizen of 1900 to the American Citizen of 2024?

Well let's see, could all women 18 and older in America vote in 1900? Can they now vote today? There is a changed reality for American women.

How about the reality of black Americans, especially in the South, in 1900? Jim Crow laws, segregation, etc. Ring a bell? Another changed reality.

The "plan" is Authoritarianism - the consolidation of power into an every tighten circle of Elite - under multiple guises.

But this isn't a plan that all socialists, communists, progressives, and leftists agree on. Far from it! Ever conversed with a libertarian socialist? Progressives don't favor authoritarianism either.

I am a progressive and I don't embrace authoritarianism. I don't want a tight circle of elites controlling our government. Not at all! I support more democracy, more power and equality for all Americans.

As a member of the left in this country, I got news for you, there is no overarching conspiratorial "plan" that all those on the left agree with. That is right-wing propaganda bs. Heck, leftists disagree often on many issues. I wish we agreed more often than we do, but that just isn't how the left works.

As you show, "their plan" has worked with you ( and many others here). You're completely bought in on handing over more authority, more power while diminishing your Individual Agency. You're good with it, which means they've won.

No offense, but you are starting to sound a little paranoid. Might want to back away from the edge a little.

This statement is completely false though and laced in a conspiratorial worldview. You need to seriously think through your claim. Let's start with just one position I hold . . .

How does supporting the right of all Americans to obtain tertiary education (as I do) diminish my individual agency?

 

[my_2cents]

You do point to issues that we need to fix - the sooner the better - so our massive economic engine can start running again.

Our massive economic engine is running. Our economy is strong right now. Yes, there is room for improvement, but that is always the case.

Serious question for you, do you read or watch any information source that isn't a right-wing information source on a daily basis?

 

[77cowboy]

2Bits, I appreciate your well thought out (for you) reply. Now let's try and focus here for just a minute before your Progressive Narcassistic Mind Virus ADHD kicks in.

You spew a "Vision of Utopia", "if only we could do it our way" without ever checking in on reality of the world we live in. That's the issue with you disconnected from reality narcissistic psychopaths.
Any questions?

Never confuse liberals "good intentions" with their horrendous outcomes. They've been taught early and often to ignore the 1 to 1 relationship as just an outlier that us unwashed are simply too stupid to grasp. In fact, in academia, they usually give accolades and honors to these fools. Tenure gives them the right and privilege to be idiots. It's like a "get of jail free card" for morons.

 

[Sunburnt Indian]

The left banned Aunt Jamima, Uncle Ben and "racist" pancakes. Name me one single action that has improved for a single one of us.

 

[my_2cents]

The left banned Aunt Jamima,

How did "the left" "ban" Aunt Jemima?

How did "the left" "ban" Uncle Ben?

 

[OrangeTuono]

Our massive economic engine is running. Our economy is strong right now. Yes, there is room for improvement, but that is always the case.

Serious question for you, do you read or watch any information source that isn't a right-wing information source on a daily basis?

I typically get my information from Research institutes (Hoover, Manhattan, Cato, Brookings,...) or short form curated articles on both left/right via RealClearXYZ. Also subscribe to several Youtubers like Tucker Carlson, Forbes (congressional hearings).
I don't watch Fox or CNN or any of the "news" outlets, unless something specific pops up on RealClear's feed.

Did you have recommendations for me to check out?

 

[Sunburnt Indian]

I typically get my information from Research institutes (Hoover, Manhattan, Cato, Brookings,...) or short form curated articles on both left/right via RealClearXYZ. Also subscribe to several Youtubers like Tucker Carlson, Forbes (congressional hearings).
I don't watch Fox or CNN or any of the "news" outlets, unless something specific pops up on RealClear's feed.

Did you have recommendations for me to check out?

I get much info from Fox Business and Mark Levin.

 

[aliabedi]

You're completely untethered from the Individual, the Citizen, and how's that working out for you in Pakistan? But in your defense, Pakistan has never had the concept of egalitarianism every so a wholly foreign concept.

You do point to issues that we need to fix - the sooner the better - so our massive economic engine can start running again.

Question for you - do you think Pakistan (or India or China) will have an government changing economic meltdown before the US does?

Pakistan already has a melt down but we never had a policy,we just looked at the dictates from the west and still are.
Look at the happiest countries in the world and see where you stand.

 

[HighStickHarry]

Pakistan already has a melt down but we never had a policy,we just looked at the dictates from the west and still are.
Look at the happiest countries in the world and see where you stand.

What countries are those?

 

[OrangeTuono]

Sorry Ali...

Muslim's love to rag on the impact Leftists have on Western society, pointing our our very obvious internal battles. But be clear that Islam has got nothing to offer beyond a throwback to feudalistic theocracy, which clearly would be a 500-1000 year regression.

I was having a bowl of Nihari with a Pakistani married to a blond American woman and asked him how often he goes back to Pakistan. He laughed and said "Never. Not only would they rape my wife and daughter, they would rape me as well." Don't know if it was dark humor or what.

For whatever this might be worth...

Happiest Countries in the World 2024

worldpopulationreview.com

 

[HighStickHarry]

I don't spew a vision of utopia. I support and defend policies that I believe will make the lives of all Americans better and will strengthen and improve our nation. I am not seeking to create a utopia in the United States.

I am also very familiar with "reality." But I also know that realities change. Human realities have consistently changed throughout history, including realities found in the United States. Mankind, and Americans, are hardly ever imprisoned by their temporary realities. Just study a little history if you are unsure about this.

What city run by democrats for decades is your favorite that we should use for a model?

 

[aix_xpert]

Leftism (aka socialism or communism) works great if you are part of the ruling elite or aristocrat class. Has throughout history.

 

[aix_xpert]

Pakistan already has a melt down but we never had a policy,we just looked at the dictates from the west and still are.
Look at the happiest countries in the world and see where you stand.

Its amazing to see the homogeneity of the cultures that reside at the top of the happiness meters.

 

[Tulsaaggieson]

American culture does not prioritize happiness as a cultural trait. They would rather be miserable and win, than happy and lose.

 

[aliabedi]

Sorry Ali...

Muslim's love to rag on the impact Leftists have on Western society, pointing our our very obvious internal battles. But be clear that Islam has got nothing to offer beyond a throwback to feudalistic theocracy, which clearly would be a 500-1000 year regression.

I was having a bowl of Nihari with a Pakistani married to a blond American woman and asked him how often he goes back to Pakistan. He laughed and said "Never. Not only would they rape my wife and daughter, they would rape me as well." Don't know if it was dark humor or what.

For whatever this might be worth...

Happiest Countries in the World 2024

worldpopulationreview.com

You have a weird Pakistani friend. I was married to an American girl who lived in Pakistan and was respected of course she was not blond but a redhead.
As far as Islam being feudal shows you have no knowledge of islam.

 

[aix_xpert]

You have a weird Pakistani friend. I was married to an American girl who lived in Pakistan and was respected of course she was not blond but a redhead.
As far as Islam being feudal shows you have no knowledge of islam.

As someone who has witnessed a 'public square' caning in a Muslim country, I'd argue about it not being feudal.

 

[OrangeTuono]

You have a weird Pakistani friend. I was married to an American girl who lived in Pakistan and was respected of course she was not blond but a redhead.
As far as Islam being feudal shows you have no knowledge of islam.

Maybe it was "dark humor" as I said.

Ok, please educate me then on the error of my ways... Maybe you have a few example countries on how Islam does not result in a feudal theocracy? Maybe Pakistan is one, perhaps Turkey could be argued. Help me out here.