2019 WTT

Discussion in '34 and counting' started by Wrassler17, May 18, 2019.

  1. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Senior World Team

    57 kg: Gilman vs Cruz, winner gets Daton @ Final X
    65 kg: JO vs Retherford, winner gets Yianni @ Final X
    79 kg: Alex vs Z Valencia, winner gets Dake @ Final X

    Note: the Flo guys said Dake may be injured so he might request a delayed wrestle-off.
     
  2. BigD_cowboy

    BigD_cowboy Redshirt
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    AD with tech fall over zahid round 1
    Jo lost 7-6
     
  3. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Alex wins by tech. Looked dominant. On to Final X.

    Interestingly, Pyles mentioned Alex was banged up last year against Zahid. I remember Mrgrapple posted something about that at the time.

    JO lost to Retherford.
     
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  4. Harleycowboy

    Harleycowboy Starter
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    Enjoyable to see Ringer dominate Valencia in 2 matches especially after he lost last year. Now if he can get Dake back, that would be great.
     
  5. osu2082

    osu2082 MegaPoke is insane
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    AD has been absolutely dominant. He will push Dake and has before. It’s just crazy as he is arguably the second best wrestler in the world at this weight. It’s just tough that the top guy happens to be an American also.

    JO just can’t handle the weight to go through a full tournament or a full match against Zain. He has the offensive firepower but not the lungs or tank.
     
  6. Air_Thurman

    Air_Thurman MegaPoke is insane
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    What an incredibly weight. Dake, Ringer and Zhadid are all animals who could win gold at worlds. That’s not even counting Hall.
     
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  7. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    I think Alex gets Dake this time, he has looked terrific all year.

    I think you might be right. About 2 months ago, JO lost in the Dan Koslov finals to #1 Bajrang Punia (the guy Yianni faced at BTS). Punia is very good, he combines skill with pressure & pace. The match was tied at the break, but then JO got worn down in the 2nd period. Punia has that European step on the foot to pin the leg down single. He must have hit it 5x in the 2nd period and JO just couldn't move his feet. I know he wants to win the Olympics, but I wonder if he might be better off going 70 kg for the non Olympic years.

    I also think it's time to get him out of Ithaca and get him back to Stillwater with our coaches & wrestlers. No more Koll, Vito, Yianni & Dake. Should be John, Zack, Chris, Daton, G & Alex.
     
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  8. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Alex match #1


    Alex match #2


    JO match #1


    JO match #2
     
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  9. okcpokefan12

    okcpokefan12 2nd Team
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    Thanks for posting. Alex is a beast!
     
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  10. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    They threw out some crazy stats on Flo today...in the last 2 years, Alex is 30-4. His losses have been to Valencia (twice), Dake & Gadzhimagomedov (World bronze, split with Dake). In those matches, Alex has scored 279 points and given up only 40.
     
  11. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Pat Downey tweeted that he heard Dake will be requesting a delay to his Final X matches with Alex (due to injury). The Flo guys had said this was possible a couple of weeks back. I believe Dake has until 48 hours beforehand to make the request and then they would wrestle at Fargo instead.

    There appears to be some gamesmanship going on with Final X. David Taylor withdrew due to injury, so Downey wins the 86 kg spot by default. The Flo guys said Taylor purposely waited until after the Challenge Tournament was over before making that announcement though. That prevented others from moving (79 kg, 92 kg) and winning the spot. A potential medalist would receive a bye into next year's Final X, which Taylor did not want. For example, Alex & Z Valencia could have tried that approach since they both plan to go 86 kg next year anyway.
     
  12. BigD_cowboy

    BigD_cowboy Redshirt
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    I'm wondering (not that it would disclosed) what Dake's injury could be?
     
  13. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    The Flo guys said they heard it was the knee, but didn't say the exact injury.
     
  14. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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  15. BigD_cowboy

    BigD_cowboy Redshirt
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    Definitely gamesmanship on this one.
     
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  16. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Listened to a Flo interview with Dake and I have to agree with you, definitely some gamesmanship.

    Besides requesting the delay so late, it's pretty clear that Dake is now trying to delay the wrestle-off for as long as possible. Sounds like USA Wrestling will arbitrate and it could be as late as early September.
     
  17. BigD_cowboy

    BigD_cowboy Redshirt
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    This final x at Rutgers will be worth watching. Love the 92kg match. Bo is full of confidence and he will need to beat a guy who still believes he isn't respected. 65kg and 125kg matches will be great as well.
     
  18. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Picks:
    Retherford over Yianni in 3 matches
    J'den over Nickal in 2 matches
    Gwiz over Gable in 2 matches

    If Gable loses he could challenge Kerkvliet for the U23 spot, which I think he'd win. Likewise, Yianni & Nickal would be big favorites over Eierman & Singletary. I think Nickal might try for the 97 kg spot instead the 92 spot in order to test the waters for next year.
     
  19. Air_Thurman

    Air_Thurman MegaPoke is insane
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    Yianni got screwed to the 100th degree last night. Hopefully USA wrestling does the right thing and makes them wrestle a third.
     
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  20. northmarion2001

    northmarion2001 Recruit
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    Hate that none of the college guys made the team at final x Rutgers. Odds don’t look good for the other college guys..... fix an the kid from north western
     
  21. BigD_cowboy

    BigD_cowboy Redshirt
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    I agree but I think Stevenson is right there. I realize he lost 2 straight but I think he's going to be the favorite for next year.
     
  22. osu2082

    osu2082 MegaPoke is insane
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    I think Yianni has a great chance if his appeal is won (don’t know how realistic that is) and Fix has a great shot to beat Gilman.

    Gable is right there also. I do think Yianni, Gable and Fix (possibly Spencer also) are the future and that is sooner rather than later.
     
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  23. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Thought I saw AJ Ferrari protesting the Zain/Yianni call in the background...

    - Gable is obviously very talented, but he's also somewhat of a jerk. I haven't forgotten the boxing jab he took at Derek. It even looked like he was talking smack to Gwiz last night. I'm not unhappy that he lost.
    - The ending of Zain/Yianni was obviously a disaster the way it played out. But purely from a wrestling perspective, I don't like a 2 & 2 call there. I think Zain was tilting Yianni back and was about to force the exposure. Yianni sensed it and simply did a desperation roll holding on to the chest wrap. To me that should be 2 for Zain only - even if it means changing the scoring rules going forward. At one time you could chest wrap the guy shooting a double leg. Now you need to stop his momentum or alter the direction in order to get exposure points.
    - I think Daton beats Gilman
     
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  24. Mrgrapple

    Mrgrapple Redshirt
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    After hearing an explanation of the scoring in the Zain Yianni bout I believe the second match decision will stand. I also think that it was correct.
     
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  25. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Listened to a Rob Koll interview last night. Cornell lawyers drafted a 4 page protest letter that will be sent to USA Wrestling initially and then likely on to the USOC.

    One thing I picked up on is that Koll is not a big fan of the match chairman. Sounds like there is some history between them. One of Koll's remarks was that the chairman was sleeping earlier in the day and that he may have been out late the night before. That was kind of odd.

    As to the match itself, I think the big question is why did 2 & 2 go up on the scoreboard without the officials conferring first? Is that permissible? I've seen and heard different opinions on it.
     
    26 Wrassler17, Jun 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  26. CowboyUp61

    CowboyUp61 2nd Team
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    I saw a tweet last Thursday (don't remember who from) about the refs being out at a bar. Not a good impression, even if everything went perfect.

    The way I understood the rules, the mat official has to offer points. (If I remember right, he signalled 2 blue) The mat judge can confirm or offer something different (again by memory, the judge said 2 red). The chairman has to agree with one or the other, or stop the match to confer on the scoring. But the chairman offered 2 and 2. Somehow that got put on the board, without confirmation from anyone.

    Don't take as gospel-it has been a few years since I was on the mat, and my memory is failing as fast as the rest of me.
     
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  27. Mrgrapple

    Mrgrapple Redshirt
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    They could not stop the bout and hold a conference because Yianni and Zain were still in a scramble situation. I believe they scored the bout correctly and Zain won however the situation was unfortunate for Yianni thinking he was winning in the final seconds . Not nearly as bad as the restart, stalemate, call in Fix’s NCAA loss.
     
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  28. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    The Iowa board has a good thread on this topic. I just posted this question over there...

    It appears the 2 & 2 score was posted on the scoreboard in error. Regardless of the scramble situation, doesn't the chair/judge have to stop the match to correct that situation?

    Ben Askren & Willie Saylor both asked about this scenario...if a scoreboard error happened early in the 2nd period and was followed by a 2:50 scramble, would the officials allow an entire period to pass before correcting "their error" and fixing the score? If so, that's crazy and they need to rethink the rules/protocols.
     
  29. Air_Thurman

    Air_Thurman MegaPoke is insane
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    My issue is not so much with the scoring. It is the fact that it is completely unfair to change the scoring of the match after the match was over. If Yianni is down that changes how everything is wrestled.

    That is like winning a basketball game but the refs change it to a loss because a three should have been counted as a two with a minute left in the game. Stuff like this would never fly in another sport. If a ref gets something wrong then you replay the situation from the mistake.
     
  30. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    That appears to be the crux of Cornell's protest. Have no idea if they will be successful though.

    Regarding my question -- I skimmed the UWW rules and there is a statement that the public scoreboard must conform to the chairman's score sheet at all times. Gotta believe that will be part of the protest too.
     
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  31. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Flo has an interview with Alex, sounds like we may hear a date soon regarding his wrestle-off with Dake. John wants it to happen by 7/8, but it could get dragged out past Fargo.
     
  32. Air_Thurman

    Air_Thurman MegaPoke is insane
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    Is there not some date they have to wrestle by? I'm all for wanting the fairest matchup possible but dragging this thing on a month past when all the other spots have been decided seems odd. You would think at some point Dake would have to wrestle even if he isn't 100%.
     
  33. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Unfortunately not. It's basically a negotiation between the 2 camps and USA Wrestling. Last year the Helen Maroulis wrestle-off was delayed until just a few weeks before Worlds, so there is some precedent. BTW, Helen was training in our room last week, so that's pretty cool. :)

    Let's face it, Alex is wrestling like a beast right now. IMO Cornell wants to delay the wrestle-off as long as possible to throw off his training and preparation. Consider this, Dake said a few weeks prior to the 6/8 Final X that he fully expected to be ready. Now he needs another 2+ months?

    Also, how about this one...within hours of the Yianni/Zain match, Koll said he had spoken with several people to understand the protest process. Within 48 hours, Cornell had met with the USOC Ombudsman and had begun having their lawyers draft the 4 page protest letter to expedite the process. Pretty impressive planning and urgency, right? So what was the reason Dake gave for waiting until the Tuesday before Final X to submit his delay request - forcing Alex to taper his workouts and begin his weight cut? Cornell didn't realize how much paperwork was needed to request the delay. :rolleyes:
     
  34. Air_Thurman

    Air_Thurman MegaPoke is insane
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    This stuff is just crazy. I love wrestling but it seems like one of the only few sports that let this type of thing happen. Set a date so Alex knows the timeframe and can prepare and if Dake can't go he can't go. This isn't rocket science.
     
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  35. Wrassler17

    Wrassler17 All-Big12
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    Dake got a doctor's note saying he can't wrestle until 8/17. :rolleyes:

    Cornell doesn't have a shortage on lawyers & doctors apparently.

    BTW, Tate Picklo has a picture with Dake (in wrestling attire) in the Cornell room posted on 4/7. But we believe you Kyle. No really, we do.
     
  36. oberebo

    oberebo Heisman Candidate
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    FINAL X SCHEDULE FOR TOMORROW EVENING
    SESSION 2 STARTS 6PM CENTRAL TIME
    BOUT 1 WFS 62KG
    BOUT 2 WFS 53KG
    BOUT 3 WFS 76KG ADELINE GRAY
    BOUT 4 MEN'S GRECO 130KG COON VS. SCHULTZ
    BOUT 5 MEN'S FS JOE COLON VS. TYLER GRAFF
    BOUT 6 MEN'S FS 97KG KYLE SNYDER VS. KYVEN GADSON
    BOUT 7 MEN'S FS 70KG DEAKIN VS. GREEN
    BOUT 8 MEN'S FS 55KG DATON FIX VS. THOMAS GILMAN
    BOUT 9 MEN'S FS JORDAN BURROUGHS VS. IMAR
     
  37. Kingk0ng

    Kingk0ng 2nd Team
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    Daton takes the first match 9-1 over Gilman
     
  38. pokes_fan00

    pokes_fan00 2nd Team
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    Gilman won the second match 3-2.

    Mark Perry is a giant douche, he was pointing at Fix saying “he’s done” as the match ended.
     
  39. Harleycowboy

    Harleycowboy Starter
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    Daton won the 3rd match 6 to 3. Fantastic. Mark Perry was obviously wrong. Daton is going to the World Championships. Daton was behind 3 to 3 on criteria to Gilman with about 30 seconds left he got the takedown and held on. The takedown was challenged with 5 seconds left but the call was upheld (finally a call goes our way. Therefore the final 6 to 3 win.
     
    40 Harleycowboy, Jun 15, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019

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