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Excellent piece for Ponca Dan and Whari to read.

Syskatine

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Yesterday's piece from Heather Heyer is set forth below, Dan. I thought of you and Whari when I read this, as it's interesting that we have more contemporary issues with Nazis than communists.

Four years ago today, racists, antisemites, white nationalists, Ku Klux Klan members, neo-Nazis, and other alt-right groups met in Charlottesville, Virginia, to “Unite the Right.” The man who organized the rally, Jason Kessler, claimed he wanted to bring people together to protest the removal of Confederate general Robert E. Lee from a local park. But the rioters turned immediately to chants that had been used by the Nazis in Germany in the 1930s: “you will not replace us,” “Jews will not replace us,” and “blood and soil.” They gave Nazi salutes and carried Nazi insignia, and many brought battle gear and went looking for fights. By the end of August 12, they had killed counterprotester Heather Heyer and had injured 19 others. After the governor of Virginia declared a state of emergency, the rioters went home.

The Unite the Right rally drew a clear political line in America. Then-president Donald Trump refused to condemn the rioters, telling a reporter that there were “very fine people, on both sides.”

In contrast, former vice president Joe Biden watched the events at Charlottesville and concluded that the soul of the nation was at stake. He decided to run for president and to defeat the man he believed threatened our democracy. Biden was especially concerned with Trump’s praise for the “very fine people” aligned with the rioters. “With those words, the president of the United States assigned a moral equivalence between those spreading hate and those with the courage to stand against it,” Biden said, “and in that moment, I knew the threat to this nation was unlike any I had ever seen in my lifetime.”

Four years later, it is much easier to see the larger context of the Charlottesville riot. The political threat of those gangs who tried to unite in Charlottesville in 2017 recalls how fascism came to America in the 1930s: not as an elite ideology, but as a unification of street brawlers to undermine the nation’s democratic government.

In 2018, historian Joseph Fronczak explored the arrival of fascism in the U.S. In an article in the leading journal of the historical profession, the Journal of American History, Fronczak explained how men interested in overturning Democrat Franklin Delano Roosevelt’s presidency in 1934 admired and then imitated the violent right-wing gangs that helped overturn European governments and install right-wing dictators.

The United States had always had radical street mobs, from anti-Catholic gangs in the 1830s to Ku Klux Klan chapters in the 1860s to anti-union thugs in the 1880s. In the 1930s, though, those eager to get rid of FDR brought those street fighters together as a political force to overthrow the federal government.

While they failed to do so in an attempted 1934 coup, Fronczak explains, street fighters learned about the contours of fascism once their power as a violent street force was established. He argues that in the U.S., fascism grew out of political violence, not the other way around. Mobs whose members dressed in similar shirts, waved similar flags, and made similar salutes pieced together racist, antisemitic, and nationalistic ideas and became the popular arm of right-wing leaders. In America, the hallmark of budding fascism was populist street violence, rather than an elite philosophy of government.

The Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville had the hallmarks of such a populist movement. Leaders brought together different gangs, dressed similarly and carrying the emblem of tiki torches, to organize and attack the government. Rather than rejecting the rioters, then-President Trump encouraged them.

From that point on, Trump seemed eager to ride a wave of violent populism into authoritarianism. He stoked populist anger over state shutdowns during coronavirus, telling supporters to “LIBERATE MINNESOTA,” “LIBERATE MICHIGAN,” and “LIBERATE VIRGINIA, and save your great 2nd Amendment. It is under siege!” His encouragement fed the attacks on the Michigan state house in 2020. And then, after he repeatedly told his supporters the 2020 presidential election had been stolen, violent gangs attacked the U.S. Capitol on January 6, 2021, in an attempt to overturn the government and install him as president for another term.

While that attempted coup was unsuccessful, the empowerment of violent gangs as central political actors is stronger than ever. Since January 6, angry mobs have driven election officials out of office in fear for their safety. In increasingly angry protests, they have threatened school board members over transgender rights and over teaching Critical Race Theory, a legal theory from the 1970s that is not, in fact, in the general K–12 curriculum.

Now, as the coronavirus rages again, they are showing exactly how this process works as they threaten local officials who are following the guidelines issued by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to require masks. Although a Morning Consult poll shows that 69% of Americans want a return to mask mandates, vocal mobs who oppose masking are dominating public spaces and forcing officials to give in to their demands.

In Franklin, Tennessee, yesterday, antimask mobs threatened doctors and nurses asking the local school board to reinstate a mask mandate in the schools. “We will find you,” they shouted at a man leaving the meeting. “We know who you are.”
 
Yesterday's piece from Heather Heyer is set forth below, Dan. I thought of you and Whari when I read this, as it's interesting that we have more contemporary issues with Nazis than communists.

Four years ago today, racists, antisemites, white nationalists, Ku Klux Klan members, neo-Nazis, and other alt-right groups met in Charlottesville, Virginia, to “Unite the Right.” The man who organized the rally, Jason Kessler, claimed he wanted to bring people together to protest the removal of Confederate general Robert E. Lee from a local park. But the rioters turned immediately to chants that had been used by the Nazis in Germany in the 1930s: “you will not replace us,” “Jews will not replace us,” and “blood and soil.” They gave Nazi salutes and carried Nazi insignia, and many brought battle gear and went looking for fights. By the end of August 12, they had killed counterprotester Heather Heyer and had injured 19 others. After the governor of Virginia declared a state of emergency, the rioters went home.

The Unite the Right rally drew a clear political line in America. Then-president Donald Trump refused to condemn the rioters, telling a reporter that there were “very fine people, on both sides.”

In contrast, former vice president Joe Biden watched the events at Charlottesville and concluded that the soul of the nation was at stake. He decided to run for president and to defeat the man he believed threatened our democracy. Biden was especially concerned with Trump’s praise for the “very fine people” aligned with the rioters. “With those words, the president of the United States assigned a moral equivalence between those spreading hate and those with the courage to stand against it,” Biden said, “and in that moment, I knew the threat to this nation was unlike any I had ever seen in my lifetime.”

Four years later, it is much easier to see the larger context of the Charlottesville riot. The political threat of those gangs who tried to unite in Charlottesville in 2017 recalls how fascism came to America in the 1930s: not as an elite ideology, but as a unification of street brawlers to undermine the nation’s democratic government.

In 2018, historian Joseph Fronczak explored the arrival of fascism in the U.S. In an article in the leading journal of the historical profession, the Journal of American History, Fronczak explained how men interested in overturning Democrat Franklin Delano Roosevelt’s presidency in 1934 admired and then imitated the violent right-wing gangs that helped overturn European governments and install right-wing dictators.

The United States had always had radical street mobs, from anti-Catholic gangs in the 1830s to Ku Klux Klan chapters in the 1860s to anti-union thugs in the 1880s. In the 1930s, though, those eager to get rid of FDR brought those street fighters together as a political force to overthrow the federal government.

While they failed to do so in an attempted 1934 coup, Fronczak explains, street fighters learned about the contours of fascism once their power as a violent street force was established. He argues that in the U.S., fascism grew out of political violence, not the other way around. Mobs whose members dressed in similar shirts, waved similar flags, and made similar salutes pieced together racist, antisemitic, and nationalistic ideas and became the popular arm of right-wing leaders. In America, the hallmark of budding fascism was populist street violence, rather than an elite philosophy of government.

The Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville had the hallmarks of such a populist movement. Leaders brought together different gangs, dressed similarly and carrying the emblem of tiki torches, to organize and attack the government. Rather than rejecting the rioters, then-President Trump encouraged them.

From that point on, Trump seemed eager to ride a wave of violent populism into authoritarianism. He stoked populist anger over state shutdowns during coronavirus, telling supporters to “LIBERATE MINNESOTA,” “LIBERATE MICHIGAN,” and “LIBERATE VIRGINIA, and save your great 2nd Amendment. It is under siege!” His encouragement fed the attacks on the Michigan state house in 2020. And then, after he repeatedly told his supporters the 2020 presidential election had been stolen, violent gangs attacked the U.S. Capitol on January 6, 2021, in an attempt to overturn the government and install him as president for another term.

While that attempted coup was unsuccessful, the empowerment of violent gangs as central political actors is stronger than ever. Since January 6, angry mobs have driven election officials out of office in fear for their safety. In increasingly angry protests, they have threatened school board members over transgender rights and over teaching Critical Race Theory, a legal theory from the 1970s that is not, in fact, in the general K–12 curriculum.

Now, as the coronavirus rages again, they are showing exactly how this process works as they threaten local officials who are following the guidelines issued by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to require masks. Although a Morning Consult poll shows that 69% of Americans want a return to mask mandates, vocal mobs who oppose masking are dominating public spaces and forcing officials to give in to their demands.

In Franklin, Tennessee, yesterday, antimask mobs threatened doctors and nurses asking the local school board to reinstate a mask mandate in the schools. “We will find you,” they shouted at a man leaving the meeting. “We know who you are.”
I am curious, Sys, whether you believe that is an accurate portrayal of history. There is a reason revisionist history always has to be looked at with a skeptical eye.
 
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I am curious, Sys, whether you believe that is an accurate portrayal of history. There is a reason revisionist history always has to be looked at with a skeptical eye.
Yes. Which part is inaccurate?
 
Holy shit, how many nazis do you think are in this country? Are they in the room with you right now?
 
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Yes. Which part is inaccurate?

Lies of ommision. Leaves out a lot about the Charlottesville protest. For example, the fact that the organization had filed for a permit and had been authorized to perform such a gathering. They followed the law to do their protest. That's a curious omission. But even better, it talks about the "riot breaking out" yet nowhere does it mention Antifa and other counter-protestors violating the original protestors right to protest. You know the one they had received the city's permission to hold? And that's just the first couple paragraphs. The rest of the article is the same liberal tripe that MSNBC sells daily that lemmings like yourself lap up like kittens at a milk bowl.
 
Yes. Which part is inaccurate?
I think pretty much the entire article would best be described as propaganda. It is rife with inaccuracies, opinions painted as historical facts. There has never been much of a fascist threat in this country, and his attempt to make it sound like right wing fascists are a stone’s throw from ultimate power is just silly. His description of Nazi tactics in Germany are far closer to the MO of Antifa today.

After WW2 the right wing was primarily represented by outfits like the John Birch Society, an organization that could hardly be described as fascist or violent in any form. They were the remnant of the old anti-war right, pacifist to the core. The Birchers got smeared and chased into oblivion by Bill Buckley’s virulent anti-communism. Again, local violence was not part of his program.

The outfits this article mentions I had never heard of before. It is absurd to present them as a serious fascist threat to the country.

If I were a college professor teaching a class on propaganda this article would be one I would use as an example of present day propaganda.

I have a great deal of trouble believing you really believe this. I have always thought of you as a relatively intelligent person that gets his kicks by trolling this board, but always knowing what you're saying is just ridiculous smear designed to rile up the MAGA crowd. If you truly believe this article is historically accurate my assessment of your intelligence will need a complete overhaul!
 
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Holy shit, how many nazis do you think are in this country? Are they in the room with you right now?

I can't find any Whari, they don't really out themselves. See my earlier post about them getting the shit kicked out of them over and over. Who do you think buys those hats?
 
When Sys comes back to read responses to his thread and gets called out for accusing the right for things the left has been doing for decades.
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I can't find any Whari, they don't really out themselves. See my earlier post about them getting the shit kicked out of them over and over. Who do you think buys those hats?

If you are such an expert on Nazis then how come you cannot recognize it flourishing within the Left right now. All you lefties whine and bitch about Nazis yet turn a blind eye to the Nazis taking over your side. The Lefts sudden hate of Jews, Anqueefa pretending to be Antifascists, Dear Leader acting like a Dictator, Cuban Refugees denied entry into the US meanwhile our Southern Border is hemorrhaging and all the other shit the left threw tantrums over the past 5 yrs.
Nazis? You wouldn't know what a Nazi is if they sent you back in time and put you in Nazi Germany during WW2.
 
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I think pretty much the entire article would best be described as propaganda. It is rife with inaccuracies, opinions painted as historical facts. There has never been much of a fascist threat in this country, and his attempt to make it sound like right wing fascists are a stone’s throw from ultimate power is just silly. His description of Nazi tactics in Germany are far closer to the MO of Antifa today.

After WW2 the right wing was primarily represented by outfits like the John Birch Society, an organization that could hardly be described as fascist or violent in any form. They were the remnant of the old anti-war right, pacifist to the core. The Birchers got smeared and chased into oblivion by Bill Buckley’s virulent anti-communism. Again, local violence was not part of his program.

The outfits this article mentions I had never heard of before. It is absurd to present them as a serious fascist threat to the country.

If I were a college professor teaching a class on propaganda this article would be one I would use as an example of present day propaganda.

I have a great deal of trouble believing you really believe this. I have always thought of you as a relatively intelligent person that gets his kicks by trolling this board, but always knowing what you're saying is just ridiculous smear designed to rile up the MAGA crowd. If you truly believe this article is historically accurate my assessment of your intelligence will need a complete overhaul!
*hint*

He doesn't know what leftist propaganda looks like because he's a very obvious example of the left's success at creating useful idiots.
 
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