Ronald Reagan’s Last Speech As President
- Thread starter Ponca Dan
- Start date
He was the greatest. And of course he was correct. We are a nation of immigrants and we need to continue that legacy for all the reasons he stated. We can do that with legal immigrants that follow the process.
Yes, of course you are correct, but I can’t help but believe the illegal immigrants come to America with the same hopes and aspirations.
Unfortunately they are not a monolith. I’m glad your family is worth the risk, mine is not.
Not sure your point. We are still a nation of laws.
Can you clarify? Do you mean illegal immigrants are not a monolith? Legal immigrants are not a monolith? Or all immigrants are not a monolith? I’m afraid I’m not understanding the point you are making.
Oh, what I meant to say is I can’t help but believe illegal immigrants come with the same hopes and aspirations of enriching their lives as Americans as do legal immigrants. I’m not trying to pick a fight, just expressing an opinion.
Sure. Right up until they don't have those aspirations and instead come here to:
1. suckle from the teat of government largess.
2. enrich themselves from criminal endeavors.
3. commit terrorist actions.
If they are here illegally, we don't have an opportunity to ascertain their motives.
I’ve come to the conclusion there are two categories of immigrants from south of our border.
The first category are people, mostly men, who are here for the work, are not interested in becoming Americans, go back to their homelands every chance they get, settle in conclaves that do not integrate into what we like to think of as American society. Contrary to some peoples’ opinions they do not constitute a horde of burglars, rapists or murderers. They’re just here for the work.
The second category are immigrants that we usually associate in our mind’s eye as “legitimate.” They come here with the hope that they can become full fledged Americans, with the same hopes and aspirations of immigrant in the past. They bring their families with them and do the best they can.
I have no idea what a percentage breakdown of the two categories are.
I agree with you 100% that people who are here illegally should not have access to the government’s teat. (But, of course I don’t think there should be a government teat, so it’s easy for me to agree with you about that!)
You said illegal immigrants come here with good intentions. Even if 90% of them are stand up individuals it still adds a criminal element this country doesn’t need. It still creates a class of people who will be exploited and are under the radar. It’s insane to halfway secure the border when the country’s south of us are corrupt violent shitholes. I cannot understand your stance.
I believe (but by no means know for a fact) that your example/estimate of the percentage of them being criminal is way too high. Somebody the other day suggested there are 22 million illegals in America. If that number is correct and your estimate is correct that would put the number of burglar/rapist/murderer-illegals at 2,200,000. Surely you don’t believe that many are here to cause harm, do you?
It would be ridiculous for me to claim all 22 million are here to sing in the church choir. Of course a “bad element” exists. A bad element exists in any population group, wouldn’t you agree. Even among the well vetted legal immigrants. Even among we natives. For all we know there is a bad element lurking among those of us posters on this board.
I maintain the danger is not nearly as looming as Trump has ginned so many to believe. He’s using the fear element as an opportunity to get re-elected. It’s a common, well known ploy used by every politician that has ever lived. (Maybe that’s a little hyperbolic.)
Remember how Obama rattled off how there were 30 million people in America who were in desperate need of health insurance, and decreed how the rest of us had a moral duty to acquiesce to higher taxes for their benefit? He “manufactured” the crisis to get his way and to have something of a lasting legacy of his presidency. I think Trump is doing the same thing with his immigrant crisis. Especially since the government’s own data prove him wrong.
What I ask of you is to clear your head as much as possible of the fear and negative emotions that your family is in imminent danger of an invasion of body snatchers. Think it through as objectively as possible. We all want Trump to win re-election over the lineup the Democrats have produced up to this point. But not at the expense of ceding any more of our liberty.
Why do you live in a gated neighborhood? Was it the only house that was available for purchase but you're trying to purchase a house in a non-gated neighborhood faster than light travels? Serious question.
The quick answer is we found a house we liked at a price we could afford. The fact it is part of a gated community was never a factor.
The last time you brought this up I posted a link from the website Bleeding Heart Libertarians discussing the philosophical error in equating a public wall with a private one. I’ll see if I can find it and repost it for you. It’s really an apples vs oranges comparison.
That's a good example of why a Libertarian candidate is unlikely to win any meaningful federal office in my lifetime.
You’re probably right. As long as people are willingly manipulated by politicians who drum up fake crises for the sake of their personal election it’s unlikely a principled politician who argues on behalf of individual liberty and personal responsibility will have their attention. That’s just the way it is: lose our liberty one brick at a time.
Thanks for the reply. I read it last time and it's still not philosophically correct. People have used walls/fences in the public and private sectors for eons to create a deterrent to entry. That article is only philosophically correct to you because you believe in open borders.
How is maintaining the population of a country as legal and registered ceding liberty?
Have you looked at crime statistics in Mexico and Central America? Do you know how many murders there were in Mexico as compared to this country? You are way too old to be this naive.
https://www.npr.org/2019/01/23/6875...icide-rate-in-2018-tops-33-000-investigations
Mexico 33,000 murders last year, population 129 million
USA 17,000 murders in 2017 (couldn’t find 2018 stats) out of 325 million people.
If you can’t see why we need zero illegal immigrants from these god forsaken countries then I’m afraid you just aren’t living in reality.
This needs an honest reply. I’m at work right now, but I’ll try and get back to you later.
100 gang members that would gut Ponca Dan like a fish right before they robbed his house. ZERO reason to add more crime to this country when we ave the resources to shut this down. Who cares if 1000 great people walked in right before them?
https://www.foxnews.com/us/migrants...-el-salvador-caught-since-october-sources-say
https://www.foxnews.com/us/migrants...-el-salvador-caught-since-october-sources-say
