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The way too early look at 2016 lineup

Orangebomber

All-Big12
May 29, 2001
1,670
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125 - Eddie - Senior ranked in top 5
133 - G W Harding - Sophomore ranked in top 20
141 - Dean Heil - Sophomore ranked in top 8 maybe top 5
149 - Collica - Junior ranked in top 20
157 - Blees?
165 - Dieringer - Senior ranked number 1
174 - Crutchmer - Junior ranked number 1???? Crazy
184 - Boyd - Junior ranked top 10?
197 - Someone currently on team or incoming freshman
HWT - Marsden - Senior ranked top 5
 
125 Klimara Yes he would start in the top 5
133 Harding I would think top 15 ( improved as the year went on).
141 Heil Could start out first.
149 Collica Could be in top 10
157 Blees He needs to jump levels. Sad if 1 of our older wrestlers have to wrestle here.
165 Dieringer 1st
174Crutchmer Starts 1st
184 Boyd Top 15 Really wish we had a young wrestler take over here.
197 Weigel really a question mark. Hopefully he really is improving a lot.
HWT Marsden Top 10. His lack of development is sad.

I am wondering if Marsteller is more comfortable wrestling and in Stillwater that he couldn't take 57. If not he won't be wrestling probably. Also if Heil focuses on getting bigger and stronger instead of cutting to 33 this should be good for him. Also saw in the Midwest all star deal Smith and Boo won and Brock got beat pretty good. I hope the guy he wrestled was way bigger than him.
 
Originally posted by Harleycowboy:

125 Klimara Yes he would start in the top 5
133 Harding I would think top 15 ( improved as the year went on).
141 Heil Could start out first.
149 Collica Could be in top 10
157 Blees He needs to jump levels. Sad if 1 of our older wrestlers have to wrestle here.
165 Dieringer 1st
174Crutchmer Starts 1st
184 Boyd Top 15 Really wish we had a young wrestler take over here.
197 Weigel really a question mark. Hopefully he really is improving a lot.
HWT Marsden Top 10. His lack of development is sad.

I am wondering if Marsteller is more comfortable wrestling and in Stillwater that he couldn't take 57. If not he won't be wrestling probably. Also if Heil focuses on getting bigger and stronger instead of cutting to 33 this should be good for him. Also saw in the Midwest all star deal Smith and Boo won and Brock got beat pretty good. I hope the guy he wrestled was way bigger than him.
Harley, the guy who beat Brock was #10 at 145 so Brock was giving up a few pounds.
 
Marsden didn't wrestle to seed but he was fourth and there are several seniors. He will be in the top 5.

Brock is ranked number 1 at 132 and the kid he wrestled was ranked at 138 although I thought I read he wrestled at 145. Apparently both weighed in at 139.
 
My way too early contribution doesn't have enough consideration for redshirts and injuries, but I am sharing anyway.

125-Eddie-I see him being ranked 6 or 7 behind Megaludis, Thomasello, Garrett, Dance, Gilman, Moisey, and maybe Peters (who had a terrible draw in the bracket).
133 GWH 15-20 is reasonable to believe. He was unseeded which means he was expected to go 0-2 or 1-2 but he one twice in this tournament.
141-Heil beat four underclassmen that were ranked ahead of him (by Flo) in the tournament. Lost to Mecate but still placed higher than him. Anywhere from #2 to #6 is possible. All will be behind Retherford.
149-Ranked 8-12 with a higher placement at next years tournament a reasonable expectation.
157-Unranked to start. Hoping Marsteller can make it, but he sounds like he was not the same wrestler when making the cut early this year.
165-#1
174-Top 5 for sure. I would think he might be behind Epperly. They both beat Butler and lost to Storley. Epperly had the better resume going into the tournament but lost at different spots in the bracket to place lower than Crutchmer.
184-Ranked 12-15
197-Unranked to start but it sounds like Wiegel is expected to start
285-Has to be ranked behind Medberry and Walz to come in at #5. I think he is definitely better than those two, but he didn't show it this week. My opinion is the best two hours of wrestling a fan could ever watch is the All-American round on Friday at the NCAA tournament. Some wrestlers usually give more than they ever have to be an All-American. It has to be disappointing to lose in that round by a stalling point.
 
Here is my take on next years lineup.

125 - Klimara or Piccinni (FR)
133 - GWH or Kaid Brock (FR)
141 - Heil
149 - Collica
157 - Marstellar (RS FR)
165 - Dieringer
174 - Crutchmer
184 - Boyd or Dieringer (FR)
197 - Schafer or Dieringer (FR)
HWT - Marsden
 
Originally posted by Orangebomber:
Why? Crutchmer may be the number 1 ranked wrestler at that weight.
Because he wants to? Because he doesn't want to cut the weight as much? There are any number of reasons. It may not happen, but I don't believe it is a given he stays at 165.
 
I think Marstellar has got to get inserted in the lineup. He is far too good of a wrestler not to. I think the combo of cutting a lot of weight, recovering from injuries and just being a true freshman were hard on him early in the season but he started to gain that dominant form toward the end of the year. I don't know if he can make 157 and have enough energy or not. If not what about inserting him at 165 and bumping Dieringer up to 174, Crutchmer to 184 and letting Boyd and Weigel battle it out at 197? I believe Marsteller would be a high All American at 165 next year if healthy. Might consider leaving Crutchmer at 174 and bumping Dieringer to 184 even. Also how to you guys think Kaid Brock would do against Gary Wayne Harding? Also has anyone seen how Weigel is looking in the room at 197?
 
Dieringer competes internationally at 63 if I'm not mistaken? He won't bump unless it's beneficial to his Olympic aspirations.
 
Here is a list of team rosters, including incoming recruits. http://www.wrestlestats.com/Team/EligibilityBreakdown/57/oklahoma-state
 
One question would be is would Dieringer get as many bonus points if he moved up, I mean he just this year moved up from 157 to 165 so he would probably be small at 174 and certainly at 184.

One idea at a 2016 lineup

125- Klimara
133-Harding, have K.Brock and Nick P compete for spot.
141-Heil
149-Collica if he can make 149 ad be effective
157-Smith-seeing his results he is a pinning machine.
165-Deiringer or if he takes an Olympic redshirt, Marseteller and C Rogers to compete for the spot.
174-Krutchmer
184- Boyd let J. Rogers compete for spot.
197- Consider Boyd at 197 especially if J. Rogers wins 184 spot.
285-Marsden

This looks like a strong contender for #35
 
i believe kaid and nick p will likely start out at 25. kind of like rupp and morrison did few years back. both would be considered undersized 33 pounders at this point just like harding is right now. with that being said i love whats in the room,.
 
Brock just won the state title at #132. He will start at 133 and maybe move to 141. Picinni has wrestled at #126 and shouldn't have a problem at 125 or 133.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
im sure our recruits have a lot of growing to do before they get to campus. boo leawllen walks around low 50's he's projected 41. i saw boo and kaid together at the brawl and kaid looked 2 sizes smaller than lewallen let alone the guy he was wrestling.(and i'm not talking about height) kaid won state 2 years back to back at 132 because they had another guy that they needed in the line up to create a better dual and state team. kaid is a tweener like harding. i don't know him as well as i know boo but 150+ is stretching it. nick will be good at 25 and push later for 33.
 
According to Intermat Brock's opponent was ranked 10th at 2 weight classes above him. He LOOKED much larger as well.
 
Nicky has said he thinks he's a lifer 125 and his club coach said he doesn't cut much to make 126 right now you could see him at 125 for a while as far as AD goes he had an interview where he was asked if he would end up at 174 next year to which he replied he does get very big and it is a possibility but they have to see how crutchmer does this weekend this was of course before day 2
 
Looked at some more of Brock's matches and compared his size to his opponents - just by looking at him he does appear to be a 125lber in College. Any chance he or Piccinini wrestles 125 next year and Klimara goes up to 133?
 
Kilmara has no trouble making 125. I think his success this year is partly because he has grown into a 125 pounder. As I recall he was under weight on Wednesday before the tournament in OKC in 2014. He always did well in the morning sessions and was just out horsed in the evening sessions. I think Kilmara should wrestle at 125 next year and let Piccinini redshirt.

I think the better wrestler at 133 should go and let Brock get plenty of open tournaments before the January grind. It really seemed like Harding was wrestling much better at the tournament this year than during the season. Rumor has it that Jordan Rogers is very competitive at 174. Not sure if there is a chance for some serious weight training and a move up for he and Boyd. I do not recall who is back at 184 other than the champion Gabe Dean, but Boyd is capable.

What a grind this tournament is and you have to show up for every match, because if you are not 100% anybody there can beat you. Everybody is dinged up some or just downright injured. As I recall there were 6 guys that made it to Saturdays consolation rounds that lost in the first round. Most were seeded.
 
From what I have seen this year(contrary to what you "insiders" have expressed) Nolan Boyd is still the same wrestler he was last year and will be no help at nationals. The same can be said for Marsden as he totaled 1 half shot in his last 2 matches at nationals and for the life of me I can not figure out how he expects to win a match without taking a shot. Any time he wrestles one of the top 10 types he goes into a shell and either takes 1 shot or no shots in the match. GWH wrestled his butt off but he is simply too small at 133 to compete with the bigger 33 pounders so maybe he can put on some muscle and be ready to compete next year, only time will tell.
Our results at nationals were both good and bad as Eddie did about what he was expected to do as did GWH and Heil wrestled hard and competed, sad about Kindig and Collica is just not a 57 pounder although he wrestled hard and has improved he is simply not big enough for 157. Dieringer was awesome but seemed to gas at the end of the championship match or may have just not been feeling up to his normal self but he was still heads above the field, Crutchmer was a beast and got hosed in the match to wrestle for third but would have probably lost and placed 4th but you never know. Boyd has no chance to help until he learns some defense and better positioning and obviously we have nothing at 197 plus until Marsden gains some confidence and understands no matter who you are wrestling you must take multiple shots or make offensive moves he is never going to live up to his potential.
 
Originally posted by CB4OSUWrestling:
From what I have seen this year(contrary to what you "insiders" have expressed) Nolan Boyd is still the same wrestler he was last year and will be no help at nationals. The same can be said for Marsden as he totaled 1 half shot in his last 2 matches at nationals and for the life of me I can not figure out how he expects to win a match without taking a shot. Any time he wrestles one of the top 10 types he goes into a shell and either takes 1 shot or no shots in the match. GWH wrestled his butt off but he is simply too small at 133 to compete with the bigger 33 pounders so maybe he can put on some muscle and be ready to compete next year, only time will tell.
Our results at nationals were both good and bad as Eddie did about what he was expected to do as did GWH and Heil wrestled hard and competed, sad about Kindig and Collica is just not a 57 pounder although he wrestled hard and has improved he is simply not big enough for 157. Dieringer was awesome but seemed to gas at the end of the championship match or may have just not been feeling up to his normal self but he was still heads above the field, Crutchmer was a beast and got hosed in the match to wrestle for third but would have probably lost and placed 4th but you never know. Boyd has no chance to help until he learns some defense and better positioning and obviously we have nothing at 197 plus until Marsden gains some confidence and understands no matter who you are wrestling you must take multiple shots or make offensive moves he is never going to live up to his potential.
Harley, someone's coming for your most pessimistic crown.
 
From what I have seen this year(contrary to what you "insiders" have expressed) Nolan Boyd is still the same wrestler he was last year and will be no help at nationals. The same can be said for Marsden as he totaled 1 half shot in his last 2 matches at nationals and for the life of me I can not figure out how he expects to win a match without taking a shot. Any time he wrestles one of the top 10 types he goes into a shell and either takes 1 shot or no shots in the match. GWH wrestled his butt off but he is simply too small at 133 to compete with the bigger 33 pounders so maybe he can put on some muscle and be ready to compete next year, only time will tell.
Our results at nationals were both good and bad as Eddie did about what he was expected to do as did GWH and Heil wrestled hard and competed, sad about Kindig and Collica is just not a 57 pounder although he wrestled hard and has improved he is simply not big enough for 157. Dieringer was awesome but seemed to gas at the end of the championship match or may have just not been feeling up to his normal self but he was still heads above the field, Crutchmer was a beast and got hosed in the match to wrestle for third but would have probably lost and placed 4th but you never know. Boyd has no chance to help until he learns some defense and better positioning and obviously we have nothing at 197 plus until Marsden gains some confidence and understands no matter who you are wrestling you must take multiple shots or make offensive moves he is never going to live up to his potential.


Positive post from the "outsider". Life must suck for you.
 
I think it could be interesting next year.

125 - Eddie
133 - I don't know if gwh will ever be big enough at 33. Now he can grow and of course add muscle, but he seems so short. Could he redshirt and step in at 25, after Eddie graduates? Hone, magaldo both redshirted. Will one be ready? Eli hale?
141- Heil.
149 - collica (John said as much at the post match get together)
157 - I really think Chance can do this. He's thick, but he sure doesn't look near as thick as ringer.
165 - ringer
174 - Crutchmer (might enter as number 1)
184 - can Nolan ever be strong enough. I've wondered about growing him into 97. Could bean cut to 84? Weigle?
197 - bean, weigle, Schafer.
Hvy- Marsden.

Honestly I think we are pretty solid. I see 7-8 AA.

Some things have to sort out, but John himself said we'd be in it to win it next year.

It's way past time for something to fall out way.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by CB4OSUWrestling:
From what I have seen this year(contrary to what you "insiders" have expressed) Nolan Boyd is still the same wrestler he was last year and will be no help at nationals. The same can be said for Marsden as he totaled 1 half shot in his last 2 matches at nationals and for the life of me I can not figure out how he expects to win a match without taking a shot. Any time he wrestles one of the top 10 types he goes into a shell and either takes 1 shot or no shots in the match. GWH wrestled his butt off but he is simply too small at 133 to compete with the bigger 33 pounders so maybe he can put on some muscle and be ready to compete next year, only time will tell.
Our results at nationals were both good and bad as Eddie did about what he was expected to do as did GWH and Heil wrestled hard and competed, sad about Kindig and Collica is just not a 57 pounder although he wrestled hard and has improved he is simply not big enough for 157. Dieringer was awesome but seemed to gas at the end of the championship match or may have just not been feeling up to his normal self but he was still heads above the field, Crutchmer was a beast and got hosed in the match to wrestle for third but would have probably lost and placed 4th but you never know. Boyd has no chance to help until he learns some defense and better positioning and obviously we have nothing at 197 plus until Marsden gains some confidence and understands no matter who you are wrestling you must take multiple shots or make offensive moves he is never going to live up to his potential.
I am not an "insider" and I did not sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night, but here are my thoughts on the points you made.

Nolan is NOT the same wrestler he was last year. He has wrestled much more under control this year and has eliminated many of the "dumb" mistakes he made last year. Yes, he still has room for improvement, but he is better than he was.

Totally agree with you on Marsden. He is a 4th year junior and he should understand what is required by now. The last month or so has been very disappointing.

GWH was supposed to redshirt this year, giving him time to build some muscle and add some weight. He is a tiny 133 pounder, but his heart is a s big as Texas. The kid does not know the meaning of the word "quit", but his lack of size and experience cost him dearly in a couple of matches. He scored some points for us, which is realistically all that could be expected of him.

Eddie met his seeding, which puts him right where we expected. He is small for 125, but his attitude seems to be much better this year.

You are correct that Collica is not a 157 pounder. He is very small for the weight and got manhandled by a couple of guys. However, he was the best option for the weight and wrestling up a weight will, I think, pay off in spades when he drops to 149 next year.

Alex was tentative and seemed to lack some of his normal power and explosiveness. That is most likely due to the injury he received Friday evening. Without the injury, I am positive his finals match would have ended early in a fall or tech fall.

Crutchmer got hosed, but the silver lining was that he got to beat Evans from Iowa.

Will we be a contender next year? Maybe not, but I think we will be better. I am pretty confident that we will be in the top 3.
 
Marsden does seem to wrestle too conservatively at times, but then he has matches like at the SS where he beat Coon pretty convincingly. He was one OT TD from making the top 6.
I expect good things from Harding in the future, we are going to have some tough lower weights.
Boyd ended up with a tough draw. He lost a close match in concis to the 6 seed who went on to the consi semis. 184 is a very deep weight, any of the top 20 had a legit chance to AA.
 
Dieringer wins by 7 and was never in trouble in the national finals against a known pinner, how y'all find fault is beyond me. It isn't like he won on stalling and locked hands.
 
125 Klimara returns and Piccininni will redshirt. You do not replace an All-American with a true freshman. Nick will be good but not next year.
133 Gary Wayne Harding. Kaid Brock will redshirt.
141 Dean Heil has improved by leaps and bounds and will be a contender next year.
149 Anthony Collica will be at his true weight and will be very good and I believe an All-American
157 Chance Marsteller
165 Alex Dierenger for his 3rd National championship. he was dominant in every match and the rumor that he was injured in his semi-final match turned out to not be true and I can say that because I heard from two impeccable sources. Yes, Jordan cranked on him hard but he did not pull a groin muscle.I agree with Mr. Blonde that he was dominant in every match. He may have been more careful in the finals match but Walsh is a pinner and a little caution was wise. He is not going up next year.
174 Kyle Crutchmer was 5th and is almost impossible to score on. He needs to work on his offense and there is no reason he can not be better next year.
184 Nolan Boyd will be at this weight. He improved this year over last and is probably the hardest worker in the room.He will make great advances next year and he will be very good.
197 Preston Weigel will "probably" be the starter but he has to get better on his feet in the off-season. He is already very good in the top position.
285.Austin did not have a good tournament but he will again be in the top five next year and I believe he will work hard to make up for a poor showing this year. He has all of the tools to be a high All-American. We do need badly to recruit a heavyweight next year as it will be his last year.

I have no idea where CB4 is coming from and sounds like he is pissed that posters on this board express an opinion that does not agree with is so he labels everyone that does so as an "insider". We are all human and just try to express an opinion. We do not read John or Eric's mind and they certainly do not share their opinions with the bulk of us if they share it with anyone. All of the above with the exception of the Dierenger injury is supposition and opinion on my part. The injury information was straight forward and shared by two sources that are very close to Alex. . If that makes me an insider so be it.
CB4 is definitely entitledto his opinion and of course he could be the real "insider" on the board.
This post was edited on 3/23 8:22 AM by oberebo
 
Obe do you think Marsteller will be able to be effective cutting to 157?

Also I wish we already had a heavy weight recruited so he could redshirt and be developing in the room during Marsden's senior year next year. Recruiting guys to replace a senior "during" the senior year of someone is what causes holes in the lineup. You don't want to be forced to start a true freshman. Penn State had Nevil. the top heavyweight in the country developing in redshirt this year during Lawson's senior year. They will plug him in next year and not lose a step at heavy.
 
Cowboy 1989, that is the Million dollar question. I understand that he has overcome much of his freshman doldrums in the room and his recent interview on flo showed that he has gained maturity and he seems very much to be with the program. If this is all true then I think he will make the pull and be successful. Of course the alternative is that he can not or will not make 157 which would doom him to sit on the bench during his redshirt freshman season. There is no other viable spot in the lineup for him due to Alex and why would Alex go up and push out Crutchmer who is a 5th place All-American.
I agree with you that Nevil will be good next year although he struggled during his true freshman year as did Chance. Both are too good for that to happen again.
 
Originally posted by djb914:
One question would be is would Dieringer get as many bonus points if he moved up, I mean he just this year moved up from 157 to 165 so he would probably be small at 174 and certainly at 184.

One idea at a 2016 lineup

125- Klimara
133-Harding, have K.Brock and Nick P compete for spot.
141-Heil
149-Collica if he can make 149 ad be effective
157-Smith-seeing his results he is a pinning machine.
165-Deiringer or if he takes an Olympic redshirt, Marseteller and C Rogers to compete for the spot.
174-Krutchmer
184- Boyd let J. Rogers compete for spot.
197- Consider Boyd at 197 especially if J. Rogers wins 184 spot.
285-Marsden

This looks like a strong contender for #35
Red-shirting a sure fire National champ is not a good way to win a team title. No way to be #1 without Deiringer.
 
Obe I know what you're saying about not pushing out or replacing an AA but I've seen it before with Iowa and I'm almost sure they weren't the only program to do it it's something that makes a team great knowing you have depth like that It's a nice problem to have you put the best team out that you can not saying anyone is going to get pushed out or replaced next year just trying to make a point next year at 125 on top of returning AA Klimara you have my friend Nick Piccinini and senior Austin Miller who I think can be very competitive and would be a national qualifier again if he did not have Eddie infront of him you also have an AA in Dean Heil and a very talented wrestler in Mike Magaldo at 141 then you have the guys at 165 I just don't think it should matter if someone is AA or AA talent if you have a guy that's better or you believe they can post better results why not go with them like I said its a nice problem to have

This post was edited on 3/23 1:31 PM by NYWRESTLER94
 
What about Olympic redshirts for anybody? Dieringer, Marstellar, Blees or either of the Rogers specifically. Can the Rogers go up over Crutchmer to find a spot? What is the word or outlook on this years redshirts?
 
In order to take an Olympic redshirt the wrestler must meet certain criteria. The only one that can for sure meet that criteria is AD. CM could possibly make it, that is based on potential, haven't seen enough to know. I doubt either rogers or Blees could meet the criteria.
 
Here is the critieria for olympic redshirt. Looks like Dieringer is the only one qualified for it right now.








1) Past National Team members (Top 3 from the World or



Olympic Team Trials)



2) Top 8 at the 2015 Senior World Team Trials



3) Top 3 at the 2015 NCAA Wrestling Championship or NCAA



Champion from a previous year AND top 2 from the 2015



University National Championships (must accomplish both)



4) Previous Junior or University World Medalist

This post was edited on 3/23 2:34 PM by proud2bpokes

This post was edited on 3/23 2:36 PM by proud2bpokes
 
Originally posted by NYWRESTLER94:
Obe I know what you're saying about not pushing out or replacing an AA but I've seen it before with Iowa and I'm almost sure they weren't the only program to do it it's something that makes a team great knowing you have depth like that It's a nice problem to have you put the best team out that you can not saying anyone is going to get pushed out or replaced next year just trying to make a point next year at 125 on top of returning AA Klimara you have my friend Nick Piccinini and senior Austin Miller who I think can be very competitive and would be a national qualifier again if he did not have Eddie infront of him you also have an AA in Dean Heil and a very talented wrestler in Mike Magaldo at 141 then you have the guys at 165 I just don't think it should matter if someone is AA or AA talent if you have a guy that's better or you believe they can post better results why not go with them like I said its a nice problem to have

This post was edited on 3/23 1:31 PM by NYWRESTLER94
Don't mean to answer for Obe but those were his predictions. I am sure John and Obe both want the strongest lineup and if one of the incoming freshman are better than the returning starter they will get in the lineup. You would think most incoming freshman would not be better than a senior ranked in the top ten.
 
NYwrestler, Orange Bomber took the words out of my mouth.I know you are high on Nick and rightly so but most true freshman can not come in and start and you can put people like Marsteller who was the #1 recruit in the country and Pat Smith a four time national champion in that category. :pat did wrestle his true freshman year but he was getting his butt kicked early on in the season and Marsteller was really not close to starting. I think Nick would be in that boat. He may have a lot more upside than Eddie but I seriously doubt he could beat him out next year. Eddie was a high recruit when he came in also. There is also the fact that John is not going to let them wrestle as freshman if they are just nominally better. He had no options with Gary Wayne as the younger Kindig just could not win at that weight. One of my all time favorite wrestlers back in day was Bill Harlow but he has indicated in interviews that everyone in room from 167 up was beating up on him when he first came in. Nick looks like he could be a multiple national champion or at least All American but not next year.
 
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