Ponca dan 2
- Thread starter Syskatine
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What's Pedo Joe going to do about it? Grab his ankles or someone's kid as usual? The 5 time draft dodger already told Putin he won't have to face the US military.
This is indeed an interesting perspective. I’ve read a couple of articles in the last day or two speculating that America’s preeminence on the world stage is in its last dying stage and the new powers will be Euro-Asian. If that is true (I have no knowledge if it is true or not) it might explain why Putin has become more aggressive of late.
I might add I checked on the bona fides of the author and they are impressive, although consideration must be taken into account that he is deeply enmeshed as part of the security state and a very vocal Never-Trumper. I’m not suggesting that makes his opinion instantly suspicious, just that one needs to be aware of the starting point of his thinking.
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I don’t know what to make of this report. It comes from the US Embassy. Can we trust they’re giving a correct or complete or even true story?
Its not just from the embassy, there's video of this and other shellings all over twitters.
I also saw where Russia also announced gradual pullouts like a week before their Crimea invasion. Looks like Russia is just generating a casus belli now.
It may be 100% true. It might be wise to wait awhile before pronouncing judgement. You know how you are berating right wingers for jumping to conclusions about the Durham reports? You might want to follow your own advice for a few more days.
You're putting words in my mouth again and I haven't pronounced judgment. Note that I have not stated he's definitely invading, a campaign of misdirection or gamesmanship would be like Putin, too. Lots of primary and competent news sources (the Guardian) say he's ramping up, he's not standing down. I will not hazard a guess what Vlad's ultimate goal is, it may be just to get a diplomatic concession to long strong at home.
I've been saying if he invades we don't need to get involved. You've been saying he won't invade but if he does we shoujldn't get in the war. I think you've been listening to the wrong people (as usual) and have idealized this guy and unfairly demonized your own country, but I've been in total agreement we don't need to get in a war over there.
That’s a fair assessment with one small but glaring and possibly intentional mistake. You are putting words in my mouth by assuming my harsh criticism of our war mongering security state equates to my “idealizing” Putin. I have said nothing that would objectively lead you to that conclusion. In any negotiation or diplomacy the key to reaching an agreement lies in one’s ability to understand the other’s perspective. Any comment I have made has been made in an attempt to understand why Putin is behaving like he is, and to wonder if perhaps he has a point. In this instance I think he has a point. And I’m far more concerned that if war breaks out the guilt will lie with the US. None of that is based on an idealization of Putin.
Okay maybe not idealization but blaming the U.S. and not him if he invades is insane. He'll thats worse than idealized him. You're justifying war if someone else invades. Just.... wow.
It’s responses like this that baffle me. I can’t tell if you’re intentionally trying to get a “rise” out of me by accusations like that (you can’t) or if you’re really that dense. The last thing I do is justify war.
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Perhaps you can tell me what point is being made. The most likely explanation for why Ukraine has not attempted to retake Crimea is because it knew it would not succeed. Russia invaded and held Crimea for one reason and one reason only, its port at Sevastopol. There are very few material things that a country would fight to the death to preserve. Sevastopol is one of those things for Russia. They would take on the US in a fight to the death before they would give it up. The US tried to backdoor Russia out of Sevastopol and Russia reacted exactly as the US should have known they would.
Honest question: Is a "Russian backed separatist" the same thing as the Russian military? I'm curious because we've (the US) supported separatists in Honduras, Syria, Libya, and numerous other countries (many of whom performed pretty despicable actions), and yet noone ever accused us of invading said countries.
I'll mea culpa if Putin actually invades, but I've been clear that I don't think it will happen. That said, I agree with PD, that Russia will defend Crimea to the end.
Here’s one of the articles I read that predicts the rise of a EuroAsian world:
The New Eurasian Century
The current crises in eastern Europe reflect more than just Kremlin mischief-making—they reflect the first fruits of an emerging world order that spans the vastness from Beijing to Berlin. Unlike the longstanding liberal status quo, with its roots in classical civilization and the Enlightenment...
quillette.com
There are usually two sides to a story, Sys. And in cases like this both sides blame the other. What we should not do is accept one side at face value without investigation. It’s possible the “kindergarten bombing” is a “false flag” being planted by those with a vested interest in having a war. I know you deny it, and you are correct that you very carefully avoided saying anything specific in rushing to judgement, but it seemed pretty apparent that is exactly what you were doing covertly.
Ukraine, Eastern Separatists Trade Blame for Ceasefire Violations - News From Antiwar.com
On Thursday, Ukraine and separatists in the eastern Donbas region traded accusations of ceasefire violations. The Donbas war has been essentially at a stalemate since 2015, but there are frequent ceasefire violations recorded by the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE)...
news.antiwar.com
Damn those Obama officials and their love of Putin.
Former Obama official hits Biden for 'reactive response' to Putin's actions towards Ukraine
www.foxnews.com
@Syskatine, you should probably not read that article.
Former Obama official hits Biden for 'reactive response' to Putin's actions towards Ukraine
Former Obama official hits Biden for 'reactive response' to Putin's actions towards Ukraine
Former Obama White House aide Brett Bruen wrote a scathing piece criticizing the Biden administration's handling of the Russia-Ukraine conflict.
@Syskatine, you should probably not read that article.
I’m not following what point is being made. It sounds like a typical he said/she said controversy, albeit one that will likely get many innocent people killed. Ukraine has amassed over 100,000 troops along the Ukraine/Donbas border, ostensibly to repel a Russian invasion into the Donbas region. In the meantime Russia has amassed over 100,000 troops along the Donbas/Russian border ostensibly to repel a Ukrainian invasion of the Donbas region. What could possibly go wrong? How would anyone ever know “who started it?”
Well, if you tune out reputable journalists and give Russian propoganda equal credibility, I can see how you'd be in that conundrum.
If your reflexive position is to disregard competent people that have facts contrary to your narrative, pls advise and ill quit wasting e1's time. The first tweet outed Russian propoganda.
But what facts am I missing? The US said a Russian invasion is imminent and told Americans to get out ASAP, before hostilities begin. The Russian-aligned rebels have told their follower a Ukrainian invasion is imminent and get out before hostilities begin. He said/She said. Explain to me the value of what your link is reporting, because it obviously went right over my head.
I'm simply watching where the tanks and aircraft fighting is actually occurring. I don't put it past either side to execute false flag operations, so I'm not going to pay attention to small scale shootings or car bombs.
I’m telling you I don’t understand what you’re trying to get me to understand, and that’s your response?
I think the pro-Russisn rebels want very much for their region to break from Ukraine and either become a separate country or become part of Russia. But they know they can't do it without Russian assistance, and they would expect Russian assistance if they could lure Ukraine into attacking them. So that may be what they are trying to do, but I’m not seeing the proof in Sys’s link.
Dan, he's just blindly lashing out. His favorite thought leaders on CNN, MSNBC, and The View have all been fired, taking a hiatus, or suspended for disgusting antisemitic behavior. Sys literally has no clue what his narrative is even supposed to be.
No, you don't read it or educate yourself and instead ask me to. If you want other perspectives from competent, respected journalists, they're out there but you have to have your own intellectual curiosity to read and inform yourself.
The first tweet obviously outs deceptive propoganda.
The Eliot Higgins tweet? That’s the one I read (I didn't see the other two until now). That’s the one you say is the smoking gun? The rebels filmed a so-called evacuation before they called for an evacuation and showed the films? That’s what you are talking about?
No, I didn't say it was a "smoking gun", and yes, those are guys that are actually debunking propaganda and giving factual updates. Its not a "gotcha", it's not a gospel, it's competent people that try to get it right.
Since I can't get any libs to tell me why Putin is invading Ukraine, I decided to "ask Google". Here I found a link to CNN (everyone's favorite liberal mouthpiece). And its excuse is that Putin is an ideologue who is trying to restore the glory of the old Soviet Union, and that Ukraine is the "crown jewel" of what Russia lost. And that Putin wants to be like the great Czars of the past. Their answer is that its for his ego. This keeps Russia relevant on the world stage.
I'm sorry, but I'm struggling to get there. Is Putin a Narcissist? Well, duh. Can you name a world leader who isnt? Their article basically states that he's just like Kim Jun Un in NK showing his strength to try to make his country relevant. Yet in reality they control the entire Energy policy of Europe, sit on the UN Security Council, and are a foremost global power, and Putin in the past, has not demonstrated idiocracy in the past. So why should I believe that suddenly his ego is driving him to such an idiotic conclusion that he should invade Ukraine.
I'm sorry, but I'm struggling to get there. Is Putin a Narcissist? Well, duh. Can you name a world leader who isnt? Their article basically states that he's just like Kim Jun Un in NK showing his strength to try to make his country relevant. Yet in reality they control the entire Energy policy of Europe, sit on the UN Security Council, and are a foremost global power, and Putin in the past, has not demonstrated idiocracy in the past. So why should I believe that suddenly his ego is driving him to such an idiotic conclusion that he should invade Ukraine.
Competency is always appreciated. The Higgins tweet is presumably competently factual. But I’m missing its importance in the big picture. Propaganda by Russia is undeniably a fact of life. As regards the tweets from the other two, one is the writers opinion stated without factual backup, which may be true but he should show his evidence, while other is reporting a statement issued by the Ukrainian government which possibly is Ukrainian propaganda, all he does is parrot what he's been told. You do recognize that both sides engage in propaganda, don’t you?
I've said, if he invades, then I was wrong and I'll state in publicly. But I've been adamant that no invasion is going to happen, and that all the panic is nothing more the political theatre.
